The Horse Forum banner
Status
Not open for further replies.

Guns on the trail

22K views 71 replies 25 participants last post by  RhondaLynn 
#1 ·
I may be asking a question that has been talked to death. But, I am going to open this can of worms.

When my hubby and I ride, especially in the wilderness areas, I carry my little 38. It is small, fits nicely in my horn bag and can be in my grubby hand in just a second. I have carried it for several years but don't have a carry permit. I plan to get one but I just have been too lazy to go and pay the $50 to get it. I know that there are a lot of places that we (all of us, you too) ride that guns are prohibited. My question, what is the punishment to be caught with one. And, wouldn't I have to be doing something suspicious for a ranger/cop to search my horse and saddle bags?

Only once have I actually pulled it from my horn bag to possibly use. we had parked our trailer at a trailhead in a large wilderness area. When we came back to the truck after our wonderful ride there was an old codger parked near us with a rifle. (hunting season ??) I quietly pulled my gun out of the horn bag and out of the holster and slipped it into my pocket of my jacket. My hubby rode ahead of me and talked to the guy. he said he had locked his keys in his pickup and wondered if we had a clothes hanger. Needless to say we did not. I stayed back and kept my hand on the gun. the whole time. The old guy was nice but still carried his rifle. some other guys in a car drove by and he walked out there to flag them down and see if they had a clothes hanger. It ended up being a totally true story and the old guy was on the up and up. BUT, it could have easly been a set up.

I also worry that we might have to put a horse down.

Needless to say I worry that I will be caught with a gun where I should not have one. but, I feel that I would have to be acting crazy for them to search me. sooooo..... I carry one.

What is everyone elses thought.

Rhonda
 
See less See more
#2 ·
Get off your butt and get a carry permit then carry 24/7. That's what I do and I'm glad for it. I also carry it on me not on my horse. If I get seperated from my horse I may need my gun. I also wouldn't go anywhere that I couldn't carry a firearm. I believe that carry in national parks is now allowed so I don't think there are many places you can take a horse that you can't take a gun but it's better to check than get thrown in jail.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Smilla13
#3 ·
Get your permit.

Some wilderness areas and parks do not allow guns in them. Contact the Forest Service. The fines in the past were hefty and I believe they could take your truck, trailer and horses (at least some places in Washington they used to do that, may still be the case). In some cases, they did allow you to buy your stuff back. I know when my Agency seizes trucks/trailers/horses/dogs for hunting violations we often allow people to try and buy them back for a pretty big price.
 
#6 ·
We have concealed carry laws here as well and it's $150 for the permit plus the cost of the training.
We also have an open carry law that requires no permit. As long as the firearm is not hidden your ok. Maybe you need to start wearing it in a holster in plain sight. Check your local laws though. Here the open law is also regulated by county and city ordinance.
Either way you need to obey the law. I'm sure the fine's for not doing so far outweigh the cost of compliance.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Smilla13
#7 ·
That is well said and very true. The safest choice for a horse good is the old cowboy style single action revolver. Regualdless of your weapon, I would strongly suggest training your horse to be used to it before you carry a gun on your horse. The cowboy mounted shooting acciation Cowboy Mounted Shooting Association "CMSA" - The Fastest Growing Equine Sport In The Nation or if possible those trainers and groups who train police horses would be the best place to look for information on training your horse Mounted Police Training Systems LLC and Mounted Police Training - Mounted Police Information

I can't find it now but there was one from Califonia that boasted that he would get you to be able to fire twice form your horse in 2 days.
 
#9 ·
Wow! Your horse charged at a bear? I'm pretty sure mine would have unseated me and headed for the hills! :lol:
It's not the four legged predators that worry me, but the two legged. I ride alone a lot and in very remote areas. I've run across a few guys that gave me the willies. Fortunately not problems, but I do have a side arm that I can bring along on such rides. I keep it strapped to me, won't do me any good if I get separated from my horse and it's on the saddle.

