One of my friends posted this on FB yesterday and I did watch it.
Some of their "evidence" could make you question things, but I do find it very very VERY difficult to believe that the government/whoever would go to these extreme lengths to change gun laws. Maybe I'm missing something here, maybe my mindset is wrong - but this event broke hearts of people around the world. with the CO shooting not too long ago, they didnt need to "make this event" - they had something they could already work with.
As for the "2nd gunman" - I think that's something that a child and one bystander could get very wrong. If the police saw a man standing around they would automatically assume the worst.
The video makes numerous comments about the way the parents are acting. I didnt see the actual videos, but I can't find it really that unbelievable that a parent would still find the ability to smile if they were remembering a good time with that child.
Conspiracy theorists are out to prove something, and IMO will tweak whatever information they can to prove their point.
I really hope that I'm not wrong, as so much of the world felt drawn to this tragedy. It has affected so many people in so many ways, and i know that after it happened I felt a stronger need to keep my kids safe.
I could be mistaken, but I was under the impression that it is one of the reasons the conspiracy theorists are running with?
After the inital event, we didn't get much coverage here and I had to take to trying to watch some coverage on FOX on some random high channel on the telly that I wasn't aware I had... so I'll have missed a lot of the coverage that you obviously would have viewed back in the Sates.
well if they could or would do something like that I am sure they wouldnt have any qualms killing someone that tries to blow the whistle. Kennedy and the Clintons sure didnt.
The same idea came out after the Port Arthur shooting in Australia - this was the catalyst for our gun law changes. There are the conspiracy theorists who are certain it was a government act to force gun laws change through with public support.
Instead of all you armchair conspiracy theorists sitting about jacking your jaws, why don't you contact some of the parents who LOST THEIR CHILDREN? I'm sure they'd have some choice words for all of you, and be able to set the record straight.
Or are you like the moronic 9/11 conspiracy theorists, who even after eyewitness testimonials that refuted their crackpot theories, still continue to believe their idiotic 'conspiracies'?
I have a few choice words for people like you as well, but I'd be banned from this forum if I told you exactly how I felt.
I'm your last paragraph I hope by "you" you mean the people that made this video? I put it up to be discussed and out of curiosity of the public's opinion. I wasn't trying to offend anyone. I just found it interesting. Posted via Mobile Device
It is always good to question things in the light of new evidence.
I have no idea how I would react if any of my family were part of a tragedy like that, I don't believe that there is a script for that in my head anywhere.
I know though that any event with many participants, bystanders and witnesses will produce more than one version of events.
I agree with GH. So many people involved, so many faulty memories. Such a tragic and stressful event cannot be remembered perfectly in every detail, too much sensory input and emotional trauma.
I guess I wouldn't be surprised either way. There is evil in this world that we do not know of, nor can conceive in our innocence. I can see how people are trying to find a "reason" for such a senseless act of violence.
I am in NO WAY a conspiracy theorist.
But if you understand the premiss of the movie, the families involved, and the way both (I don't even have a word for them) were raised, then I can clearly see a direct correlation. Most of the things being "pointed out" are junk.
How the media and now the President/Admin is taking advantage of the situation gives me far more worry.
I feel so so terribly sad for them and their children.
I cannot believe, in any way , shape or form, that our government was involved in a plot to use this as a way to create grounds for stricter gun controls.
Why look for greater evil than what was already there? Just because it is incomprehensible that a young man would simply go off and kill innocents like that does not mean that it didn't happen, and just in that incomprehensible way. Bad things happen, and there isn't always a "reason" or a "profit" behind them, much less a conspiracy.
1 - As a general rule, never use a conspiracy to explain something that can be explained by stupidity or gross incompetence, particularly on the part of government.
2 - Fast & Furious may well have been an attempt to change gun laws. But Rule #1 might apply. :shock: :evil:
I sat through this video the other night, and was miffed, so I did some digging myself.
Well initially when he was going on and on about there being no ambulances there, I was cursing at the screen. In his own footage in that very video, you can see at least 3 of them.
Alex Jones (the gun nut of Piers Morgan interview fame) is behind this.
It's a terrible shame that the anti-gun nuts are putting the families through this for their own agenda.
The folks who denied it happened are right up there in looniness with the 911 truthers, or those who believe we invaded Iraq to get free oil. However, the anti-gun rights folks are undoubtedly exploiting this event to push unreasoned gun control thru before people can think about actual causes & possible solutions.
However, the anti-gun rights folks are undoubtedly exploiting this event to push unreasoned gun control thru before people can think about actual causes & possible solutions.
I have seen lots of arguments from the polar opposites on this one, from those who think that every gun is evil and guns should be abolished, to those who believe that the only answer is more guns and bigger guns, both sides appear to be exploiting the event to get their side heard.
There has been a huge increase in the sale of guns and ammo, and now one state as introduced sweeping new laws, all maybe gut reactions.
What solution does the moderate middle look for I wonder.
I believe that. Especially since they "have the public on their side"... Especially when certain Democratic leaders have been shouting to get this through asap. When the hypocritical movie stars are spitting out PSA's when we all know they made their millions off of "shoot em up" films, some that created heros out of villains and demonized the police/military. Never let a crisis go to waste..
As far as the conspiracy stuff? My brain also doesn't work that way, but some of the "connections" are shocking. Not in the way that the theorists are portraying it exactly, but "Sandy Hook" was on the Batman map. There has also been speculation on how the Newtown (?) shooter was related to the stunt man (I think) was killed during the movie, Uncle (I think)?
Again, the scariest thing is we are raising kids that are capable of these types of heinous acts. Impressionable wackos influenced by violent movies and games, and no one is holding their parents responsible...
Do I like thinking our government could do something like this? No.
Do I think they would refrain from it if it suited them? Sadly, that answer is also no.
