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smrobs 11-21-2008 03:58 AM

Fixing problems caused by "trainers"
 
Has anyone else tried to fix problem horses that came from other people that had delusions that they were trainers? Most of the issues that I come across are running off, head slinging, biting, kicking, pawing, bracing (sp?) against the bit, and of course bucking. Does it frustrate anyone else trying to fix what some person screwed up by saying, "Oh, they'll get over it" and then keep doing what cause the problem to begin with? My favorite is when the owner says "The last trainer said that horse was untrainable." In the last 3 years, I have ridden 4 horses whose owners said that. Just curious to hear other people's experiencies.

free_sprtd 11-21-2008 04:18 AM

WEll......my situation is kinda different, but I know what you mean! I've had my 2 1/2 year old for a year now, and I attempted to use a trainer that apparently trained all different kinds of horses blah blah blah and she boarded at my barn, so that made things easy. Well, now my horse is scared to go into the wash rack (not of water, just the dark corner), scared to go into the second entry of the arena because that's where she had him cross tied and came at him with the clippers and he spun around and almost snapped his neck. Not to mention he's afraid of the clippers! lol so ya......needless to say I have to work those things out, and I know how to do it (i'm not even a trainer!)...just going to take some time.

minihorse927 11-21-2008 04:22 AM

I know that feeling!!! I loved the mare I got one time. The guy said she was nuts and scared of everything...so to fix the problem he beat on her. Yeah, that really fixed it, made her worse. It took me two years of working with that shetland pony and now a little 5 year old girl rides her and they are best buds! I seem to take to everyone elses problem horses and a lot of the people around here have seen me deal with these horses and now I have a waiting list to bring trainers to my barn. I guess it is good for business but I would rather see them not try to train a horse and screw it up then them bringing it to a good trainer in the first place. I love the ones who get angry and hit the horse, I wanna get angry and beat the crap outta them.

Midwest Paint 11-21-2008 04:36 AM

I am generally never too bothered with corrective retraining, but if I had a nusiance issue I don't care for, it's loud cues from previos training. I am a fan of untrained, or properly train to a point, with some I have come across. It is more of a pain to regain confidence from a horse that has had everything expressed loudly when asked, and that is where the motivation comes out of. Kicking I will say is a bit un-nerving or coming from bad ground manners and having been allowed to get away with it. That one bugs me a tad, LOL!

Boy, now you have me thinking:lol:

DarkChylde 11-21-2008 06:23 AM

Oh God, don't get me started!! I have seen so much crap, some from real, unfair abuse from macho buttheads and some from people who don't realise that a horse is not a hamster and try and baby it to death. I have expereinced both extremes, and not sure which one is worse. A scared, distrustful horse or a bratty, spoiled horse. Both are bad.

If the horse didn't come to me comletely green, it seems I had to retrain them for SOME aspect. And I have always said, I would rather start fresh with 20 unbroke horses, than to try and fix one problem or spoiled horse.

Spirithorse 11-21-2008 11:59 AM

Ah yes, I know what you mean. My warmblood was put into dressage training with a well-known trainer in the area (who I now know has a reputation for sending horses back to the owners with major issues like bolting and rearing) and that didn't go well. He came away with confidence issues with the bit (he would suck back behind the vertical), was defensive around his poll from being lunged extensively in draw reins, and would try to bite if you messed with this chest because they would smack him with a whip if he was "bad." Then he was forced to do cross country jumping so he came away with some serious issues with jumps. I mean he couldn't even look at a ground pole when I got him. Stupid idiots.:-x

So when I started working with him he would not ask me questions. He would just do things, not wanting to interact, hating the world.....but then one day he finally got the courage to look at me and ask a question and I turned around and walked away with him following me. And that was that. I proved to him that it's okay to look at me and to interact. We've now worked our way up to having a nice soft feel on the reins while riding and he feels so nice in my hands, no sucking back. He's jumping almost a foot now CONFIDENTLY. It's taken time to build that confidence again, they really had messed him up. But now his expression going over the jump is just fabulous. It's fun for him again and he's not worried that I'm going to smack him. It's been very rewarding watching his progress.

