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4horses 03-30-2013 10:52 PM

Saddlebred show horses/ Walkers
 
Okay this is my vent for the day.

Why do people think it is okay to put huge pads on a horse's hooves? I've talking about SOME of the Saddlebred show people who seem to think it is okay to have extremely long toes, crushed under/under developed heels, heavy shoes with a pad... Don't get me started in the TWH issues. Now I personally love a TWH that is barefoot and can gait all day long, but what they do in the show ring is just disgusting!

And what is with the tail sets? How is it natural to keep a horse stalled 24/7 with something holding his tail up? How is that even comfortable for the horse? Maybe it doesn't rub the horse bloody but still doesn't look like a very happy horse to me! Plus the surgical altering of the horses tail? I just keep asking myself WHY WOULD SOMEONE WANT TO DO THAT?

And what is with the stretchers? For those who don't know what stretchies look like:
Winner's Circle Horse Supplies, Saddlebred and Gaited Horse Specialists - Training Shackles (Stretchies) Complete Set

I really wish they would just put a ban in place- no more surgical alterations of the horses tail in any new foals, and get rid of the pads and go either barefoot or in regular shoes... We should no longer be living in the dark ages. Especially when there is more and more proof that the pads are harmful to the horses hoof structure/function. There is no need to do cosmetic surgery on a horse that naturally has a beautiful tail to begin with...

I'm talking about hooves that look like this or worse:
Google Image Result for http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r187/BSHorseshoeing/6297805145_ORIG.jpg

LadyDreamer 03-31-2013 01:57 AM

Do you actually want to know the whys or is this going to be yet another saddlebred bashing thread?

Firstly, and the only thing I am going to say tonight on the subject, with it being 2 am and all. Saddlebreds and TWHs are not the same thing. Everything is completely different between the two, fron training to showing. We Saddlebred folks separated ourselves from the TWHs many many years ago mostly because we do not wish to be associated with that nonsense. We are still under the governance of the USEF, and all play by their rules. Those that do not follow those rules are punished heartily for it. The only rule we all knowing and willingly break is the peppermint rule. Saddlebreds thrive on peppermints.

Tomorrow I will explain other things in greater detail, if you are actually wanting to know why.
Posted via Mobile Device

Joe4d 03-31-2013 06:20 AM

Its not ok, its abusive and disgusting anyway you slice it, or anything you call it. Saddleseat people put the same stacks on, wrap the same chains, do the same soring nonsense, but pretend they arnt for some reason.

Allison Finch 03-31-2013 10:33 AM

Actually, Joe, the shoeing is totally different. While I don't appreciate either very much, the TWH stacks are simply horrible. Saddlehorse shoeing is, mostly, just overly long. Still not the healthiest, but not cruel as in the TWH world.

Saddlehorse shoes (as pictured above)

http://i144.photobucket.com/albums/r...05145_ORIG.jpg


TWH stacks

http://media.timesfreepress.com/img/...01a0fde643f8b3

http://www.hsvma.org/assets/images/t...hy_265x184.jpg

Why TWH stacks are allowed in this day and age totally baffles me. It is abuse, pure and simple, IMO.
If you can't see the huge difference, well........

Palomine 03-31-2013 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe4d (Post 2080730)
Its not ok, its abusive and disgusting anyway you slice it, or anything you call it. Saddleseat people put the same stacks on, wrap the same chains, do the same soring nonsense, but pretend they arnt for some reason.

Well, it's obvious you know nothing about Saddlebreds in the Saddlebred world from this post.

American Saddlebreds as shown and trained BY REAL Saddlebred trainers, do not wear same stacks, they do not use the same chains and they do NOT sore.

A Saddlebred MUST trot and a trotting horse will not trot square if it is being sored or lame in ANY WAY.

And the old adage of "the good ones go light" still holds true. I put WC 5 Gaited Saddlebreds in the ring with a KEG SHOE and the same foot as a QH would have.

Saddlebreds carry a longer toe and may have thin leather pads too, but they do not have the stacks associated with the Big Lick horses, and never have had.

And the Big Licks are SHOWN in the ring with log chain links on, as well as trained with them.

