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- - The Jeffery Method of horse training?? (http://www.horseforum.com/horse-training/jeffery-method-horse-training-42293/)
The Jeffery Method of horse training??
Ok, so I've mentioned before that I am looking for a trainer for my Bashkir Curly, Flyer. I found someone relatively close and we've emailed back and forth a few times, he's given me references, etc and sounds really nice. Below is how he says he trains his horses:
"We use all gentle natural horsemanship methods, desensitizing, jefferies method, saddling, picking up all four feet, getting your horse soft and supple, getting your horse to move its feet forwards, backwards, left and right, sending exercises, respect exercises,round pen exercises, then we start your horse in a round pen under saddle and then to the arena and by the end of the 30 days we should have some outside rides on your horse and load in trailer."
Sounds relatively safe, right?
So I've never heard of the "jefferies method" of training horses so I googled it and THIS is what I came up with:
The Jeffery Method of Horse Training: To break in a horse for riding
This is an old Australian technique that makes use of several behavioural principles, including the understanding of horse behaviour, the reinforcement for desired behaviour and the use of flight-distance principles. Significantly it is a technique that incorporates the advance and retreat method often attributed to the current wave of horse whisperers. Clearly, because the Jeffery Method employs considerable aversive stimuli in the form of a stricture around the neck and ‘bucking out’ (see below), it should not be used by novices and demands that the horse is never left unsupervised. It is important that the trainee horse is taught one item at a time so the procedure follows:
1. Teaching the horse to stand still using a rope (about 7 m) that is a free-running or slip noose around the horse’s wind-pipe right under his jaw. Once this is on, the trainer can begin to control the .horse with the Jeffery Lunge. The handler is at right angles to the horse’s front legs and makes the lunge forward of that point. This pulls the horse off balance and the rope noose pulls tight for a second and is immediately released. The horse is lunged alternately right and left, and the Jeffery Lunge teaches a horse that relief of pressure on its wind-pipe and neck occurs when it turns and faces the handler.
So am I reading this right?? They are actually choking the horse??? :shock:
I'm kinda freaked out now that I could have sent my horse to someone who seems really nice yet uses THAT as a form of training!
Someone help me out here, this Jefferies is suppose to be a well known "horse whisperer" is this a common practice with "natural horsemanship"?
I know I've probably opened a can of worms since nobody agrees on training methods but I'm a little peeved that I could have been paying someone alot of money to choke my horse :evil:. I've trained horses from the ground up before and choking was never part of the training.....
Never heard of it. Seems like old school cowboy nonsense.
Just curious but would you be able to PM me who the trainer is? I have a friend looking for a trainer here in MT and I don't want her ending up with a choked horse!
The horse isn't choked down. The rope puts pressure on the neck and as soon as the horse faces up the pressure is released. I have seen a lot of people do it and the horse isn't choked or abused in any way. As far as it being old-time cowboy nonsense, you could only be so lucky.
Jefferies was an Aussie that had no experience with horses untill he ended up on a cattle station. He was a chore boy and ask about a horse that nobody ever rode. He was told that it was a bad outlaw. In his spare time he started messing with the horse. One day the men came back to the ranch to find the chore boy riding the rankest horse on the ranch. He did it with no saddle and only a rope with a ring tied in the end of it. Clinton Anderson uses a lot of his methods. All the stuff with CA climbing all over the horse and rubbing it and sliding around all over it is the Jefferies method. There are things that trainers do that the clients are better off not seeing but this is not one of them. There is nothing cruel or dangerous about this and I hope you will do a little more research before you drag a mans name in the dirt. I hope you used due diligence and contacted his references and saw some of the horses he is riding. Your horse will very likely end up like the ones he is riding now.
Ah Kevin, If that is the case, I hope to never be as lucky as this Jefferies fellow.
I can certainly respect a cowboy, but "cowboying" a horse when we have gentler methods that produce the same results to me is nonsense. There are parts of the method that I certainly agree with, but using a rope over the windpipe is not one of them. I can train my horse to turn to me without that.
Could you if you couldn't get a halter on him? I have trained a few horses that were not halter broke and I used this method to get close enough to get a halter on them. By the time they were haltered they were also just about broke to lead and I hadn't choked them one time. Keep in mind that the point is not to choke the horse but to create some discomfort and then provide a reease when the horse give to pressure. When you pull on the rope you pull at a right angle to the horse and force him to take a step then releive the pressure.
Closing your mind to something that you don't understand will not help you in any area of your life certainly not your horsemanship.
You assume I am closing my mind, I'm not.
I have worked with horses that I can not halter and never resorted to lunging or off balancing a horse.
Maybe I should re-instate that there are many parts of that method which I don't disagree with. However I do disagree with the principle of blocking off a windpipe in order for the horse to seek relief from the pressure. By definition, blocking off a windpipe = choking and something I will avoid doing.
I understand the point of it and that it will result in a broke horse. However I think there are better ways to do it.
Kevin, I'm certainly not dragging anyones name through the mud. I don't believe I mentioned anyones name so please don't imply that I am bad mouthing people.
If that is how this trainer chooses to train then I will go elsewhere as I don't agree with using force when their are other ways of doing things. I was simply asking about this method of training as I have never heard of it before. And giving Spastic_Dove the name of the trainer is certainly not dragging his name through the mud. Anyone can email him and he will tell you that's how he trains.
If I didn't care how my horse was trained I would just have one of my neighbors come over, tie his leg up, blind fold him and get on. I've seen it done many times and I've already had multiple offers from old school cowboys wanting to break him simply because he is unique. It's never going to happen as long as I own him.
Spastic_Dove, I am pm'ing you.
I remember reading the Jeffrey Method 20 years ago. He, along with others, are really the forerunners of Natural Horsemanship.
Those were the days before the invention of the rope halter as a training tool. The loop was used as a halter is today. His description of where it goes is just that - a description of a location not a way to choke a horse. Incidentally, that is the proper place to rope a horse - where you get the right amount of control. You need the rope close to the horse's head to be effective.
I wonder how many members who are aghast with this still walk their dogs with collars and not halters? A 30lb dog vs a 1,000 lb horse....hmmmm.
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