I like the challenge of undoing what people have done. It doesn't frustrate me, it fascinates me. I'm constantly asking myself, "What do I have to do to earn this horse's trust/respect? What does this horse need me to do/be?" I think it would be great to have a horse who had no baggage, but at the same time I would miss the challenge factor. If you don't challenge yourself you won't grow in your knowledge and skills.

smrobs 11-21-2008 03:55 PM

That is true too, Spirit, it can just be so frustrating when you see a horse with so much potential and know that it will take so long to correct and sometimes the horse will never get over the confidence issues. My old bay horse that I ride was the first horse I ever trained completely by myself. He had been so terrorized by the "cowboys" the previous owner got to break him. He had been bucking them off and even hurt one of them pretty bad. They would start to work with him and every time that he would jump or flinch, it would scare them and they would get mad and hit him. I worked with him and got him over most of his issues. He will do anything I ask without so much as twitching an ear but if a man approaches him, he gets excited, jumpy, and wants to just get away. I have not been able to get him over that in 10 years of riding. He also doesn't like to be roped off of. I can do it if I need to but when I swing the rope over his head, he gets scared even after lots and lots of training and desensitizing. I know that he trusts me completely, there are just certain things that cause bouts of post traumatic stress disorder. It is challenging to work with horses like that but I prefer to start fresh with one that has never been handled. That is challenge enough and I don't have to worry about their trust being broken.

aappyfan1 11-21-2008 07:07 PM

Bad Trainers= Untrainable horse....I have such a beast, who was deamed dangerous and wasn't finished. He is nine years old now, and is just about a pasture orniment. I can do anything with him other than ride him. I am getting too old to jump on a unbroke horse anymore, and I would like to do something with him, but can't afford to send him to yet another trainer. Hopefully some day I will start working him in the round pen and just see how far I can get with him.

Summer08 12-11-2008 08:04 PM

This is such a hard topic for me. My first horse, adopted from the Standardbred foundation came off a track farm where 3 horses had been found starved to death in their stalls. I was told he was broke to drive and had had a saddle and bridel on once or twice. We soon found out my father could not come within 50 feet without sending him into a panic, and attempting to hit him to long lines on the ground even sent him in a terrorized dash for the barn.
People do horrible things in the name of training, and some just for the sake of being horrible. The stable I worked at took in a 17.3 hand grey throughbred with a great personality and tattooed lip. He';d been turned over when the sarcoid on his leg broke the surface. It was ugly until we treated it to the size of a quarter. This guy jumped roundbales when bored and when let go on the dirt rode trail was clocked at 35mph. Took his rider 1 1/2 miles to slow him up. He practiced 3rd level dressage moves while running in place waiting to go. Who gives that up? Okay thats not bad training, but an owner that doesn't recognize good training. We picked up a 4 month out colt from registered lines when his stable called and gave us three hours to get him or they'd put him down. He cribbed and they refused to have that in their barn.
It would be great if everyone worked with their horses to the level they understand, and realized that they then needed help, and either found it, or found a better home for the horse. None of these animals deserve to get messed up in the head, even if there are so many great people like everyone on this forum who are willing to take them in and help them get over it.

equineangel91 12-11-2008 11:44 PM

When i got my hrose, I adopted him from the standardbred foundation. Someone else had already adopted him, but he was being taken away because he wasnt being fed, and he was emaciated. He was 12 years old. 16.3 bay standardbred, won over 800k on the track...then cast aside

When i got him, the other owner told me he was ssaddle broken. That he rode western and would go happily english....well...

When i got him and started working with him...he was NOT saddle broken.Keep in mind he is 12!!!! When i put that saddle on he was so confused and frightened it was terrible. I had to start from the beginning. He spooked at everything, was head-shy and was aftraid of other horses.
When he was fed....He bolted his feed so fast, that he choked EVERY SINGLE TIME he ate. IT was terribnle. To this day i still have to feed him grain with a grazing muzzle so that he doesnt choke.

After MY training, He is now broken english, finally learned to canter, jumping 3ft, used to clippers, and the most gentlemanly ground manners. He's a sweatheart and he's finally gotten some weight on him. Takes the bit with ease, actually puts his head down and opens his mouth =P Stands still for tacking up and doesnt do that obnoxious cinchy thing. He's happy with his girth.

It wasnt easy undoing the abuse and "training" that that horse was put through. And after all of this, he's come out wonderful. He's 13 now.

but it was heck trying to undo all of that.... especially at his age! He's the whole reason I've become a horse trainer. So that ppl can say "hey i dont know what im doing I need help" and actually come to someone that isnt going to try to do something they cant and Knows what theyre talking about


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