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-   -   Can a bay's face turn black? (http://www.horseforum.com/horse-colors-genetics/can-bays-face-turn-black-142634/)

Wheatermay 11-06-2012 04:10 AM

Can a bay's face turn black?
 
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I have put my gelding buck on here before. I was always curious of whether he was a buckskin. I was told it was possible but the only way to find out is if he had a hair test. I have never sent it out, since it really doesnt matter since he is gelded (obviously never wanted to breed him to begin with). I'm just curious...

Pics dont really show his coloring well... But this fall his coat began to do something new (he is 4yrs old). I noticed his face looked very dark! I started to freak out bc I thought he was loosing the hair along his eyes and nose (something similar to a fly bitten horses face). I freaked out not really understanding how it could happen after a frost! When i got up to him I realized he his hair is coming in chocolate to black around his eyes temple and cheeks. Is that a normal bay thing? I didnt get any pics of it. I forgot...

Here are the best pics I have of his coat. The one is from this spring on top of him. It shows his countershading, that runs all the way to his tail. His points are the same chocolaty black. He has a black mane with highlights, and usually no black on the nose until he sheds out...

Chiilaa 11-06-2012 04:22 AM

I am not seeing anything unusual in the photos, sorry. Oh, and he is definitely bay and not buckskin :-)

Wheatermay 11-06-2012 04:30 AM

I know, I didnt get pics of the darkening of the face. These are of his normal coat... all I was wondering is if it's a different pattern? What is is called? I cant find anything similar online... He has rabicano characteristics too. And is is a specific bay color? Bc bays should have black points. His are ALWAYS chocolate colored... Is he getting bleached? I apologize for the muddy pic, btw, lol...

Wheatermay 11-06-2012 04:30 AM

Btw, Chiilaa, thanks for stopping by! U explain things very well! I am glad u opened my thread!

Chiilaa 11-06-2012 04:34 AM

Essentially bay is restricting the production of black pigment. It restricts it to the points of the horse, but it is no unheard of for it to also affect how "black" the pigment that it still allows is. So dark dark chocolate legs are not uncommon.

Do you have any winter pictures? Looking at these pics and his baby pictures I don't think he is brown, but a winter pic would confirm or deny it :-)

Wheatermay 11-06-2012 04:44 AM

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Nope he isnt brown :)... he's pretty red, lol... I'm sorry this picture is so old!!! I have so many pictures and I havent tagged any of them!!! I had a hard time finding this!!! His face is actually a little dark there... That dark area on his forehead is darker and expanding, lol... But he's like 9 months here, lol..

Wheatermay 11-06-2012 05:02 AM

At least I dont think so. Ur the color expert here, lol...

Chiilaa 11-06-2012 05:49 AM

It's coming into winter there correct?

Brown and bay are both mutations of the same gene, so they do very similar things. They both restrict black to the points of the horse, just in different ways. Bay keeps black on the points as much as possible, leaving it off the main body of the horse. The body remains a very even tone all through the year. Brown restricts the black differently - it keeps it on the points, but mostly it keeps it OFF the soft points (flank, muzzle, inside the elbow, inside the hinds etc). Brown tends to have very variable colour season to season, with generally a visible change from winter to summer. It is often in the horse's winter coat that you can see the difference in the two.

Wheatermay 11-06-2012 05:54 AM

no that's very early spring... the day he was gelded.

Wheatermay 11-06-2012 05:56 AM

I'm having a hard time visualizing the difference, but my MIL hastwo browns. The are ALOT darker than him. So I'm still saying bay... right?


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