help with odies hooves - The Horse Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 10-08-2019, 10:26 PM Thread Starter
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help with odies hooves

ok so odie has been a mess as of late. he is now just lame AFTER his neurological episode. this was his last trim. you can se in the red the bar i still need to trim but he was less that helpful. i keep cutting the back of the groves along the frog open to try and get that heal to open up. he has been barefoot for YEARS and that heal wont open up. my arabs did nicely but his feet drive me bonkers. he got to long before this last trim because i was unable to get out and trim him so he was a bit late. he was sound before the trim. and he was lame 3 days after (as he has been with EVERY trim for the past few years regardless who trims him). he has some NASTY thrush i have been battling. i won with my arab and out pony mare. rocket is constantly treated with pine tar mixed with copper sulfate painted on his hooves to keep it gone. was doing the same for odie but he is a legitimate mess in multiple ways. im including some past trims and a trim done by a trimmer i hired while pregnant.

note not the best pics but its hard by yourself and his last trim we were in a hurry at the end because it was hot and the misters and fan where starting to not be enough for the baby in the AZ summer. he is due now but the vet dose not recommend trimming. i may rasp his toe back though. we cant find boots (expensive after vet bills and future vet bills for x rays) so we may put the duplo shoes we have on him. see if that helps. will try and buy some ground control shoes for him.
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post #2 of 12 Old 10-09-2019, 05:03 AM
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Jesus!! No wonder he's lame after that trim! He's been scalped! Don't let anyone hack him like that again! See the pink near the apex of the frog in the second last pic? That's the corium showing through the exceedingly thinned sole! He also looks like he's probably laminitic(& lame after any trim... assuming he's had decent ones, tends to be a symptom of that too) & he's got long, high, run forward heels & bars too. Can't say definite about toes from those pics - couple look very 'stretched' & a couple dont. I know you've had plenty of probs finding a good farrier in the past. Sorry to say, and I don't like to judge a farrier's job from just a few pics, but definitely keep looking & don't let this bloke back!

I'd treat him as you would an acute laminitic - deep, soft bedding & pad his feet well - probably use a pad with a 'crescent' cut out to relieve the toe sole.
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Some info I've found helpful; [COLOR=Lime][B]www.horseforum.com/horse-health/hoof-lameness-info-horse-owners-89836/
For taking critique pics; [COLOR=Lime][B]https://www.horseforum.com/members/41...res-128437.jpg
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post #3 of 12 Old 10-09-2019, 01:32 PM Thread Starter
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I am my farrier thank you. the dead sole has been comeing off in one chunk. when i try to leave it long at all he just chips like CRAZY. chips it all off to where its shorter than this. he is not laminitic vet has checked. i have let him go for WEEKS with only wrasping and all i get are massively chipped hooves. he is trimmed every 6 to 8 weeks and not heavily unless im removing toe like in the top pics. the only time this horse has ever been sound after a trim is in shoes and im trying to avoid that. this is what i started with. and what his feet kept doing so im at a loss. any farrier i hired has trimmed the same but left a crap ton of tow or bar.

i had to pay a ferrier while i was pregnant and not only did his hooves suffer but he went dead lame. and all he did was wraps. Negras hooves have been doing fantastic and she is more sound that she has been in a long time. im trying to trim him the same way. the toe at the sole wants to be long but nothing but dead sole at the quarters for about 1/4 inches and its a sudden drop. you know that hard dead sole and bar crud that comes out with just a pull of your nippers even when you only try to trim it? that's all i take out of his sole. same with my arab.

so besides not trimming for a while what can i do to find a happy medium. i leave the soles alone as much as possible. i try to leave on as much wall as possible but like i said he chips them to hell and back. but just the heal and the quarters. his toe is made of steel apparently. i finally got some heel back on him. trying to keep the toe in check since it runs away any given opportunity. trying to deal with thrush and lots of bar. if i leave the overgrown bar alone i find pockets of thrush and nastiness in it.
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post #4 of 12 Old 10-09-2019, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KigerQueen View Post
the only time this horse has ever been sound after a trim is in shoes and im trying to avoid that.
Why? If that is what makes him comfortable and keeps him from chipping then that's what I would do.
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post #5 of 12 Old 10-09-2019, 05:14 PM
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Firstly I find it really difficult to read your posts - so hardly read first one, just that he was lame & then looked at pics. Made the effort with second but punctuation would really help your cause.

