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Help! Won't go into creek!

This is a discussion on Help! Won't go into creek! within the Trail Riding forums, part of the Riding Horses category

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        05-22-2013, 09:54 AM
      #41
    Trained
    OP, IMHO you would like somebody to come over and fix this for you. Maybe the pigs will fly today and that will happen. I'm sorry that you can't tell that you've been given REALLY GOOD ADVICE. Stop picking on Cowboy Bob. I'd ride with HIM any day of the week bc I can tell that his horses behave.
    Lynn Palm had an excellent recent program on training horses to water. If you get HRTV it will be on again, and you can TIVO it and watch it over and over until you understand. She tells you to train the horse to be obedient FIRST. That could be your real problem. Lynn's horses will move only one foot at a time for her. She has inspired me to teach my horses to do the same. (If you don't know who she is, she was "Rugged Lark"'s trainer, who did 10 years of bridleless demos, both Western and English (Hunter and Dressage.))
    Honestly, when I took my lesson horses, who were solidly broken bc they had ~1,000 hours under saddle/year out on family vacations, or CW National Reenactments, and they didn't want to go anywhere, I just had them follow their broken-to-anything herd leader. Once they crossed a funny bridge, or crossed a stream a few times following HIM, it was never a problem afterwards.
         
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        05-22-2013, 10:10 AM
      #42
    Yearling
    I totally agree it is a training/respect issue. When I first started riding my horse she wanted nothing to do with the creek running through our property. She was a stubborn mule and absolutely would not move a muscle. I was going to be more stubborn and sit on her for as long as it took until it was her idea to cross the creek. I waited an hour. And 10,000 mosquito bites later, I gave up.

    We went back to the round pen and worked our butts off for the next couple of months. When I went back to the creek months later, I asked her to cross, she put her head down and sniffed, found the easiest route and crossed like she has done it everyday of her life.

    She had learned that I expect a response to my aids. We worked with crossing tarps, crossing a bridge, crossing a teeter-totter, walking through hanging strips of tarp. Anything and everything I could come up with to test her compliance and show her that she could trust me that I wouldn't let her get hurt.

    It has made her a rock solid trail horse that is super fun to ride!
    Corporal and CowboyBob like this.
         
        05-22-2013, 07:45 PM
      #43
    Weanling
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Sahara    

    We went back to the round pen and worked our butts off for the next couple of months. When I went back to the creek months later, I asked her to cross, she put her head down and sniffed, found the easiest route and crossed like she has done it everyday of her life.

    She had learned that I expect a response to my aids. We worked with crossing tarps, crossing a bridge, crossing a teeter-totter, walking through hanging strips of tarp. Anything and everything I could come up with to test her compliance and show her that she could trust me that I wouldn't let her get hurt.

    It has made her a rock solid trail horse that is super fun to ride!
    Sahara that is a great example of it being fixed the right way!!!

    I LOVE TEETER-TOTTERS!!!!!!!!
    If you have never played on one with a horse you have no idea how much you are missing out!! They are amazing. At a place I use to work we have one it was like 8 feet across and 12 to 15 feet long it was such a great way to work with a horse. I really want to build one here were I am now working.


    Corporal thank you those were some very nice words
    CatrinaB87, Sahara and Corporal like this.
         
        05-22-2013, 08:33 PM
      #44
    Yearling
    Horses learn to trust you and to move forward on command. Its just a matter of teaching your horse, as the others have pointed out. It really doesn't matter what the object is that you are crossing, It's the same concept.

    Practice in your yard over blue tarps, then make a mud puddle, then find a log or big rock then a stream, Every chance you get, ask your horse to deal with a new challenge.

    Bridges




    Boardwalks across boggy areas along the trail


    Logs


    River crossing




    Rocks




    I guess what I'm saying, is don't just go for a trail ride, Go for a training ride. Work any obstacle that you find along the way. Pretty soon the horses just deal with the obstacles even with novice riders on their back.
         
        05-22-2013, 09:00 PM
      #45
    Started
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Painted Horse    
    .I guess what I'm saying, is don't just go for a trail ride, Go for a training ride. Work any obstacle that you find along the way. Pretty soon the horses just deal with the obstacles even with novice riders on their back.
    I can do some work here at home but the training ground is the trail.
    Fun, interesting and no end of obstacles!
    Corporal and CowboyBob like this.
         
