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Trail Riding Etiquette

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    03-07-2012, 12:08 PM
  #101
Super Moderator
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elky    
No it is not your jobto dress like that, but it is your responsibility to take safe measures throughout life to hopefully prevent accidents or tragidy. Do you not wear a seat belt while in a car or truck? Is it wise to have a fire extinguisher in ones house or home? Is it not wise to drive at night with your lights on? Is it not wise or ones resonsibilyt to salt the icy steps at ones house or business to prevent an accident?

So when the above poster says well said, I say very poorly said.
I wear a seat belt because it is the law.
I have fire extinguishers because fire does not reason, think or act "irresponsibly". Therefore apples to oranges in this context.
I drive at night with lights because it is the law.
I use salt, again, because it is the law. (Most likely written as code violations for not using salt in the above parameters)

As for the last statement, you are certainly allowed to have your own opinion, just as I am.
     
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    03-07-2012, 12:55 PM
  #102
Trained
I thought perhaps the debate over the chances of getting shot during hunting season was getting a little overblown so I did a little google search and I was right (as usual). You have almost twice as much chance of getting hit by lightning than struck by a bullet. Your chances of dying from an accidental shooting is also lower than that of dying from a lightning strike.

While I think it's a good idea to be cautious and wear an orange hat or something while riding I would'nt think it worth all the outrage that I see when this is discussed.


According to the National Weather Service, lightning causes an average of 62 deaths and 300 injuries in the United States each year.

Hunting accidents account for approximately 160 accidental shootings each year, with an average of 50 fatalities.
     
    03-07-2012, 02:36 PM
  #103
Super Moderator
Hmm... I use bing and here is what I found...

-According to the International Hunter Education Association, hunters accidentally shoot more than 1,000 people in the United States and Canada every year.
Just under 100 of those result in fatalities.

http://www.ihea.com/_assets/documents/Incidents/HIC2007Mar08.pdf
There are over 239 shooting with details listed just in this report. Amazing how many were bird related and also as those who "did not identify their target" related. I didn't bother to look at the other incident reports.

Here's the thing about lightning... It is a force of nature. Much like fires and floods. Humans can not control forces of nature. Just can't.

Hunting accidents happen from the hands of humans to other humans.
Any human death from hunting is one death too many.
     
    03-07-2012, 03:11 PM
  #104
Trained
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lockwood    
Hmm... I use bing and here is what I found...

-According to the International Hunter Education Association, hunters accidentally shoot more than 1,000 people in the United States and Canada every year.
Just under 100 of those result in fatalities.


Hunting accidents happen from the hands of humans to other humans.
Any human death from hunting is one death too many.
Okay I find it pretty easy to believe that with the U.S. And Canada COMBINED there are just under 100 fatalities. Canada has about 34 million people and the U.S. Has about 310 million people so your chances of being killed by a hunter are 1:3,440,000. There are about 200 equestrian deaths every year. You are exponentially more likely to be killed by riding than to be shot off your horse by a hunter. The odds of getting in a crash while driving to a trailhead or where your horse is boarded is probably 100 times more likely than getting killed riding your horse. There are about 45,000 auto related deaths per year. You're much more likely to be killed before you ever get close to a hunter.

My point with all this boring crap is that it's nothing to get too worked up about. You should take reasonable precautions to stay safe just like with anything else you do but don't get too worked up about it.
gunslinger and 6gun Kid like this.
     
    03-07-2012, 03:29 PM
  #105
Green Broke
Odds are meaningless.
People choose to ride, choose to drive, choose lots of activities and we make choices about those risks. NO one chooses to get shot by a trespassing hunter.
The general public as well as law enforcement seems to be un caring and ignorant of hunting laws, there is zero enforcement of any of it.
Case in point. 2 minors, hear dogs running across the road aproaching a corn field, grab loaded shotguns, get in truck, drive across road to corn field, jump out of truck grab shotgun and minor A shoots and kills minor B,,,,
News media all over about how tragic oh so sad, boo hooo, NO mention at all of the long list of crimes that led to this, No prosecution of the parents, no prosecution of the other minor, NO MEDIA OUT CRY at the lack of prosecution.
Crimes committed that day,
Minors X 2 illegal unsupervised possession of firearms,
Loaded long arms in a motor vehicle,
Tresspass,
Hun ting within 400 feet of road,
Hunting from a motor vehicle,

But of course zero enforcement or prosecution.
     
    03-07-2012, 04:44 PM
  #106
Trained
The risk of getting shot probably depends on where you are. If there are a lot of hunters, it goes up. If there are a lot of trees to stop bullets, it goes down. If there are tons of trespassers, it goes up.
     