Get the permit.
 
#10 ·
Wow! Your horse charged at a bear? I'm pretty sure mine would have unseated me and headed for the hills! :lol:
It's not the four legged predators that worry me, but the two legged. I ride alone a lot and in very remote areas. I've run across a few guys that gave me the willies. Fortunately not problems, but I do have a side arm that I can bring along on such rides. I keep it strapped to me, won't do me any good if I get separated from my horse and it's on the saddle.

Get the permit.
You're right about the wild animals. I have never seen a wild animal that scared me but a few times I have seen people either on the trail or at the trailhead that I kept an eye on. Since I have gotten my permit I don't even go to the store unarmed. I live in a nice safe town but bad things happen even in nice safe towns. I couldn't live with myself if I left my pistol at home and couldn't prevent injury to my wife and kids.
 
#12 ·
I don't plan on fighting wolf, coyote, or other predator hand to hand. With two legs problems I like options.
 
#15 ·
I have my gun and I carry it everywhere I can, especially when riding in the summer time. We don't have much of a problem around here with predators, mostly the only things we have are coyotes and a mountain lion or 2 (they usually run away first anyway). However, rattlesnakes are a real problem and IMHO, the only good rattler is a dead rattler. There are a lot of iffy people in town as well, druggies and illegals. We have pretty much the same laws a Vida where you can carry it in sight and you are okay. You are fortunate that it is only $50 there. Here, with the cost of the class and the cost to the state, I end up with a cost of at least $250. Get your conceal and then carry it on your hip. What if something were to happen and your horse gets away from you? Then you would be stuck out there with no gun.
 
#18 ·
Well, if this is the argument that anti gun is taking to further their arguments for gun control it is the lamest I've heard yet!

We all know that the law abiding citizens are not the issue. And if any predator came near me....well let's just say I'll save the taxpayers from the expense of a trial!

Okay, blood pressure is back down to normal...let's continue with the original topic, sorry for the side rant.:wink:
 
#19 ·
We've used guns as noise makers to scare grizzlys off while fishing in alaska. I carry one often when riding in remote areas. But I'm not too worried about needing if for animals. Although I wouldn't hesitate to fire it. But unless I was seriously threatened I wouldn't fire to harm but rather to scare.

I have had horses get hurt and die in the back country. It's no fun to cut a horses throat with a knife because he needs to be put down. You only need a permit if you concel the weapon. It's bad enough to have to take your saddle and cut the brand off your old friend when they go down. Utah allows you to carry pistols out in the open with out a permit. I just put a holster on my belt.

The law was changed about carrying guns in national parks like Yellowstone. But I don't think it has taken effect yet. I know congress passed the law, but the liberals got a time delay, I think it goes into effect this year. I know I was suprised last summer in Yellowstone, I had heard about the new law, but the rangers promptly straighten out my understanding that I couldn't carry a gun last summer in the park.
 
#21 ·
Painted Horse please dont ever bring up slitting a horses throat to kill it again. I am only so tough until a animals gets hurt or killed.
My riding teacher always brings a gun. I am not scared of animals. If we were to meet a cougar on the trail I would hop off my horse let him run and I would bolt up a tree(yes I can climb like a monkey). However some people are creepy so a gun is there for that purpose.
 
#22 ·
Painted Horse please dont ever bring up slitting a horses throat to kill it again. I am only so tough until a animals gets hurt or killed.
.
That's the facts of horse ownership. Sometimes bad things happen and it's alot easier to think and plan ahead of time rather than wait untill something happens.
 
#24 · (Edited)
Each state has its own laws some states it is broken down by county. Here in Ohio my CCW is good in several states. However I can not carry in the parks. So know where you can and can not legally carry. The classes you take will teach you all the laws.