        05-22-2013, 10:29 PM
      #46
    Weanling
    Getting to the point quickly.
    " I have had Jane for a week and a half. I've done groundwork, free lounging and did a couple 'bombproofing' sessions"

    A week and a half, DOES NOT a trained horse, MAKE. This horse has your number. Go back to basic training, until the horse is well trained, then it will go anywhere you point it. The water is not the issue, the slope is not the issue, BUT training IS.

    Horses are incapable of trust, but they can read your actions, and lack thereof, better than your Mother. Once you have properly trained this horse, this problem will be non existent.
    CowboyBob likes this.
         
        05-23-2013, 01:27 AM
      #47
    Foal
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by bbsmfg3    
    Getting to the point quickly.
    " I have had Jane for a week and a half. I've done groundwork, free lounging and did a couple 'bombproofing' sessions"

    A week and a half, DOES NOT a trained horse, MAKE. This horse has your number. Go back to basic training, until the horse is well trained, then it will go anywhere you point it. The water is not the issue, the slope is not the issue, BUT training IS.

    Horses are incapable of trust, but they can read your actions, and lack thereof, better than your Mother. Once you have properly trained this horse, this problem will be non existent.
    Bob is completely right here. It appears to me that you may not have a water crossing issue, but instead a trust, training, disrespect issue rearing itself out as a water crossing issue. Horses will always be cautious of anything that appears to them to be questionable but once they gain trust in you as a leader and you have trained them to respond in a certain way to your requests, they will move over nearly anything. But you have to build that trust first. Your mare is just a youngster still and I am sure she will make an outstanding horse but you need to be sure you are taking the steps now to get her a good foundation. A four year old has not seen enough of the world yet and you have not spent enough time on her back yet to really create a fearless trail horse. Spend the time getting the foundation and then start tackling obstacle to make her fearless and totally trusting in your judgement.

    Be careful using the "my horse was abused" excuse as well. I have seen many, many horses that were truly abused get over their base fears with patience and a solid approach to training. I have also seen too many horse get away with dangerous disrespect because the owners used the "she was abused" excuse. Treat her like any other horse. Forget any idea of her background and go back and put a solid foundation on her. You will never regret it.

    Good luck, have fun with her and be careful!

    Cheers!
    Les
    CowboyBob likes this.
         
        05-23-2013, 10:18 AM
      #48
    Trained
    I think that the OP recognizes that her horse has a training issue. That is why she wanted to know how to train her horse to cross the creek. It seems like people are trying to beat her up over this. I suspect she is doing fine. If it were me, I would keep working with the horse at home. If I wanted to cross the creek, I would get somebody on another horse to pull her through it. Then as her training improves and her fears subside and she starts to respect her rider more, she will cross fine.
         
        05-23-2013, 11:06 AM
      #49
    Started
    Would it be a good idea to maybe have someony pony the horse across a couple of times and then add the rider?
    Just a thought. I'm sure no expert.
         
        05-23-2013, 12:09 PM
      #50
    Weanling
    I have ponied horses over water because the rider couldn't make the horse go over. IMO, when its a horse that you know will cross water it just "is not in the mood" it works well with or without a rider. But, the times I have "pulled" a horse that would not cross the water because of a lack of experience, it didn't go well, Last time I tried it the horse I was ponying ended up under the horse I was riding.

    After that I really have been thinking about how much it really helps to pony a horse through a trail obstacle. If, its as we have been saying a "training issue" then pony a horse through a obstacle really isn't "the best". Does ponying teach the horse to obey its rider and to move forward into the obstacle? I know you got to get the horse through somehow, otherwise what do you do? Leave them there alone? Or does the ride end just because one person can't get their horse into a creek, or over a log, or onto a bridge? So we "pony up" and pull the horse through the issue. BUT, what does the horse really learn? I think the important part never really gets worked out the horse never goes back home for training/re-training. The "rider" thinks we ponied them through now they are good. Right? I have to admit, there have been times when this is how and what I have thought.

    We have to remember, like you all have been saying, having a problem with a obstacle is only a symptom of a gap in training and really the way to fix that gap is to train/re-train. That training can happen at home in a round pin, arena or out on a trail ride. BUT, training doesn't just happen it takes being intentional with when, where and how we ride and how we deal with trail obstacles and the opportunity they provide.

    Thank you all this has been a really good exercise for me to think through. This is why I really like this forum, it helps me think through the how and why of my training having to put my thoughts into words (sometimes not the best word) really forces me to look at my training methods. And really until now it was something that I didn't do nearly enough.
    Dustbunny and morganarab94 like this.
         

    Tags
    fear, slope, thoroughbred, trail riding, water

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