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-   -   Appy, Friesian, Curly Color Questions (http://www.horseforum.com/horse-breeding/appy-friesian-curly-color-questions-40636/)

Appy Luvr 11-15-2009 07:11 PM

Appy, Friesian, Curly Color Questions
 
After reading about peoples 2010 breedings it got me once again dreaming of "someday" when I breed one of my girls. So I thought I'd ask a couple of "what would you get" questions! This is all down the road after my girls are grown up, trained etc and I still haven't decided what I want to do, too many very nice stallions out there.....

Anyway, what color/colors would you possibly get breeding a Buckskin Snowcap Appy filly (out of Buckskin Blanket mom and Bay Fewspot dad) to a homozygous black (Friesian) stallion?
Or breeding same homozygous black (Friesian) stallion to a Bay Near Leopard filly (out of Bay Leopard dad and Chestnut Leopard mom)?

And my other question for Bashkir Curly people, what are the chances of getting a curly coat if you breed a Curly with a non Curly horse? And is that a no no in the Curly world?

ShutUpJoe 11-15-2009 07:26 PM

If you have a hymozygous (sp check) curly stud 100%. If he is not hymozygous 50%ish. As for the Friesians, I've noticed that crosses usually pick up the mares colors more so than the studs..... (just something I've noticed)

CheyAut 11-16-2009 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Appy Luvr (Post 462085)

Anyway, what color/colors would you possibly get breeding a Buckskin Snowcap Appy filly (out of Buckskin Blanket mom and Bay Fewspot dad) to a homozygous black (Friesian) stallion?

Depends on what the buckskin's genetic makeup is. Doesn't matter if she's homozygous black, as the vast majority of Friesians are (and your question mentions this one is), so the foal will be black based. If the dam is homozygous agouti, foal won't be black, will be bay or buckskin. If heterozygous agouti, black and smokey black are also possible. Being a snowcap (assuming it's a true snowcap), the foal will be at least Lp, so will have appy characteristics. Might or might not get a pattern (likely spotted blanket if so). So: either 25% chance black, 25% smokey black (which usually just look black, maybe some subtle differences), 25% bay, 25% buckskin OR 50% bay 50% buckskin. Could be characteristic only, or could be patterned appy.



Quote:

Originally Posted by Appy Luvr (Post 462085)
Or breeding same homozygous black (Friesian) stallion to a Bay Near Leopard filly (out of Bay Leopard dad and Chestnut Leopard mom)?

Like the above, depends on if dam is homozygous agouti (if so, only bays) or not (if so, black is also possible). (with a chestnut mom, this one is not homozygous black, but doesn't matter in this case). Being a near leopard: 50% chance of passing on Lp, meaning foal will have appy characteristics. If that Lp foal also gets the pattern genes, would have a patterned appy, such as a spotted blanket or near leopard. If it only got the pattern gene without Lp, solid foal. So: either 50% chance at black, 50% chance at bay, or 100% bay. 50% chance of solid, 50% chance of at least appy characteristics and possibly also an appy pattern.



I can't answer your curly questions, as I don't know the inheritance of curly. But I did just read a magazine article about curlies. One of the curlie registries doesn't allow outcrosses to be registered, but others do. So you may find some breeders won't allow outcrossing, but I would guess more do than don't. Just like the Friesians: FPS/FHANA doesn't allow crossing, but the other Friesian registries do. FPS approved stallions won't stand to non-Friesians, but others will.

Appy Luvr 11-16-2009 09:35 AM

I believe she is a true Snowcap, correct?
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c7...shine11-1b.jpg
Boy I'm learning alot here, I thought fewspots and snowcaps always had colored/patterned babies. All of this color stuff really confuses me, lol!! I wish you could just order the color and pattern you want, lol, wouldn't that be fun?

Eastowest 11-22-2009 06:52 PM

>>>> Boy I'm learning alot here, I thought fewspots and snowcaps always had colored/patterned babies.


Everything below is based on the most current research-- no tests are available yet, and so it is still being determined "by observation" and "by progeny"----

Appaloosa coloring is a multi-gened situation. There is LP (the "on-off switch) that creates characteristics and sometimes thinner manes and tails, app roaning, etc, and then there are "pattern genes"-- which are necessary for blankets and leopards, but are only visible when LP is there to reveal them.....

"True" (LPLP) snowcaps and fewspots will always pass on one copy of LP, and, barring rare and unusual amounts of suppression, horses with at least one copy of LP will have at least Appaloosa characteristics. (Mottled skin, striped feet, sclera.) Inheriting LP (without suppression) by itself guarantees that much. Many LP horses also develop some amount of appaloosa type roaning as they age.

However patterns (blanket, leopard) are not "part" of LP-- they are merely revealed by its presence-- they are inherited seperately. To have a pattern, the LP horse also has to have inherited pattern genes/modifiers that creat that dense white with spots area over the horses hips, back, body, etc.


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