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Hates to be Tacked

5K views 21 replies 12 participants last post by  Cadence 
#1 ·
So, I ride this 16.3 hh horse that hates to be put on crossties and just walks in circles in his stall (when I groom him and put on his tack) and tries to bite when I tighten his girth. I would like some advice on how to manage this horse so that he doesn't become dangerous!

Should I always be gentle and make him stand using a lead in one hand while I groom and tack up?

Should I stop him from circling and put him back where I want him each time he moves?

Any advice would be great!

Thanks,

Cadence
 
#2 ·
My horse is a sweetie but he hates getting the girth tightened too. He was a former western horse and at his old barn when he was young, they used to cinch up the girths real tight and leave them there all day.

With this problem, I usually tighten the girth as slowly as possible so that he doesn't get mad and toss his head up as i tighten it.

If your horse stall walks, then you might want to use a leadrope and do a safety knot to something in the stall, or a bar on the door if there is one. Does he walk circles in his stall even when you aren't taking him up?
 
#3 ·
First check out all physical issues.....tack fit, sore back, maybe a chiro needs to come out, and you might want to consider treating him for ulcers. Horses with ulcers will be cinchy, and if he doesn't have ulcers, treating him for it won't hurt him.

If you can rule out all physical issues, then I'd suggest you go back to basic ground work and get him desensitized to movement and the tacking up process. I'd suggest learning the Parelli 7 Games to prepare you for getting him over his issue with tacking up.
 
#4 ·
You need to get some respect from him. Untill you do I wouldn't tack him up in a stall. You have nowhere to go if he decides to kick at you or smash you into the wall. When you groom him stand your ground. If he tries to walk over you stick a currycomb handle in his ribs and if you need to jab him hard and make him move away. He must know that you are as invioble as a brick wall. Don't try to be nice get with it and get it done.
 
#14 ·
I agree. This is another Dink who hasn't learned respect. Can't he be tied solid to something and why not??
We have a girl at our barn with a 9 or 10 year old that she bought as a foul. She shows him but needs a handler to hold the horse all day. She will not tie the horse.. What a pain, at a big show and needing someone to hold him instead of tying him solid to the trailer and enjoying the show.
All horses should be taught to tie.
 
#5 ·
Definitely check him for ulcers. You don't have to have him scoped - just treat him for a few weeks and if there is improvement, you know that's the problem.

Ulcers can make them girthy and resistant to being brushed/pet/etc. along their sides, stomach, chest. He could be walking away because these areas hurt him.
 
#8 · (Edited)
Definitely check him for ulcers. You don't have to have him scoped - just treat him for a few weeks and if there is improvement, you know that's the problem.
I personally would not treat a horse for a condition the horse may or may not have. Not to mention medications for ulcers are not cheap.

I would check through physical issues first as that sort of behavior while tacking always makes me think something physical. In response to your other questions- I agree with Kevinshorses in that you should not allow these behaviors and you need to establish some respect. A horse walking in circles around me drives me nuts. I usually deal with it by aggressively making them move their feet away from me and in the direction that I so choose.

As for where you should tack him- again I agree with Kevinshorses. Don't do it in stall as you'll have nowhere to go. I also think that the stall should not be associated with ground work and schooling. So I would not tack him up in the stall or school him in the stall for safety reasons and also for my owner personal reasons. If he is phobic about cross ties try to find a safe place to straight tie him OR work on the cross tie issue. Tying with a halter is an essential skill to me and, with few exceptions, a horse who is well versed with giving to pressure will not pull, there are always exceptions but generally speaking.

If you feel nervous about working with him you are only going exacerbate the issues. Find someone in your area that would be willing to come out and give you a couple of pointers.
 
#6 ·
Thanks for the quick response!

Lenny is a 13 year old Thoroughbred. He hasn't been ridden much (in a year or so) before I started to ride him a few weeks ago. It appears that this horse had an incident when younger and HATES cross ties as a result.

At first, I would let him walk around me and I would talk to him and try to calm him down. I started to wonder if I was basically saying, "It's ok to give me a hard time about tacking you..."

I have started holding onto his halter to make him stop walking around when I put all the tack on. He calms right down when I put the bridle on. So, maybe I can try starting with the bridle and hold the reins while tacking.

Also, today, I started to move him back to the spot I wanted him in when ever he decides to walk away from me in the stall. He didn't like it and was swishing his tail in irritation. I am hoping this will communicate "No, stand here because that is what I want you to do."

If this horse is treating me with disrespect, would sending him back to where I want him to "stand" a good way to say, "I am in charge?"

If I shouldn't tack him in the stall, what are other safe options?

Would you recommend me working with him in the stall to get him to stand and move when I want him to by pressure/release during times when I am not riding him?

If a horse doesn't like to be cross-tied, would it be safe to try to tie him in halter?

I am curious about the Parelli games that was mentioned. Where do I get access to more information about that? I would love to build this horse up.

He is nervous with me, because I am nervous with him! :) I am green but, willing to learn!

Thanks for your time!

Cadence
 
#16 ·
I won't even tie with a halter. I use a neck rope. I live in amish country and you can go to the market and see dozens of horses tied and every single one, every one is tied with a neck rope.
At church sunday morning there are over one hundred horses standing tied and again every one is with a neck rope.
They must have their reasons for using a neck rope.
I never tie without one.
 