Saddlebred's may or may not be trained with action devices, depending on what day it is in their training regimen. And those can be the cheap plastic links that people buy for hanging flower pots on the porch, to ones of light chain with leather buckles. Those can be bought in 2oz up to 6 oz. Winner's Circle Horse Supplies, Saddlebred and Gaited Horse Specialists - Round Link Action Chains

The bracelets are also used, Winner's Circle Horse Supplies, Saddlebred and Gaited Horse Specialists - Leather Ankle Rings 3 oz each.

They are NOT shown in them, ever.

The stretchers are resistance devices. They are fleece lined bracelets that have surgical tubing, that provide resistance to strengthen legs. They break very easily, and are not tight, but made long enough for only small resistance to be applied.

5 Gaited and Fine Harness horses are shown in either trotting boots, or quarter boots as they overreach. Sometimes they are hinged, where they move slightly.

And not all Saddlebreds have had anything done to their tails, and definitely NOT done when they are foals. The tail is lifted by use of bustle, which SLOWLY is used to let muscles relax so tail can be put in set.

Winner's Circle Horse Supplies, Saddlebred and Gaited Horse Specialists - Tail Set Bustle

Most of them will not have to have anything done to their tails for that matter.

Tail sets which are kept on to protect tail as well as keep it up for horses which show in those divisions, also keep the tail itself from being damaged. Some of the tails are over 25 feet long. Great care is taken when using a tail set. Layers of cotton batting are placed over the crupper, tail is carefully arranged so that no hair is underneath, feathers are smoothed, and then dock wrapped, net placed over that, and then tail bag, or sheeting is brought up, crossed and tied, and blanket pins are used to keep weight of tail from hanging, as bag is pinned to blanket.

These horses in one week, usually get day of play, day of handwalking, day of lunging, day of jogging to cart, day of jogging under saddle, day of heavy work and one day of complete rest.

And action devices will vary, may be on for trotting work under saddle, but will be removed during various gaits. And may use none. It all depends on how horse is moving that day.

When I put horse away after being worked at barn, or at shows? It took me over an hour, from rubbing down with towel, to fingerpicking mane, or using fro comb lightly, to reapplying standing bandages, WHICH had to go on the leg they came from, to making sure there was not ONE HAIR that had any sweat on it, from nose to toes...anywhere.

After their class at show...it took 2 hours or better to put one up.

These horses are much loved, and pampered every day.

I will do next post on the sad fate of Saddlebreds that fall into the hands of what is called "speed racking" people, an offshoot of the Big Lick/Racking horse people....I can't bear to do it on this one.

Palomine 03-31-2013 10:44 AM

Warning.

Any of the real horse people on here will be sickened, so be prepared.







I can't even STAND to hear this guy talk and after viewing these the other day I was physically ILL after it...for hours, as I am right now, and in tears.

THIS is what happens to a horse in "speed racking hands"...

And THIS WAS A NICE HORSE! And he is IN HELL!!!!!

THESE ARE NOT SADDLEBRED PEOPLE!!!!! These are jerks who compete and have NO CLUE as to any type of horsemanship of any kind.

If you can stand to watch, you will see horrific abuses here, and if you search for "speed racking" on youtube, you will find some horses that are merely being ridden at 35+ mph on concrete...over and over...all the way up to this type of abuse.

This is what our beautiful Saddlebreds are being subjected to.

toto 03-31-2013 11:02 AM

I dont see how you can say saddlebred long long long feet aint abuse?

http://1stchoicehorseshoeing.com/ima...e/LONGFOOT.jpg
^SB

Its not a big pad but thats because that heel is as tall as a twh pad-- that in my opinion is way more painful that having padded twh shoes..

http://www.horseforum.com/attachment...09-shoes-1.jpg
^twh

I aint agreeing with any of them-- i think its stupid to have to grow your horses feet out painfully to win a stupid show for the human. Its selfish and cruel. What does the horse win? Not a **** thing! Horses dont care about a stupid trophy or man made money.. whats the point?!

