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-   -   what's the difference? (http://www.horseforum.com/horse-colors-genetics/whats-difference-80733/)

bluefire 03-11-2011 08:26 PM

what's the difference?
 
Hi

I'm sort of new here. I don't come here very often, but now I have a question about color.

What is the difference between dun and buckskin? For some reason they look the same to me. Every time I type in the word buckskin or dun on google, I see many horses with different shades of color. It confuses me.
Please post pics that would really be helpful.
I have been wondering this for awhile

Thanks

sixlets 03-11-2011 08:35 PM

The easiest way to tell them apart is the Dun Stripe. There's a whole lot of genetic stuff to do with it, but it's the easiest way to tell them apart at a glance.
Here is a Buckskin, so he has NO dun stripe. Buckskin's actualy coat color can vary from creame to golden, but if they do not have a stripe they are Buckskin. (It's kind of difficult to see because of angle, but the end of his croupe, by the tail, does not have a stripe)
http://gotpetsonline.com/pictures-ga...kskin-0012.jpg

Duns can also be a range of colors, but they ALWAYS have the stripe down their back.
http://www.freewebs.com/cartermustan...ldingsmoke.jpg

Poseidon 03-11-2011 08:35 PM

A buckskin is a cream gene added to a bay horse. Buckskins can range in shade from a very light "buttermilk" shade to a deep golden colour. All of them have a gold tint to their coats. Buckskins CAN have dorsal stripes, but the majority do not.

A dun is a dun gene added to a bay horse. Duns are generally a dingier golden shade. Does that make sense? Kind of like if you took a shiny golden buckskin and covered them in a thin layer of dirt to make them look a bit more dull. Duns also have "dun factor" markings. These include dorsal stripes, leg barring, and shoulder barring.

Then there's a colour called Dunskin. It is a buckskin with the dun gene. Dun is just a gene that can affect any colour. Most common is grulla (dun on black) and a red dun (dun on chestnut).

I'll go find pictures.

Sixlets, buckskins CAN have dorsals stripes.

sixlets 03-11-2011 08:42 PM

Okay, I'm on a role, so I'll also include the types of Dun, haha.
A Dun is a horse with the lighter colored body (again, ranging from creame to gold) with BLACK points, dun stripe, and mane and tail, like the dun picture in my last point.
Here is a RED Dun. Instead of black points, they have RED or chestnut points. A Red Dun is a cross from a Dun and a Chestnut.

http://www.mustangs4us.com/Horse%20C...0dun_small.jpg
A Grulla (also called mouse-dun) has an almost bluish/grey tinge, with black points. They are a cross of a Dun with a Black horse.
http://www.hopespringsrmh.com/images...New2%20WEB.jpg

Sorry for all the pics and info, once I got a red dun I became a little obsessed with learning about them and being able to tell them apart haha

Poseidon 03-11-2011 08:43 PM

Dun:
This shows what I mean about the "duller" coat.
http://www.paintedquarterranch.com/IMG_3501.jpg
Dun factors:
Leg barring
http://mudranch.files.wordpress.com/...pg?w=332&h=500

Shoulder barring
Note the dark shadowing down the side of the withers.
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:A...K499cFf28Y&t=1

And then of course the dorsal stripe
http://www.aaanativearts.com/spanish...sal-stripe.jpg

Dunskin:
Notice the buttery colour, but he also has leg barring and shoulder barring.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_DTlKzO9xaQ.../dun+horse.jpg



Buckskin
Does not have markings on legs or shoulder. A very buttery golden colour
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:A...f0k2vPvKaw&t=1

Poseidon 03-11-2011 08:47 PM

The dun gene can affect any coat colour. There are cremello and perlino duns, they just don't get a fancy name like dunalino (dun + palomino) or dunskin. Heck! You can have a amber champagne dun if you had the right parents.

Also, the dorsal stripe is NOT to be confused with countershading. Dorsal stripes look like they have been drawn on a horse's back with a thick marker. Countershading has fuzzy lines and usually fades down into the normal colour as if the two sides of the horse's coat overlapped.

sixlets 03-11-2011 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poseidon (Post 959194)
Sixlets, buckskins CAN have dorsals stripes.

Are you sure? According to American Buckskin Registry Association (which also registers duns) and AQHA they can't. Also, so far the dun stripe has not been associated with the Buckskin gene, "c cr" dilution gene.
Here's a great article on the genes aspect of it Bluefire:
Justamere Ranch -- Dun vs. Buckskin

sixlets 03-11-2011 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poseidon (Post 959208)
The dun gene can affect any coat colour. There are cremello and perlino duns, they just don't get a fancy name like dunalino (dun + palomino) or dunskin. Heck! You can have a amber champagne dun if you had the right parents.

I know, I was just doing the most common. I didn't want to confuse her too much haha. Horse genetics are so complicated! :lol:

Poseidon 03-11-2011 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixlets (Post 959210)
Are you sure? According to American Buckskin Registry Association (which also registers duns) and AQHA they can't. Also, so far the dun stripe has not been associated with the Buckskin gene, "c cr" dilution gene.
Here's a great article on the genes aspect of it Bluefire:
Justamere Ranch -- Dun vs. Buckskin

Yes they can. In order to be a dun, the horse MUST have a dun parent. The ABRA says "Dorsal not required", not that they aren't allowed.

I'm not an AQHA member, so I don't know where I'd look to find their colour requirements. Googling only sends me to APHA requirements.

ETA: Oops! Nevermind. Found it. It just says they "Typically do not have dorsal stripes" not that they cannot.

bluefire 03-11-2011 08:58 PM

Thanks Sixlets and Poseidon. I think I get it now. The pictures really helped. I was really confused about the shade of coats they have.
I actually own a Red Dun QH and I love that color.


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