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AKPaintLover 06-29-2007 06:32 PM

Another Foal Color Question
Figuring out foal color can be so confusing, but it is so fun to try to make guesses during the 11 month wait :)

We Bred our chesnut AQHA mare to our Sorrel/White tobiano APHA stallion.

The stallion has a tobiano Dam and an Overo sire. He has produced one very colorful foal when bred with a sabino apha mare. The stallion is not homozygous.

Our mare has produced one foal that was a mirror image of herself when bred to an AQHA stallion, and one very colorful Paint when bred to a non-homozygous stallion. The mare has white socks and a blaze, as well as a tiny bit of roaning on her barrel area.

From my previous research it seemed that a paint vs. qh breeding will create about a 50/50 chance of either, but are there any other factors that change these odds? If the foal is solid, will it likely be chesnut? If the foal is a paint, is there a chance of it being overo rather than tobiano or will it likely take on similar color characteristics to our stallion?

I am curious to hear from you color gurus :)

Dave Singleton 06-29-2007 09:32 PM

Hmm... that is an in-depth question! I don't think I can duck out of this saying 'not enough info'...

I would say that if solid then chestnut is very likely --- I believe chestnut is a dominant allele and as such will probably show through. From the sound of it your mare is probably homozygous chestnut too which increases the likelihood.

As far as overo or tobiano goes --- it very much depends on their dominance which I do not know. However, as your stallion is tobiano this would indicate that this is dominant (presuming homozygous parents) and hence you should be looking at the options of a foal that is chestnut or tobiano.

However, I'm really not sure which one is more dominant of these two as they both seem to be of a dominant type... the balance is probably on one or the other but I'm really not sure.

bubba13 07-01-2007 03:52 PM

Chestnut and sorrel are the same color genetically. Although they are recessive genes, you are 100% guaranteed to get a chestnut/sorrel foal because both parents are this color.

It is possible, though EXTREMELY EXTREMELY unlikely to get an overo foal from this cross if either parent carries the overo gene.

The stallion is a heterozygous tobiano. You have a 50% chance of a tobiano colt and a 50% chance of a solid colt.

So you will end up with either a tobiano or solid chestnut sorrel.

jewleit 07-03-2007 04:55 PM

Chestnut is a recesive gene and the only way it shows is if both sides throw it. Sorrel and Chestnut are actually different shades of the same color or gene so the foal WILL be chestnut or sorrel in color it just depends on the shade. as for paint if the stud is not homozygous you have about a 50/50 on getting a colored baby. What pattern I must admit is beyond me.

AKPaintLover 07-05-2007 08:59 PM

Thanks everyone for the feedback. I thought the odds were 50/50 for paint vs. non, but wasn't sure. It was helpful to learn about the sorrel/chesnut trait as well!

Does anyone know about the genetic cause/effect of roaning if any? How does slight roaning on the barrel factor in to the picture, if at all?

This stuff is all very interesting and confusing :)

RedneckCutie 07-06-2007 12:31 AM

The hole roan thing could be from an horse in her pedigree that was a roan or it could also be a number of factors like age or health, We have one horse that is kind of roan colored in his barrel area and thats becasue his previous owners diddn't take care of him and he loss alot of hair and it came back white plus hes almost as old as dirt lol but the roan shouldn't affect the color genetics any because she isn't a roan the only way to maybe get that affect is if you breed her to a grey or a roan.

bubba13 07-08-2007 02:50 PM

Actually, roaning the the barrel and flank area is called "rabicano" and is affected by a different gene. It is not a sign of age or poor health but is a coat color modifier, speckling any horse who carries the gene with white hairs on the belly and often causing a "coontail."

Gray and roan are unrelated except they are both modifiers, not coat colors. Gray horses are can be born in any color, but the gray gene gradually replaces all of the colored hairs. Similarly, roaning can happen to any colored horse.

Miss Neigh 07-15-2007 10:11 PM

Two deffinate chestnuts bred together will result in a chestnut foal, it may be solid or with paint colouring.

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