    03-07-2012, 06:44 PM
  #107
Super Moderator
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinshorses    
Okay I find it pretty easy to believe that with the U.S. And Canada COMBINED there are just under 100 fatalities. Canada has about 34 million people and the U.S. Has about 310 million people so your chances of being killed by a hunter are 1:3,440,000. You're much more likely to be killed before you ever get close to a hunter.
What about just plain shot and not killed? That's no picnic either.

My point with all this boring crap is that it's nothing to get too worked up about. You should take reasonable precautions to stay safe just like with anything else you do but don't get too worked up about it.
Easy for you to say, I doubt you have been on the other side of the gun.
You missed the point. I don't think everyone is stitting around chewing their nails saying "Oh dear, oh dear, I'm scared I will be next." Probably not even those of us who have been directly affected.
If a numbers context is better...
I choose to ride MY horse on MY land. I do something irresponsible, get bucked off, hurt myself and or possibly die.
Impact to you- zero
Impact to society- One (although now my son is an orphan, but that's another story)
HUNTER decides to hunt. Whether on his land or public land, anyone withing bullet range is potentially at risk. Hunter makes irresponsible choice resulting in an accident.
Impact to person struck- HUGE
Impact to person's family- Also HUGE
Impact to society- about 1000 people annually in North America.
Impact to society in actual deaths- Immeasurable! And over the years... thousands.

I can not understand this seemingly "Eh, it's only around 100 people each year who get killed, what's the big deal?" attitude. Not to mention the pain, trauma, scars, or disabilities to the 900 or so people who survive each year. All caused at the hands of humans in the name of sport.

My chosen sports or hobbies (riding, skiing, scuba diving, hiking, backpacking, canoeing, kayaking, and crochet) rarely, if ever, have that impact.
Irresponsible hunters in your chosen sport directly effect innocent people. People minding their own business who did NOT ask to be shot.

So, just to make sure I'm not misunderstanding here.... Your right to participate in the sport of hunting is more important that human life, beacuse... well its not too terribly many innocent people getting killed, right?
Ok, perhaps a little snarky, but my point is, people should have the right to be on public land and on their own private property and feel safe from stray bullets.
If I wanted to encounter a stray bullet then I would go running through the game lands during the peak of deer season. It should not happen while I am digging in my garden.
     
    03-07-2012, 06:47 PM
  #108
Super Moderator
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe4d    
odds are meaningless.
People choose to ride, choose to drive, choose lots of activities and we make choices about those risks. NO one chooses to get shot by a trespassing hunter.
The general public as well as law enforcement seems to be un caring and ignorant of hunting laws, there is zero enforcement of any of it.
Case in point. 2 minors, hear dogs running across the road aproaching a corn field, grab loaded shotguns, get in truck, drive across road to corn field, jump out of truck grab shotgun and minor A shoots and kills minor B,,,,
News media all over about how tragic oh so sad, boo hooo, NO mention at all of the long list of crimes that led to this, No prosecution of the parents, no prosecution of the other minor, NO MEDIA OUT CRY at the lack of prosecution.
Crimes committed that day,
Minors X 2 illegal unsupervised possession of firearms,
Loaded long arms in a motor vehicle,
Tresspass,
Hun ting within 400 feet of road,
Hunting from a motor vehicle,

But of course zero enforcement or prosecution.
Agree with you on this one.
I think according to the PA Game Commission, title 34 section 901, the game commission enforces the laws on all things hunting and game related. The game comm. Has a huge "reach" in PA and is not very popular with local law enforcement or the citizens.
Not sure how it is on other states as I'm not inclined to go look it up.

I realize in your example they were after dogs, but if it was deemed a "hunting" accident then perhaps local law enforcements hands were tied. (Didn't say it was right though)
     
    03-07-2012, 09:42 PM
  #109
Green Broke
Delete...
     
    03-08-2012, 09:03 AM
  #110
Green Broke
I think it really comes down to personal responsibility, both of the rider, and of the hunter.

I have every right to ride in the woods during hunting season. Common sense tells me that if I chose to ride where I know there are hunters, that I take reasonable precaution by wearing bright colors and making plenty of noise. Opening weekend is always the time that many of the least experienced hunters are in the woods, so I choose to ride in a place that's closed to hunting.

If I'm the hunter, I have every right to hunt, and again, common sense tells me that every thing that moves isn't a target. It's my responsibility when I pull the trigger, to make sure of my target and what's beyond. No deer is worth the consequences should I do other wise.

What makes the public property worth anything is the ability of the people to use it. We as horsemen and horsewomen continue to fight for access to public land. Hunters face the same task, access to public property.

I'm of the opinion that limiting access to one group makes it easier to limit access to another group. Horsemen and women, ATV'ers, hunters, etc need each other. To exclude one is to exclude all in the end. We'd be better off working together and our lack of cooperation hurts us all.

It's really pretty simple, "Love thy neighbor", and "Treat other people as you wish to be treated".

What goes around, comes around, and misery loves company.
themacpack and kevinshorses like this.
     

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