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-   -   Chestnut? (confo crit if you want) (http://www.horseforum.com/horse-colors-genetics/chestnut-confo-crit-if-you-want-370194/)

EliRose 02-25-2014 11:33 PM

Chestnut? (confo crit if you want)
 
I might be looking to get this mare and was wondering what color she was. On one sales ad she's listed as buckskin, the others "Unknown". Her sire is definitely a chestnut and on all-breed her dam is listed as a red dun (Jamars Sweet Bo Quarter Horse). Some people on FB were calling her a dun, could she be? Or is she just a super light chestnut? I don't see any leg barring or dorsal stripe. Thoughts?

Also, if anyone wants to critique her confo go right ahead.

https://scontent-b-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/..._3951449_n.jpg

riddlemethis 02-26-2014 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EliRose (Post 4842818)
I might be looking to get this mare and was wondering what color she was. On one sales ad she's listed as buckskin, the others "Unknown". Her sire is definitely a chestnut and on all-breed her dam is listed as a red dun (Jamars Sweet Bo Quarter Horse). Some people on FB were calling her a dun, could she be? Or is she just a super light chestnut? I don't see any leg barring or dorsal stripe. Thoughts?

Also, if anyone wants to critique her confo go right ahead.

https://scontent-b-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/..._3951449_n.jpg

She's from a line of Champagnes, and I would bet that is what she is.

stevenson 02-26-2014 12:34 AM

does she have a dorsal stripe? if so then I would say a shade of red dun.

DraftyAiresMum 02-26-2014 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riddlemethis (Post 4843154)
She's from a line of Champagnes, and I would bet that is what she is.

I see champagne twice on the dam's side, WAY back, and then it disappears as you work your way forward. That's if they were true champagnes since the two horses listed as champagne were alive before genetic testing was available. Not sure how champagne dominance works, but I would think more horses closer up in her pedigree would have to be champagne in order for there to be a chance of her being champagne. (for the record, on allbreedpedigree, "ch" stands for chestnut)

Also, I would be interested to see pics of her sire. It says that her sire's dam was a dun and the dam's sire was a dun, but neither of his parents were duns, so that's not possible. Dun, like roan, is a simple dominant. At least one parent has to have the dun gene for the progeny to be dun and if the dun gene is present, it always expresses. A palomino and a chestnut/sorrel do not a dun make.
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EliRose 02-26-2014 12:52 AM

FWIW, this mare's dam has several other foals, including a palomino by a pally stallion. Which would rule out any sort of cream, right? Or no?
She also has this black paint daughter True Black & White Paint Mare Paint for sale in Eastland76448, Texas :: HorseClicks

Poseidon 02-26-2014 12:55 AM

She looks like a light chestnut or maybe red dun, but I don't really think so.

If everything on Allbreed is correct (which is questionable), her only options are sorrel or red dun.

stevenson 02-26-2014 01:08 AM

I had a yellow dun mare, that was registered as Pali. She had the dorsal stripe, leg barring, and the flax mane and tail. and as Pali colored as can be . But in fact she was a yellow dun.
ch=chestnut sor= sorrell

Poseidon 02-26-2014 01:18 AM

Stevenson - "yellow dun" is Palomino with dun.. It wouldn't be surprising if she was registered as just palomino. You'd have to have it specificially added that "Carries and expresses dun gene" on her papers because they don't put palomino dun as a color.

EliRose 02-26-2014 01:41 AM

Just to throw it out there, is there any possibility that she has pearl? She has Leo waaaay back, and I read somewhere that he may have carried it?

If you couldn't tell, I'm sick and have been pretty bored the past few days LOL. Colors + pedigrees are a blast! Btw, confo critiques are still very much appreciated.

riddlemethis 02-26-2014 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DraftyAiresMum (Post 4843258)
I see champagne twice on the dam's side, WAY back, and then it disappears as you work your way forward. That's if they were true champagnes since the two horses listed as champagne were alive before genetic testing was available. Not sure how champagne dominance works, but I would think more horses closer up in her pedigree would have to be champagne in order for there to be a chance of her being champagne. (for the record, on allbreedpedigree, "ch" stands for chestnut)

Also, I would be interested to see pics of her sire. It says that her sire's dam was a dun and the dam's sire was a dun, but neither of his parents were duns, so that's not possible. Dun, like roan, is a simple dominant. At least one parent has to have the dun gene for the progeny to be dun and if the dun gene is present, it always expresses. A palomino and a chestnut/sorrel do not a dun make.
Posted via Mobile Device

It doesn't disappear as you work your way forward. It gets misidentified, and with champagne that is VERY easy to do.

And yes the champagnes were alive before genetic testing, but they have been proven to be one of the founding lines of champagne. Bar Bob Sandy was registered as palomino, but based on her lineage she can only be Gold Champagne.

Jamars IT, is listed as dun, which he cannot be as it's not carried in either of his lines. So he is most likely some black based champagne that got registered as dun, because they didnt know enough about genetics at that point, let alone champagne to know what he was.

Jamars Sweetheart is listed as red dun, but since Jamars IT isn't dun, she can't be either. But it was probably all AQHA would allow her to be registered as with her breeding, because she obviously wasn't chestnut.

And then we have the OP horse, who is obviously diluted, obviously not dun IMO, and looks very much like a gold champagne, which her lineage supports.


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