How are todays WP horses trained? - Page 2 - The Horse Forum

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post #11 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 08:45 PM
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I'm kind of confused :S So Eliz is saying that they basically ride the sh*t out of the horses until they learn to be lazy.. Or 'conserve energy' and just choose to go slow? So let them so around fast paced until they learn it's easier to go slow?
And then others are saying that you just yank on their mouths and jab their sides to get them to slow down. Wouldn't that just make for hard mouthed, cranky horses with tough sides? I think that would totally desensitize a horse would it not?
Sorry. I'm not trying to be arrogant or anything. I truly don't understand this :S
And are there any humane ways that you can suggest to train for the slower gaits? My horses are all speed demons and I hate to be after them all the time. I'm not a yank-er on their mouths but correction seems to be too often to even enjoy the ride :\


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post #12 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 08:55 PM
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Or 'conserve energy' and just choose to go slow? So let them so around fast paced until they learn it's easier to go slow?
that's how my trainer does it.
The others are saying that yanking/jabbing is what alot of people do... not that its the right way. You're right, its not humane and its not useful outside of the WP ring. My horses do more than just WP, so maybe that's why they're different.

Every great dream begins with a dreamer. Always remember, you have within you the strength, the patience, and the passion to reach for the stars to change the world. ~Harriet Tubman
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post #13 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 09:05 PM Thread Starter
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I guess I should let you all in on where I am coming from. I didn't really suspect that there would be such a big difference. When my Dad was training WP horses, he would get them started under saddle just like he would a horse destined for any other discipline. Before he ever started working on headset or speed, they would be confident, comfortable, and flat at all 3 gaits, soft in their mouth, neck reining, and have a very nice solid stop. After they were ready, he would begin to work on controlling their speed. He would work in thousands of circles, walking, trotting, loping and every few strides, he would stop them, back them a couple of steps, and just kinda hold them there for a second. By this time, the horse would be stopping on their butt and tuck their nose when he picked up the reins. He would work trot-stop-back, lope-stop-back the entire time he would ride the horse (maybe an hour or 2 a day, probably 4 days a week). Soon, they would begin to anticipate the stop, they would keep their butt up underneath them and keep their head lower though it would still be level and natural. He calls it "moving with their brakes on". He would never ride these horses in spurs and he produced what I consider the perfect WP horse; controlled, level, truly working from their butt, soft, and responsive. I wish that I had some of those old videos of horse shows on the computer but I have yet to find a good way to get them from the VHS to computer or disc and correct all the tracking errors and such.

Always remember that feeling of looking at a big, open country over the ears of a good horse, seeing a new trail unwind ahead of you, and that ever-spectacular view from the top of the ridge!!! Follow my training blog: http://robertsontraining.blogspot.com/
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post #14 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 09:24 PM
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^
Sounds like a great horseman!
When I start horses I concentrate on a good stop like that. (Almost) Every time I stop them, I ask for the back up. It makes them stop on a dime beautifully with haunches & head tucked with a soft mouth. It sets a good foundation for reining, barrels, (WP too as we just learned lol), and pretty much any discipline that requires hind end engagement.

Every great dream begins with a dreamer. Always remember, you have within you the strength, the patience, and the passion to reach for the stars to change the world. ~Harriet Tubman
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post #15 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 09:38 PM Thread Starter
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That is one of the reasons that I find modern WP horses so wonky looking. I grew up watching his and always liked the way they move. One thing that I always laughed at was the shock on people's faces when Dad would take horses to AQHA shows and show them in Jr. WP, Jr. Reining, Team Roping, and sometimes Working Cow Horse. Usually placing in the top 5 in at least 3 classes.

Always remember that feeling of looking at a big, open country over the ears of a good horse, seeing a new trail unwind ahead of you, and that ever-spectacular view from the top of the ridge!!! Follow my training blog: http://robertsontraining.blogspot.com/
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post #16 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 09:44 PM
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Sorry Eliz, I didn't mean that your trainer's way was inhumane, I meant the kick-yank way. I can see that working but it seems like it would take a long time.
And smrobs, your father sounds like an amazing horseman. I wish I could meet this guy!! LOL
I like how he has a way that is understandable to dopes like me The way you explained it made total sense. I think I actually might try that ... >:)
Hahaha
I think I might try a combination of both on the little mare I am training. Do a good hard workout and then work on the circle with the woah and back.
She has her 'woah' down pat to the point where a little seat shift and vocal cue will stop her dead from a lope (keeping in mind that we haven't been working on it that long).. But I'd really like to get her stopping better on her back end and slowing down her gaits a tad.
Thanks guys :)


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post #17 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 09:46 PM
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Originally Posted by smrobs View Post
That is one of the reasons that I find modern WP horses so wonky looking. I grew up watching his and always liked the way they move. One thing that I always laughed at was the shock on people's faces when Dad would take horses to AQHA shows and show them in Jr. WP, Jr. Reining, Team Roping, and sometimes Working Cow Horse. Usually placing in the top 5 in at least 3 classes.

When I showed WP it was before the peanut rollers.

I actually did it on a dare when I was told that a trained dressage horse could never do WP.

I took up the dare, My horse at the time was doing 1 ( Intermediare 1--2 levels below GP) so other than getting a nice barrel racing saddle ( as I decided to do all the games as well) I did little else.

In 5 shows he placed or won in every event from WP to poles to keyhole to barrels and I never had so much fun.

This was the time when WP WAS a pleasure to ride and watch.
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post #18 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 09:47 PM Thread Starter
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Hey, it works. Worked on every horse he trained and has worked on every horse I have trained too. Of course, they learn better when their sides are heaving and sweat is dripping. Working the butt of a young horse makes a nice solid older horse.

Always remember that feeling of looking at a big, open country over the ears of a good horse, seeing a new trail unwind ahead of you, and that ever-spectacular view from the top of the ridge!!! Follow my training blog: http://robertsontraining.blogspot.com/
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post #19 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 09:51 PM Thread Starter
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Spyder, that is so true. A horse with good solid training should be able to do just about anything you ask of them and do it well. The best one that I remember is one year at the AQHA world show (this was sometime in the 80's), someone approached him to see if he would enter a horse in the barrels just so that they could fill up the class. Apparently a bigger class = more points? Anyway, he entered a mare that he had been reining and roping off of named Showboys Graydoll. Boy was everybody mad when he took 3rd in the barrels on a mare that had never run them before. LOL.

Always remember that feeling of looking at a big, open country over the ears of a good horse, seeing a new trail unwind ahead of you, and that ever-spectacular view from the top of the ridge!!! Follow my training blog: http://robertsontraining.blogspot.com/
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post #20 of 100 Old 07-03-2010, 09:54 PM
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Hey, it works. Worked on every horse he trained and has worked on every horse I have trained too. Of course, they learn better when their sides are heaving and sweat is dripping. Working the butt of a young horse makes a nice solid older horse.
There's nothing wrong with good, long, concentrated rides & wet saddle pads :)

Every great dream begins with a dreamer. Always remember, you have within you the strength, the patience, and the passion to reach for the stars to change the world. ~Harriet Tubman
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