Is reining compatible with a dressage trained horse? - Page 5

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Is reining compatible with a dressage trained horse?

This is a discussion on Is reining compatible with a dressage trained horse? within the Reining forums, part of the Western Riding category

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    02-14-2011, 01:25 PM
**popcorn anyone?**
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    02-15-2011, 11:28 PM
I ride bareback much more than I ride in any saddle and I live surrounded by wilderness so I know how to duck tree branches! I don't care how you ride for recreation, to enjoy yourself. I am curious and trying to learn what I am missing from people serious and competitive in the sport of reining. I am not trying to put it down! I am explaining the way I was taught and asking why reiners do it differently. Why are you responding to my question if you are not even a reiner? OBVIOUSLY you do not know WHY you ride the way you do. It's "just because".

My daughter was a barrel racer and she rode in a balanced seat - so you do not need to sit in a chair seat. When she was young in 4H she was grand champion having been trained in the "idiotic" classical position which is exactly what judges look for in western equitation. She also excelled in trail classes. She even trained her own horse.

As far as stiffness goes I had my back broken by my warmblood. When I got him he bolted into every canter transition and often blew up from undiagnosed cramping caused by a metabolic condition. He was given to me - for obvious reasons. I had to ride this out myself because every cowboy trainer in the county was terrified of him. I had to learn a SECURE position or I would have been killed - literally. That is why I am saying this works. That is why I am very reluctant to change what has saved my life.

I also had an Arabian that did spin and bolt shies at molecules. Years ago, I took lessons from an instructor who forced me into a forked position that sent me flying up on the Arab's neck. Then I migrated to the "chair seat" which did not improve my security at all. It was one of Sally Swift's students that gave me the feedback I needed to really make my position secure.

After many years of working on this balanced position, I could ride out just about anything. I am not a young person, not even middle aged. But I could ride out the bucking fits of a 17 hand warmblood, although I don't want to do it ever again! I even rode him bareback for 6 months waiting for a saddle to be made. Warmblood gaits have so much more suspension it is like being launched to the moon every stride. It took years to develop the ability to ride him well. The cowboys bounced literally a foot out of the saddle just trying to sit the trot. When I first got the horse, one of them was bucked so hard his feet were jammed into the stirrups. This was a trainer featured in Western Horseman. He admitted he didn't have a clue how to ride him. He was/is a very nice and honest person.

I will quit and end this thread. I just want you to know there is another world out there and it is not full of arrogant people who are trying to put your way of riding down. Your opportunity to know about something a little different and maybe learn something that might help you is now closed. The door you slammed is locked from the other side.
    02-16-2011, 12:12 AM
This is the way I see it. I am a reiner have been for years. I breed and show NRHA and NRCHA horses. My horses have year end title and have finished in the top 30 in the world with limited showing.

You asked and I answered and you did not listen. You can not ride a reiner or reined cow horse with the same position you ride a Dressage horse or a Warmblood. It just dose not work. If you do you will end up over the horses head when he stops or turns. It is just that simple.

You can take the info and use it or you can leave it. Matters not to me. I am very very aware of how Wormbloods are ridden as I have ridden several. I shoot a lot of H/J and Dressage shows so I am also very very aware of those disciplines. Each is different and needs to be ridden in a different way.

This does not mean that each is not compatible with the other. You just have to under stand the differences.

Also it seems to me that you are coming here and trying to, in some way, get me and other reiners to change how we ride. Thing is and I can only speak for myself I ride reiners the way they need to be ridden. To change would be to go against what needs to be to show the horse at its best. If you wish to ride horses in this discipline you need to look at how it is done. Does not mean you need to do it exactly the same.

Again you need to learn the history behind reining also to under stand what it is why it is and why these horses are worked the way they are and ridden the way they are.
    02-16-2011, 11:16 AM
Originally Posted by nefferdun    
...Your opportunity to know about something a little different and maybe learn something that might help you is now closed. The door you slammed is locked from the other side.
I'm devastated.

I won't get to learn how I should ignore my saddle and stirrup and ride bareback-style in my saddle. I won't get to learn why George Morris is an idiot who refuses to recognize the 'masters' when training jumpers, and why Shawn Flarida doesn't know how to ride reiners.

