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Help! Won't go into creek!

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        05-21-2013, 12:53 AM
      #21
    Foal
    @blue eyed pony. I'm very confused with what you want from me, as you first said have I considered water not to be the problem, and now you are saying it may very well be the problem, whilst I'm saying that I'm not sure which it is but I'm not denying it's any of them at this time though you seem to be ignoring that (sorry if I'm mistaken). I'm not trying to be defensive but I had previously stated most of what I just said so you can understand I'm a bit annoyed, I don't mean to be, I'm just human. I'm complying with you completely so I really don't see a reason why you should be angry/annoyed with me...I'm sorry if you sense a bad attitude when I replied, as I did with CowboyBob. As I replied to your first reply I just wanted you to understand why I said what I did earlier in response to CowboyBob, so you did not mistake my meaning of saying that.

    Oh the water is very slow moving/standing water. It's a shallow creek, deep at some points but at the point of crossing it's shallow.
         
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        05-21-2013, 01:07 AM
      #22
    Trained
    That's horses for you.

    One horse might see the slope heading down to a stream or creek and think OMG THAT WATER WILL EAT ME, the next might see it and think OMG I CAN'T GO DOWN THAT SLOPE I MIGHT BREAK A LEG AND DIE, and the next might not be bothered at all.

    My gelding will do down ANY slope, provided the footing is safe. He's a far better judge of that than I am. My filly takes convincing. Both of them will go into water, but neither is especially big on the idea. Monty's nearly impossible to get OUT once you've got him in, but getting him in is a challenge sometimes. I firmly believe that at this point in time, asking Magic to go down a slope into water would result in disaster. She'd rear, or buck me off... one of the two. We have forward, she's just stubborn, sensitive, and flighty, and hasn't been desensitized enough to water or to slopes yet. Asking Monty to... well... I do it every winter! He's an eventing horse, he should in theory JUMP into water if his rider says it's safe.
         
        05-21-2013, 01:25 AM
      #23
    Foal
    @blue eyed pony; your horses seem to have a awful lot of personality. I'd also like to say I like the song (and band) from which the lyrics in your signature are from.

    Later in the week or at the weekend I will try taking her to the other creek to confirm if or if not the slope is the problem or the water is. I value and will try your suggestions, thank you!
         
        05-21-2013, 02:12 AM
      #24
    Trained
    Lol yes, and I wouldn't have them any other way. Magic surprises me on a daily basis because I have to admit I still expect her to try to buck every time I get on her back - she's a baby and she has succeeded in getting me off a couple of times, and with how smart she is all it takes is once... but at the same time she seems to really enjoy being ridden. She likes having a job to do, that one.

    Monty on the other hand would be quite content to be retired. He's a lazy, stubborn old coot. Likes his long walking trail rides and LOVES jumping and cross country, to the point where he turns into a fire-breathing dragon and just wants to gallop everywhere. He's completely bipolar, and absolutely a character.

    I love horses that have personality. Especially the ones that love a good cuddle. I have friends who have horses that have all the personality of a cardboard box, and I would be so bored... my favourite horses at work are the ones that steal your hat off your head, or 'help' with the mucking out, or pinch the haybag off you and go bolting around the pasture with it in their mouth. The quiet ones that just sort of stand there and wait for you to feed them are boring!
         
        05-21-2013, 02:47 AM
      #25
    Trained
    Hahaha the jumping into water thing cracks me up...Had a couple really stupid colts do that instead of walking in and it was just like, "Really? REALLY?"

    I agree that slope does not sound safe to back down, so I'm glad you decided against it.

    Let us know what kind of results you have.
         
        05-21-2013, 09:13 AM
      #26
    Weanling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RememberMeForThis99    
    @blue eyed pony; I have considered either to be the problem. CowboyBob seemed to believe that water could never be the problem, which is why I offered the chance that horse associates water with pain in the case of past abuse. I never said the slope wasn't the problem, the creek was the problem or anything. I actually said in my first post that I doubt water is the problem... I haven't taken her down any slopes like the ones I described, minus the water, yet. As I've said there is another creek which I will try to take her through later on in the week.
    I am really not trying to pick a fight here. And. I was even thinking about staying out of this Thread. But, since I am being talked about (not in a bad way) just a few thoughts.

    First:
    " CowboyBob seemed to believe that water could never be the problem,"

    I never said that water could never be the problem. I was saying that in this issue I would think that the water was not the big problem. That doing more ground work, and lots of confidences building work away from the creek could go a long ways towards helping your horse with the creek. I also gave you the method I use to work a horse through similar issues just in case you wanted to work this out at the creek.

    Second:
    "which is why I offered the chance that horse associates water with pain in the case of past abuse."
    "(CowboyBob; ever think that the horse may have been abused in/around water so associates water with pain?)"

    No, I don't ever assume that if I am having a problem with a horse that the reason for the problem is do to some past mystery abuser (this could be a mistake on my part as I have never knowingly worked with abused horses). In the event that a horse was abused with water or in water or near water or all the above. My advice would not be any different I would have advised you to work with your horse the same way I did in my fist post.
    (I can see how this could be read with a hole lot of attitude but its not. Maybe a little exaggeration just to make a point. I am not upset or mad as I write this. I am not trying to make fun of anything anyone has said in this thread.)