That all being said as a ex law enforcement officer. There are several things to keep in mind when you carry a gun 24/7. First it is NOT YOUR GUN. When you take a gun someplace and something happens remember you are bring a gun to the fight and again it is NOT YOUR GUN. It is the first person who gets to it. The training most states offer is not truly enough so go and find other type of training on use and retention of your weapon.

Also if you carry be prepared to use it. If not leave it at home for the reason listed above. It is better to be judged by 12 then carried by 6.

Also. Make sure if you are going to carry a hand gun while riding that your horse is not scared of guns. Nothing like shooting off the back of a horse who has never had a gun go off around them little lone on their back.
 
#26 ·
When a horse breaks a leg 20 miles back in to the wilderness, You have no choice but to put them down. Regardless of how much you care for them. Having done it the hard way once, I will always sneek a gun into the back country regardless of the park regulation. You won't find me shooting tin cans or squirrels with it. I won't be flashing it around. Heck, I don't even shot the rattle snakes I run across. But it will be tucked away in case it's needed. I take care of my horses. But I don't ride in an arena or at a county fairground. I ride in the wilderness and crap happens occassionally.

I have taught my horses what a gun is. I own horses to go hunting on. When a bull elk runs out, I can't always find a hitchen post to tie my horse up to before I stroll an appropriate distance away before I fire the rifle. My horses need to ground tie and stay put when the rifle barks. And part of the way I teach that is to shoot pistols off their back.

As far as cougars. They can absolutely out run you and climb faster than you and climb higher than you can. But most of the cats I've seen, check you out and then want to get out of Dodge.
 
#27 ·
i'm in ks as was stated before, and a CCL cost a bit, but what's your life worth? don't be lazy, 50 bucks is cheap. if i recall, GA is one of the better CCW states, or even open carry. check your local and state laws. i would strongly recommend carrying on your person as well as it is more available.

i carry nearly 24/7, and when i ride i DO have a rifle boot where the old .30/30 resides. handgun also goes with, but i disagree a bit with eddie. he says single action revolver, i would be more apt to recommend a double action since the trigger can be pulled without needing to dock the hammer. i unfortunately don't have either so i carry a full size auto, which is part of the reason for the rifle.

i do still consider two legged creatures when i ride, although it's almost always on private land, or on a county road. but i still do consider the four legged type. there are cougars around here from time to time, and constant coyotes, as well as a new addition: hogs. being out on horseback does not mean that i want to let my guard down in any fashion and let a pest go (hogs are new, creeping up in from OK, and we do NOT want any of them at all...).

like i said, just get off your duff and go get your license and carry on your person. it can be well worth your life to do so, especially if you come across some stray two legged creatures. something i forgot out around here is METH LABS. i don't want to come up on a meth head and his meth lab with NO gun, they are extremely likely to take a whack at you no matter who ya are or why ya's there.
 
#29 ·
like i said, just get off your duff and go get your license and carry on your person. it can be well worth your life to do so, especially if you come across some stray two legged creatures. something i forgot out around here is METH LABS. i don't want to come up on a meth head and his meth lab with NO gun, they are extremely likely to take a whack at you no matter who ya are or why ya's there.
Ummm... shooting around a meth lab is a REALLY bad idea.
 
#28 ·
PaintedHorse - keep in mind, that if you get caught, you might have a high price to pay. One of our Officers has a saying, "people always get caught". Not sure if he tells that to people to make them tow the line. Just sayin'.
 
#30 · (Edited)
That maybe. But I'd rather pay the fine and forfiet the gun than not have the proper tool to dispatch a disabled horse again. It's tucked away, I'm not threatening the wildlife or the quiet of the park. I've never had a ranger ask to frisk me or search my belongings in the back country.

The other part of the problem, is that if you put a horse down, You are not supposed to leave it laying by the trail. It's not consider appropriate to bait bears to surprise unknowing hikers walking down a path. And while I have cut up enough Elk and Moose to know that I could break a horse down small enough to move it. I don't have the desire to do that to a old companion. So the ranger would have two things to get after me about.
 