I won't learn why my horse needs to be on the bit even when bitless, or why a horse needs to stare at the ground. Oh golly. Devastated!

I will point out that I've taken some tips on riding from some of the folks on this thread and used them to help my horses and me...but what I won't do is agree that dressage is the only worthwhile way to ride a horse. And when I ride Mia later today, she'll be looking around, as always. We'll work on our stops & trots (slow, medium, and barnburner). She'll simplistically move away from pressure, and I'll spend more time smiling than trying to fart morse code messages to her thru the saddle. It is an Australian saddle, so she probably wouldn't hear them thru all that leather - and Australians don't know how to ride anyways...

    02-16-2011, 11:21 AM
I will be doing the same thing shortly-in a reining saddle. Smiling with all 4 cheeks.
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    02-16-2011, 05:18 PM
It's all about what you personally want from your horse. The most important thing is that you are able to train (or have someone else train) your horse to do the things that you value in a riding horse. And that with your particular riding position you are able to communicate effectively with your horse and also stay on in a balanced manner.
One person wants their Western horse to stop and turn on a dime. Another person wants their horse to gait properly. Someone else wants their horse to perform maneuvers with extreme collection. I want my horses to transition downward slowly with as little stress on the joints as possible. That's because we do endurance and those little things can add up after awhile. So our upward transitions are instantaneous, but our downward transitions would be considered slow by a reiner.
You might value that your horse stands perfectly still whenever you ask. I might not care about that but instead value that my horse is always ready to give me more extension within a gait and will keep on moving out for miles without me asking again. So while your horse might be perfectly trained for what you do, other people might consider their horses perfectly trained for what THEY do. You might not be able to take someone else's horse and use them immediately in your discipline. That doesn't mean the horse is not well trained for something else.
Maybe you can stay on your horse in the position you ride in, and maybe the way you ride helps you give cues clearly to your horse.
Maybe if I rode my horse the way you do, her launch would send me over the back of the saddle when I race her down the beach with my best friends.
Who is to say who is wrong? All our horses are doing what we have trained them to do, and hopefully that is what we enjoy doing.
I enjoy trying many disciplines because it gives me an appreciation for what other people are training their horses to do.
    02-16-2011, 06:36 PM
Well in my opinion a truly finished reiner should not ever need a rein cue. But, that idea is easier said than done.

My horses are all very supple to my leg. The rein is just an added tool in case something goes wrong and I need some reinforcement/ follow through on my commands. Otherwise, I just use my leg to more or less push my horse around. If he doesnt get off my leg, my rein is there to make sure as heck he knows whats being asked in case my first cue isnt clear.

Its a training tool, and I don't bwlieve it should be relied on.
    02-16-2011, 07:17 PM
Originally Posted by gottatrot    
...Who is to say who is wrong? All our horses are doing what we have trained them to do, and hopefully that is what we enjoy doing.

I enjoy trying many disciplines because it gives me an appreciation for what other people are training their horses to do.
Just to be clear - I respect good dressage riders and wish I could ride 1/10th as well. Or 1/20th. I feel the same about jockeys, and reiners, and cutters...there are lots of riding sports, and just about everyone who rides in them rides better than I do. What I find incomprehensible is telling reiners or steeplechase jockeys or anyone else that the top riders in their sport don't ride the right way.

I like simplistic riding, because at my level, even simplistic is a challenge. I find I'm increasingly drawn to the western sports. That is partly because it is more appropriate for my goals for my riding, and partly because the people I'm running into seem friendlier and more encouraging than the English style riders I've run into. Maybe that has just been bad luck on my part, but there it is. I wish dressage riders well and respect their sport. But I can do without the lectures...
    02-27-2011, 08:38 PM
Thought you might find this interesting.

YouTube - Anky Van Grunsven Reining

YouTube - Anky van Grunsven 1st International Reining Competition
    02-27-2011, 08:51 PM
Interesting videos. She isn't exactly my favorite rider, but it takes a lot of guts to tackle a new sport after dominating another. And she obviously didn't say, "I have 3 Olympic Gold medals, and 8 World Cup championships - I'll ride dressage while reining!"

I guess she knows enough about winning to pay attention to those who win...and be willing to learn a new trick!


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