Few things that you said...

The vet has probably considered he is not *clinically* acutely laminitic. Doesnt mean he's not sub clinical tho. There are a fair few signs of laminitis aside from lame after trimming, which if this is a regular 'look' could well be only due to the trim... and trimming like that will also cause/contribute to laminitis. Dark yellow in the laminae, bumpy, bulging look to hoof wall, hairline angle, etc. The stretched frog, and how it 'melds' into the sole show it has been a prob long term...

But if this is a regular sort of trim, again, I'm not surprised he is lame & you should consider your trimming may be the reason for - or at least vast majority of reason for his lameness. This is doing him harm.

You should NOT NOT NOT be cutting into the sole with nippers!!! At all! Ever! He obviously has too little depth at the toe anyway so I'd probably not be touching it at all. Certainly wouldnt advise you touch it, when you have removed way more than just dead sole, let alone not just flake bits that will come off soon anyway. You need to first learn what dead, flake sole is, what might be best removed & what shouldn't be touched, before you pick up the tools.

If you're trimming frequently enough, you won't even need nippers anyway for the walls. But I saw you mentioned leaving walls as long as possible - that's another thing you shouldn't be doing. The walls should be short, in relation to the sole plane... assuming adequate sole that is. Which there is not, at the toe at least. The heel and bar walls have been left overgrown and bars at least need trimming, likely contributing to his discomfort. Heel walls can't say from those pics for sure but guessing they could/should be brought down a fair bit.

His weak heels & severe thrush will be likely causing discomfort too & that also needs to be managed and protected and supported. It may be that he won't be able to stand having his heels brought down as much as desirable for his natural balance because of this, but as heels should be lowered gradually, and you will need to pad his feet for some time anyway(& poss always pad the frogs), I'd probably aim to take them down significantly.

The second last sole shot shows exactly where you should almost never trim the sole in the front half of the foot(the clean, trimmed area). It shouldn't be pared, shouldn't be rasped into & absolutely shouldn't be cut into with nips! As well as showing the overgrown bars that have been left weight bearing.

Last 2 pics are different horse, sole shot shows nice, strong & healthy looking frog but also overtrimmed sole, & can't quite tell if hoof wall is visible or you have 'dubbed' it away. Last pic shows the foot has flaring all round.

So... get those feet padded & booted immediately, to prevent further damage. As said I'd treat her as an emergency acute laminitis horse, similar 1st aid.

Some info I've found helpful; [COLOR=Lime][B]www.horseforum.com/horse-health/hoof-lameness-info-horse-owners-89836/
For taking critique pics; [COLOR=Lime][B]https://www.horseforum.com/members/41...res-128437.jpg
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post #6 of 12 Old 10-10-2019, 02:30 AM
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Okay there's a lot going on with his hooves. Hopefully I put you in touch with the right person that can help you. Let me know how it goes.
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post #7 of 12 Old 10-14-2019, 07:46 AM Thread Starter
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well considering he had been trimmed this way for the past 3 or so years without this level of lameness im not going to say that. but id dose not matter anymore anyway. he is getting euthanized on the 24th.
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post #8 of 12 Old 10-16-2019, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KigerQueen View Post
well considering he had been trimmed this way for the past 3 or so years without this level of lameness im not going to say that. but id dose not matter anymore anyway. he is getting euthanized on the 24th.
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post #9 of 12 Old 10-16-2019, 01:10 PM
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Euthanized? Oh no! What happened?

He does not have good feet, and your trims are not working for him, but it is fixable unless something far more severe has happened.
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post #10 of 12 Old 10-16-2019, 01:42 PM
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I'm so sorry you had to come to that decision. It is one of the hardest calls to make. Peace to you Kiger. You'll be in my thoughts and prayers.
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