Joe4d 03-31-2013 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Palomine (Post 2081681)
Well, it's obvious you know nothing about Saddlebreds in the Saddlebred world from this post.

American Saddlebreds as shown and trained BY REAL Saddlebred trainers, do not wear same stacks, they do not use the same chains and they do NOT sore.

A Saddlebred MUST trot and a trotting horse will not trot square if it is being sored or lame in ANY WAY.

And the old adage of "the good ones go light" still holds true. I put WC 5 Gaited Saddlebreds in the ring with a KEG SHOE and the same foot as a QH would have.

Saddlebreds carry a longer toe and may have thin leather pads too, but they do not have the stacks associated with the Big Lick horses, and never have had.

And the Big Licks are SHOWN in the ring with log chain links on, as well as trained with them.

Saddlebred's may or may not be trained with action devices, depending on what day it is in their training regimen. And those can be the cheap plastic links that people buy for hanging flower pots on the porch, to ones of light chain with leather buckles. Those can be bought in 2oz up to 6 oz. Winner's Circle Horse Supplies, Saddlebred and Gaited Horse Specialists - Round Link Action Chains

The bracelets are also used, Winner's Circle Horse Supplies, Saddlebred and Gaited Horse Specialists - Leather Ankle Rings 3 oz each.

They are NOT shown in them, ever.

The stretchers are resistance devices. They are fleece lined bracelets that have surgical tubing, that provide resistance to strengthen legs. They break very easily, and are not tight, but made long enough for only small resistance to be applied.

5 Gaited and Fine Harness horses are shown in either trotting boots, or quarter boots as they overreach. Sometimes they are hinged, where they move slightly.

And not all Saddlebreds have had anything done to their tails, and definitely NOT done when they are foals. The tail is lifted by use of bustle, which SLOWLY is used to let muscles relax so tail can be put in set.

Winner's Circle Horse Supplies, Saddlebred and Gaited Horse Specialists - Tail Set Bustle

Most of them will not have to have anything done to their tails for that matter.

Tail sets which are kept on to protect tail as well as keep it up for horses which show in those divisions, also keep the tail itself from being damaged. Some of the tails are over 25 feet long. Great care is taken when using a tail set. Layers of cotton batting are placed over the crupper, tail is carefully arranged so that no hair is underneath, feathers are smoothed, and then dock wrapped, net placed over that, and then tail bag, or sheeting is brought up, crossed and tied, and blanket pins are used to keep weight of tail from hanging, as bag is pinned to blanket.

These horses in one week, usually get day of play, day of handwalking, day of lunging, day of jogging to cart, day of jogging under saddle, day of heavy work and one day of complete rest.

And action devices will vary, may be on for trotting work under saddle, but will be removed during various gaits. And may use none. It all depends on how horse is moving that day.

When I put horse away after being worked at barn, or at shows? It took me over an hour, from rubbing down with towel, to fingerpicking mane, or using fro comb lightly, to reapplying standing bandages, WHICH had to go on the leg they came from, to making sure there was not ONE HAIR that had any sweat on it, from nose to toes...anywhere.

After their class at show...it took 2 hours or better to put one up.

These horses are much loved, and pampered every day.

I will do next post on the sad fate of Saddlebreds that fall into the hands of what is called "speed racking" people, an offshoot of the Big Lick/Racking horse people....I can't bear to do it on this one.

I know enough , been to saddlebreds saddle seat barn, seen the horse pictures on the wall with all the awards and all the garbage on their feet, seen the chains around the pasterns in the stalls.
Sell your lies somewhere else, I'm not buying.

SEAmom 03-31-2013 12:16 PM

Ugh. All I can say is ugh. It's like this "subject" is on repeat. Somehow all saddleseat horses have been lumped into this category of abuse and mistreatment. Not sure why I opened it, but it's beyond old.

Palomine 03-31-2013 12:35 PM

Joe, I've worked this industry.

I know of no barn that put chains on them in stalls, ever.

And I am not trying to sell lies. I know what I am talking about.

Tell me the names of the "saddleseat barns" you have been to. Tell me the trainers of those barns, the circuits they show and the winners they have.

But don't you DARE accuse me of lying.


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