    Third:
    "I actually said in my first post that I doubt water is the problem"

    Ok so this confuses me just a little.? So its ok for you to say that the water might not be the problem, but; when I say the water is not the problem then I'm a jerk* for not thinking the horse could have been abused??? I don't understand?? (* you never called me a jerk for thinking the horse was abused)

    So all that to say, I still would advise you to work with your horse in the same way as I did in my first post. I have had lots of luck working horses into, onto and through different things over the years using the same method I described in my first post. (Just a side note it also works with loading into a trailer).

    Again, my intention in re-entering this thread was just to "clear the air" as to my thoughts; what I did say and what I did not say and to better explain things that might have been said better. I am not trying to imply anything, or make judgments on anyone. Just stating what and how I see thing.
         
        05-21-2013, 11:03 AM
      #27
    Trained
    We have a creek that the horses cross fine when they are in that pasture. Add a rider, and they are hesitant. I think that carrying a rider changes everything. They know that their balance and work load is different.

    The horse I am riding now does not want to cross one particular creek. She will, however, follow another horse over it without a problem. To start with, I had to get off and lead her. I think that she will get her confidence up as we keep working.
         
        05-21-2013, 11:40 AM
      #28
    Started
    We also have a creek (seasonal) in the pasture, and the horses cross it. We will be camping this summer and our favorite trail has access to the perfect creek crossing.Level entry, fairly wide. Good bottom and about knee deep. It will be interesting to see how it goes when crossing with a rider is our idea and not theirs.
    OP...I hope you post how the training is going. We always learn from the experiences of others.
         
        05-21-2013, 02:40 PM
      #29
    Foal
    @CowboyBob;

    First; Note the word "seemed".

    Second; You said; "Horses are not scared of water,", which is why I said a horse could have been abuse. Not my horse, but a horse, just in general. Now you are right in a way, that the water isn't the problem but the horse associating the water with pain/abuse would be the problem. But are tons of other reason why a horse would be scared of some forms of water. They can't see the bottom of it and think it's a massive black hole that will suck them up and kill them. That part of a sentence is also why it 'seemed' as if you did not think water could be the problem.

    Third; I said I 'doubt' not that 'Water is not the problem/it's not the water/it could never be the water' or however I would put it. I'm guessing the slope is the problem but it could very well be the water as I have not confirm anything. I explained this to blue eyed pony as best I could. I retorted to you on your above comment because you *seemed* to think that water could never (what I assumed, by mistake) be the problem. I hope this clears things up?

    @texasgal; believe it or not that was supposed to be constructive criticism. At the time I had thought of no other way to say 'Just say what you think the person should do with only necessary details'. As I felt like he was repeating himself a little bit and other things, in my own opinion. Later in that same sentence I say "ask questions about the horse or rider.". And the "horrible manner" I get told how to ride/work in is when someone gives me advice when I didn't ask for it, wants me to be a copy of themselves or assumes I know nothing about horses. Which is the main reason I felt offended by CowboyBob's comment as I thought he was talking down to me. Note the "thought" for future reference.

    Any future replies that are meant or seem insulting while being complete off topic, Texasgal, I'm sorry to point you out but this really isn't the place to be sarcastic and intentionally, well, mean, I will not reply. I really don't know I bothered replying to some replies to clear the air or help you see what I was thinking at the time. Go on thinking I'm hippocratic, an idiot, mean, know-it-all or whatever else you had in your heads. I came here for help and have gotten a lot of helpful replies, which I am thankful for. :)
         
        05-21-2013, 05:14 PM
      #30
    Weanling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RememberMeForThis99    
    @CowboyBob;

    Second; You said; "Horses are not scared of water,", which is why I said a horse could have been abuse. Not my horse, but a horse, just in general. Now you are right in a way, that the water isn't the problem but the horse associating the water with pain/abuse would be the problem. But are tons of other reason why a horse would be scared of some forms of water. They can't see the bottom of it and think it's a massive black hole that will suck them up and kill them. That part of a sentence is also why it 'seemed' as if you did not think water could be the problem.
    I have been thinking about it, and I have to say first I have not and I do not pretend to know every horse that has ever lived and that is alive now. But, I will agree with myself "Horses are not scared of water". To say they are would mean that they could be scared or Hay, Grain or Grass.

    The only time I have seen horses that could have been scared of water was when a tank heater was shorting out and the horses would get shocked every time they would try to drink. But, after we fixed the problem every horse went back to that same tank to drink.

    I think horses know what water is and for whatever reason in their training will refuse to go into water. I have ridden lots of horses into deep water rivers, ponds and creeks and I have yet to ride one that I believed could not go into the water because they were too scared to go into the water. Some went willingly right off, some it took 20 to 30 minutes to get them into the water.
    So no I do not believe horses are scared of water. If a horse was truly scared of water they could live very long.
         

    Tags
    fear, slope, thoroughbred, trail riding, water

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