#31 ·
I get it believe me. I work for fish and wildlife and walk remote areas getting to lakes to check anglers. I don't get to carry anything. Not a gun, not pepper spray nothing. And if I get caught carrying them, but trouble. I have my handy Sears crafstman knife, but that's not going to do too much in close combat. I'm always watching over my shoulder, but have found my bigger problems are really squirrels throwing sticks down on my head.
 
#37 ·
I have my handy Sears crafstman knife, but that's not going to do too much in close combat.
In close combat that is exactly what you want is a knife. Get a good one and learn how to use it. Much better then a gun in that situation.
 
#34 ·
It boggles my mind to think of carrying a gun on my horse. Such different cultures.

We don't have any wild animals that would attack a horse and rider - No bears, coyotes, big cats, etc. Also, because we have strict gun laws, I have never seen a person carrying a gun except a cop.

I would freak out if I saw someone riding along with a gun, lol.
 
#36 · (Edited)
There is only a couple of places that guns are not allowed. And as of February 20, if Kevin is right, that law will be changed. At least for the national parks.

Short afternoon ride, I don't worry about it. For example going out to Antelope Island, which is a state park. You have to stay on the loop trails. So you are rarely more than a few miles from your truck/trailer. You have cell phone service most of the time, And if you don't have service, just climb the hill. The trails are easy, so chances of a horse getting hurt are slim. No need to worry about having to put a horse down. If you did need to, the ranger would probably be right there to help out. And he can drive his vehicle on all the trails.

But when I ride back into wilderness areas, Where It's an ALL DAY ride to get back to the truck, Where it's an ALL DAY horse ride and then a hour or two truck ride before I'll get cell service, I'm on my own, There is nobody that can come and help. In those sitituations, You need to be able to take care of things your self.

I'm not worried about strange people, I'm not going to pull a gun on a stranger. We are in the Wilderness, not a bar fight. Chances are conversation with strangers will be about fishing or the color of fall leaves, not hey give me your wallet. The biggest confrontation I've ever seen in the back country was tree huggers complaining about us having horses in the back country. And I'm not going to escalate that to a gun fight.

Most animals I don't see as threats. I had a grizzly charge us in Alaska and at the time I wished I had a gun, But we didn't and the bear backed down, in hindsight, I suspect shooting that bear would of got us killed. There is just no way you can kill something that big with pistol, At least not fast enough to save your own skin. I had a moose tree me once, and had to spend 20 minutes up a tree while she did a dance on my pack. Maybe a loud gun shot, would have sent her running. But I would have never shot her.

When you ride horses in country like this, There is no help, and things do occassionally happen.


Here we are cleaning out the eyes and ears of horse that went down in Quicksand. If you can't get the horse out of the quicksand, Is it best to just leave him to die?
 
#38 ·
I've been trail riding for about 15 years and frequently ride alone. I'm in Arizona. We have all sorts of wildlife. They've never given me a problem. I have never seen a cougar. I would love to see one!

I have never felt the need to carry a gun. Of course there is a first time for everything, so someday I might be caught off-guard, but really, the wildlife leaves you alone and you are blessed to get to see them, at least that is how I feel. I have been charged by elk a couple of times, but that is because I was calling them. :lol:

I pray I never need to put my horse down in the back country. For the most part I am within 4 hours of home (when I ride alone) and when I ride further I am with a friend. (She sometimes carries a gun.)

My Dad always told me it's the two-legged animals you have to worry about, not the four-legged, lol!

What's nice about being on horseback in a wooded area, is that you can disappear and pretty much avoid the few people you see out there.

So I dunno, I don't do pack trips or anything, just trail rides. I haven't felt like I wanted a gun yet. I agree if you are out there for days or weeks, a gun would be good!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
You have insufficient privileges to reply here.
Top