You don't have to go far into our history to see the things the government has done. The Tuskegee experiments, for instance. The use of our soldiers as guinea pigs for LSD for another...the list is endless, starting with the measles/smallpox laced blankets that were given as gifts to Indians.
Looking worldwide, Mao's Cultural Revolution, Pol Pot and the killing fields of Cambodia, Hitler's Solutions to Jews, and others...all would have been beyond thought, yet all occurred.
Sadly. I think our "leaders" are no more to be trusted now, than they ever have been. Power corrupts. Absolute power destroys.
Since the large majority of rifles are not "assault rifles", it looks to me like a total ban of all assault rifles wouldn't have much impact on the number of murders. Nor are rifles the easiest way to walk thru a "No Gun Zone" like schools killing people. Handguns would be easier to conceal until the last moment, and you can carry a lot of them. Nor will banning large capacity magazines help, since large capacity magazines are more likely to jam - as one did in Colorado.
Yet what are the politicians focusing on? Banning assault weapons (aka 'scary looking rifles') and banning high capacity magazines. Or expanding the "gun free zones", which would be better described as places where only criminals and lunatics have access to guns.
Nor are pro-gun "nuts" exploiting this event. Gun owners only got involved after many calls for gun bans and gun registration and restrictions on carrying concealed weapons were proposed. The NRA refused to make any comment other than one of sympathy until after the politicians started talking about gun bans.
It seems to me there are two pretty common threads in these mass shootings: nuts who cannot be committed or registered as mentally dangerous, and gun free zones.
Oh...and it takes almost no training to shoot a gun from close range at unarmed people. Skill only comes in when the victim has the chance to fight back...
I sought mental health treatment for a very mentally ill foster kid. He was just given meds and not a diagnosis because he was under 18, they won't attach severe diagnosis to minors.
Once he is an adult, it will then be his choice to seek treatment, unless he offers to hurt himself or others.
So basically, the profession was telling me to just wait until he does something bad, then help would be available.
We live 25 miles from Sandy Hook. We have friends that live there and in Newtown. A daughter of one of our friends was teaching at this school until not long before the shooting. We know people who knew the shooters mother and saw the boy around the area.
I have it first hand that the whole scene was total mayhem with armed troopers, first responders, ambulances etc - they threw everything they had at it.
There is no evidence that she had to told him she was having him put away or that she intended to have him put away. The only thing she was guilty of was loving her son too much to see the depth of his problems and being negligent in allowing him free access to so many guns
The father was never absent in the sense that he had disapeared and abandoned them , he had remarried but had never rejected his son - it was the boy who didn't deal well with the divorce and chose not to spend time with his father. He had handed over the home and a considerable income to his wife - they were affluent people
Spewing out stupid conspiracy theories like this to try to discredit people who are calling for better gun controls is totally counter-productive as its so insane that it should lead to the person responsible having their gun licence revoked on the grounds that he clearly has some form of mental problems himself and his action and that of anyone who would support it is just going to hurt responsible gun owners.
Anyone want to explain how this would help prevent someone from murdering their mother and then going out and shooting people in a gun free zone? Or prevent a repeat of the Colorado shooting, or the shooting of someone like Gabby Giffords?
Let alone reduce the 12,000 murders each year (with under 400 from rifles)?
But no, they aren't exploiting the Newtown shooting...
And this is society allows us to use tragic events and twist them for sick entertainment, much like 9/11.
Guns had nothing to do with this; humans did.
For anyone to use this as an excuse or entertainment value I find HIGHLY dispicable.
Honestly in the case of young people going to schools and shooting them up I think there are two things that are to blame the most. One is the parents where is the parental guidance and control? I would of never made it outside the house with a gun or multiple even. Also my parents knew where I was and what I was doing at all times. Nobody watches there kids anymore. It also is poor parenting to leave guns where they are easily accessed especially when guns safes are so easily available for less the the cost of purchasing many guns.
The second cause of school shootings or other public shooting is the sensationalist media giving them so much attention. To me this only inspires more would be shooters to act out because of all the attention they will get from the media where they will forever live in infamy.
Blaming violent movies and video games to me is like blaming rock and roll for devil worship. I listen to rock and I've played violent video games but that doesn't mean I want to go kill people or even consider killing anyone.
As far as the conspiracy theories and all the misinformation I blame that on the media trying to keep viewers watching and ratings up. I mean why not feed misinformation they get their ratings and they can always retract it later and blame the fake info on a scapegoat of some sort. Look at this discussion here the media has done its job putting fear to the masses!
Here's the numbers for murder in Chicago IL in 2011 - a city and state that has strict gun control laws:
Out of 433 murders, 1 involved a rifle. The report doesn't say if that particular rifle was an "assault rifle". That is the same number as were killed by a pry bar...
^^ Susan, when person is in a grief you'll notice that. Always. Doesn't matter if he/she tries to laugh or smile pretending everything is OK... (I'm not referring to the video in any way, which (IMO) was a waste of time to watch, just saying in general).
While I appreciate what you're saying and every member of the forum has value I cant help but struggle with the idea that someone who found this conspiracy theory as awful and insulting as I do would even want to draw attention too it.
I dont know anything about the original author of it but how crazy are they to imagine that Sandy Hook?Newtown are in some remote isolated place where no one else lives so wouldn't be aware of what is going on?
Granted its not like living in a large city but its hardly comparable to the Sahara Desert. Look it up on Google Maps - its a pretty typical CT town with a close knit community where everyone pretty much knows of everyone else. If this happened in the town I live in - which is very comparable - everyone for a pretty big radius would know about it in minutes
You are right... And I did take it too lightly personally, and for that I am sorry. But I'm super off topic now. If there is even a topic left. Posted via Mobile Device
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