#17 ·
KevinsHorses is absolutely right, whether in pain or not, a horse that has your respect won't push over you. A horse that doesn't is very dangerous. Okay, let's do an example. Johnny rides a pushy horse at the barn, and while the horse keeps pushing over him, Johnny doesn't realize that he is becoming lower and lower on the pecking order until one day when they are out riding, the bit can't constrain the horse any longer and the horse rears and takes of running leaving Johnny on the ground while the horse is visiting with buddies in a near-by pen. Johnny is now upset, but it is not the horse's fault, it's instinct. Someone HAS to be in control. Since Johnny didn't step up and do it, the horse did, and that's what happened.


So, you need to teach the horse that you are in control, and he isn't allowed in your space. In the wild, a horse never invades the Alpha mares space as she will punish them. What that horse needs if ground manners. He is 13, and can't stand still tied? My 2 1/2 year old will stand tied for 30 minutes without fuss and a relaxed foot.

Do you have access to a round pen? I would read up on Round-Pen Reasoning with John Lyons and read about Join-Up from Monty Roberts. If you don't have the space or time, do like Kevin said, make it uncomfortable for him to push you around.
 
#19 ·
Ok, everything that I've ready does have some pretty accurate points. When reading the original post, my immediate thought is that the horse is trying to tell you something, there is something wrong with being ridden. When the horse feels pain, it feels vulnerable, it compromises their ability to "fight or flight", therefore their defensive behavior is going to get stronger and more sensitive. What many people see as a "behavioral problem" is that, but its not just that, that behavioral problem is stemming from defensive behavior. If the human can be an adequate leader, then the horse won't run you over, so this does need to be established. However, I personally don't want to punish my horse from expressing that I'm not doing something right. I have seen many horses behave despite their physical discomfort, and they end up just quietly going lame. I will not let any horse run me over, but I do feel that it is my responsibility to understand why the horse is being so defensive and fix that problem.

If someone sent me this horse and said "fix it", I would attack this problem from all angles. I would start by addressing the feeding program, taking ulcers into consideration. I would then get into behavioral, teaching respect, manners, and social skills putting me in the herd leader position. This is necessary to ensure your safety and the horses security and comfort. I would not get on the horses back without understanding their physical condition. I personally often start with ground work to help them use their bodies correctly, consult body workers, farriers, vets, trainers, anyone who can help me understand what is going on. Something causes defensive behavior, something causes ulcers, you have to figure out the source of the problem before you can truly fix it.

I have been put in positions where someone says "here is my pain in the butt horse, I want you to ride it". It is possible to solve a lot of problems from this angle, but it does take a lot of work to fix the horses body undersaddle. Good luck!
 
#21 ·
My horse snaps when I do up his girth. Its probably because he's old and grumpy, lol, and also because he was a racehorse, and they did the girth up really tight really fast, which actually must hurt! I tighten it up really slowly, to help him. Lately he's become fine, because when he does try to snap, I just pull the right rein lightly so that he cant bite me
 
#22 ·
Ta-daaa!

Hello Everyone,

I tried to find a way to take all of the wonderful advice that was offered here and, from what I was able to try, it worked.

First, I asked the stable manager if she thought that Lenny may have ulcers. She said that she would look into it.

Then, I put his bridle on in the stall and looped the reins over my arm for control. He was a completely different horse. He moved twice and each time I quietly and gently moved him back and said, "Stand". He didn't fuss. The stable manager held the bridle when I cinched him, but he didn't try to walk away, instead he tried to bite the reins.

We went out to the arena. I flopped around with out much control. It was embarassing! I must admit, I am a green rider and all my experience has been on 15 hh horses. I asked my trainer, the manager, to get on and I watched how she rode him. I instantly saw what I was doing incorrectly! My reins were too loose and I needed to bring my legs back behind the girth and really grip.

I had loose reins because I didn't want to pull on his mouth or use the reins to balance him. He loves to bring his head up and then lower it while we trot along. If I gripped he would just go faster. Even a light touch would send this horse forward! So, a typical tour around the arena consisted of me being pitched forward, backward, up and down in the saddle. It was not a pretty sight! I am sure Lenny is also suffering from frustration and soreness too! lol

Just watching my trainer made me realize I needed to grip more and control the speed (to make it nice and even to reduce my movement in the saddle) and have more of his mouth. It was incredible! I stayed balanced he maintained a more collected trot that I could time my posting to! Yahhhh!

This time, however; when I got off to cool him out, he walked very close to me with his head below mine and the side of his face touching my waist and upper thigh. He put his head so close to me that I had trouble walking! lol It was weird. I felt like he was really in my space and kept pushing him away. My manager said that he "liked me". It felt more like he was trying to walk me into the wall. He wasn't pushing on me, just so close that it made it difficult to walk straight. I kept getting closer to the wall. Each time I shooed him away he would come back in with his head really close, touching my body, but not bumping or rubbing.

He used to try to use me as a scratching post or would bump me with his head. I was firm in stopping that after I read that this is a game to say, "I'm in charge." He doesn't do that to me anymore. Today, was a new behavior.

Has anyone ever seen this type of behavior? Is this aggressive? Is it a sign of affection, in his mind? How should I respond to it?

I gripped his reins closer to his mouth to control his head and give us "space". When we got around the arena without any "crowding", I took him back to his stall. He was very quiet, didn't pace, and enjoyed the grooming. I rewarded him with a scratchy-massage on his face and he didn't move until I was done! It was obvious that he loved it! :)

Talk to you soon!

Cadence
 
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