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-   -   VERY interesting training documentary, including oxygen deprived colt. (http://www.horseforum.com/horse-training/very-interesting-training-documentary-including-oxygen-206810/)

IndiesaurusRex 06-04-2013 07:40 PM

VERY interesting training documentary, including oxygen deprived colt.
 
Caught this on the BBC iPlayer, not sure if it's already been aired in the US or not.

A documentary on Buck Brannaman, no dramatisation or storylines, just documenting him growing up from a child and following him around to his demonstrations.

Thought some of you may be interested in a particular case they document - a three year old stud (stunning horse), oxygen deprived as a newborn and orphaned, and basically never taught respect. In Buck's words "This horse is as close to a predator as you will ever find". He likened it to a disabled child never shown manners or respect. It's running out with 18 other studs ( :shock: ), and currently attacks any person near it - snakes out and bites, rears up and strikes out, all whilst squealing loudly. Shown at about one hour in.

Also, lovely dressage trainer who regularly takes her dressage horses out to herd/rope cows to tune them up - I thought that was ace! :lol:

Anyway, here's the link, if anyone has any questions just shout and I can fill you in or point you to the right section :lol:

BBC iPlayer - Storyville: 2013-2014: Buck: The Real Horse Whisperer

(Also, don't take the title at face value - not really about "Horse Whispering at all :? )

Skyseternalangel 06-04-2013 08:00 PM

Doesn't work for me

IndiesaurusRex 06-04-2013 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyseternalangel (Post 2706994)
Doesn't work for me

Hrmph, maybe it's because you're not in the UK :oops:

Here is a Youtube link to the first part, the suggestions should link you through:


(With Swedish subtitles :lol: )

This is the part with the oxygen deprived stud:


Skyseternalangel 06-04-2013 08:13 PM

Thank you for those links! :)

SorrelHorse 06-04-2013 08:21 PM

It was painful for me to be watching the part with the colt. i have seen it before.

I like some of Buck's stuff, I've used and learned some from him, but that was poorly handled. That horse needed a major a$$ kicking, not desensitizing, and I sure as hell wouldn't of ridden him until he got his respect issues fixed. Dan got attacked by that colt because he pushed him to the saddle pad before he was respectful. I, personally, think that horse could of been helped and not put down. I've seen it happen here at my barn with horses just as aggressive as this one was.

That's just my rant about that part of the video...It made me angry...Some of the other stuff was cool though.

IndiesaurusRex 06-04-2013 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SorrelHorse (Post 2707202)
It was painful for me to be watching the part with the colt. i have seen it before.

I like some of Buck's stuff, I've used and learned some from him, but that was poorly handled. That horse needed a major a$$ kicking, not desensitizing, and I sure as hell wouldn't of ridden him until he got his respect issues fixed. Dan got attacked by that colt because he pushed him to the saddle pad before he was respectful. I, personally, think that horse could of been helped and not put down. I've seen it happen here at my barn with horses just as aggressive as this one was.

That's just my rant about that part of the video...It made me angry...Some of the other stuff was cool though.

I agree with you, perhaps it could very well have been handled differently. Such a gorgeous colt too, such a shame. However, I respect the owners decision in that she felt like she could not handle him, and didn't want to put anyone else in danger, and as she said "Don't want to give him to someone who will just beat him with a piece of 2x4". Many trainers would have handled it differently, that just seems to be his method - get them calm and jump on.

I just thought people may be interested in the documentary, and it might raise some discussion on the topics, as I felt the colt was a very interesting case study into behaviour. One of the most "aggressive" horses I have seen personally.

natisha 06-04-2013 08:34 PM

He was a stud? Wouldn't a prudent person at least try gelding him to see if that modified his behavior?

IndiesaurusRex 06-04-2013 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by natisha (Post 2707298)
He was a stud? Wouldn't a prudent person at least try gelding him to see if that modified his behavior?

The woman "hadn't had time" to geld him - as Buck correctly pointed out, she had no business keeping it as a stud. He was also kept out with 18 other stallions - I can't imagine who in their right mind would think that was a good idea :shock:

smrobs 06-04-2013 09:05 PM

I agree that the second handling of the yellow stud was poorly handled, but you know what they say "Hindsight is 20-20". Well, sight from the armchair is 20-20 too.

I think they could have handled it better and I believe that the guy should have seen the warning signs before he ever got attacked....but I also know how quickly tunnel-vision can catch hold on you in a situation like that, before you even realize.

Frankly, the entire situation with that horse was 100% the owner's fault. She babied the horse and didn't have him gelded. I won't say for certain one way or the other whether having foaling difficulties made him the way he was or not, but she didn't give him any chance at life anyway because she treated him like a puppy.

As for the whole "turning studs out together" thing, many larger ranches will turn larger groups of studs and geldings out together with no issues. It's only when a mare is introduced that real problems start popping up. BUT, this lady had no business with even 1 stud because she clearly didn't know how to properly handle/train them.

rookie 06-04-2013 10:25 PM

I can't judge weather it was handled well or not, because really we saw maybe 5 minutes of what was at least one day maybe two of behavior that did not make the film roll. That said, I think that horse needed to be put to sleep. I don't buy the oxygen deprivation theory. I was a bit upset by that idea because it seemed cushy and very PC. A nice way to say we are killing this horse without looking like the bad guy. Oxygen deprived horses (red bag delivery) more often creates a dummy foal that may or may not live. In which case, the horses often are behaviorally normal and show no deficits after a certain period of time. I think the owner was convinced it was oxygen deprived and spoiled it, I also think that they kept it from horses during its crucial socialization period resulting in a horse with no horse skills and lacking manners.
That horse was a rank, spoilt horse and maybe a bit of a socio-path. In the end, if it was "fixed" it would have gone back to an owner who may or more likely would not have maintained the behavior. It was dangerous, it had hurt the owner a time or two, it had hurt the handlers and in this american horse market there is no need to save these ones in my book. If you want to save them than go for it but its not fair to think that others should. I know that sounds harsh but why waste the time, energy and risk of harm on one horse when there are literally 10 who are just as pretty, just as if not more talented and just as deserving of a chance as this one was without the desire to harm someone.


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