Horse losing shoes - The Horse Forum
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post #1 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 04:27 PM Thread Starter
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Horse losing shoes

Have any of you had a horse or as a farrier experianced a horse unable to keep shoes on and found wet grass/dew to be the cause? Is there any truth to a wet hoof expanding and loosening the nail holes?

Horse is not over reaching. Shoes are basically falling off. Not being pulled off. Shoes are perfectly straight when found. Farrier is not the culprit as she (the horse) has a history of this problem. Horse has bell boots on 24/7. Only other thing I can think of is just quality of feet being so poor shes becoming unable to keep a shoe on.

Said horse is on double strength farriers formula and Tri acta + HA. Gets hooves cleaned and oiled regularly and doesn't stand in mud or wet other than the pasture grass. Nutritionally wise everyone is happy with where she is at , but has always acknowledged this horse just has bad feet it is her major flaw.

If I was able to keep her barefoot I would but unfortuneatly her predisposed poop feet and the terrain and frequency of riding does not allow that. But if this continues I will have to look into other options (hoof boots or something).

Thanks.

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post #2 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 05:05 PM
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Goodwill, your horse may have "soft" hooves. My wife has over 30 years of horse experience and when I ask her, she had never heard of moisture causing a shoe to fall off.
Hoof boots may be your only option.
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post #3 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 05:16 PM
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Oiling hooves can cause them to be too soft. My farrier says he sees lost shoes on horses that get oiled regularly than hooves that can dry.
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post #4 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 08:19 PM
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What kind of shoe? Hot or cold shod?

If the underlying trim is inadequate, the shoe won't sit right. Too long, uneven, ect.

The solution to my lost shoe problem was clips, hot shoeing, and maturity. We're at two months without bell boots without a lost shoe.
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post #5 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 08:51 PM
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I have a horse that I cannot give a water tank to during the summer when it's hot. He will stand in it til he gets so hungry, he has to go eat. Then right back in the tank. And yes, it will ruin his feet as they become so soft he can't hold a shoe. I would suggest no oil on your horse's feet. Let them dry and get naturally hard.
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post #6 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 10:11 PM
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Hi,

If the horse is on constantly - or mostly - wet footing, this will cause hooves to be softer, weaker, prone to distortion, infection etc. Dry - or at least mostly dry - footing is best for horses' hooves.

If you've ever looked at trimmed sections of wall material in the summer, after a day or so, you will know that yes, dry hooves shrink, contract(which would make nail holes looser), and moisture keeps/makes them 'expanded'. But I don't think that's relevant, or the reason for your issues. For one, outer hoof wall is impervious to moisture, unless cracked, etc. And the inner hoof wall is 'moist'(more so closer to the laminae, less so further out) anyway. So wet footing will allow the sole & ground surface of inner wall to absorb too much moisture. Cracked areas of wall, and in nail holes will absorb too. But not deeply. IF it's about too much moisture, see paragraph above.

Not saying farrier is necessarily to blame, but I don't believe, just because horse has had 'history' of this prob rules out bad farriery in the least. Yes, I think poor quality hooves, maybe just from too wet footing, quite possibly from other factors too, including the way the horse is shod, is the probable cause.

Nutrition can well be a cause of weak feet - can't make a good cake without all the right ingredients! So perhaps the Farrier's Formula is a good option for her. (Tri acta appears to be a joint supp so not sure if it's got anything in it good for hooves) It's important too for nutrition to be well balanced, and depends what's in the horse's diet as to what she needs in a supp to 'fill all the gaps', so if you haven't best to do a diet analysis, then you can work out whether the FF is indeed an appropriate supp for her & whether it's providing all she needs.

Oiling hooves does nothing at all for their health & is potentially problematic, esp if she is in wet footing/there may already be infection present. It not only potentially softens hooves, but seals in moisture & infection... and hoof infections are almost invariably anaerobic - thrive in airless environs. So I'd save the hoof oil for cosmetic only 'prettying' of healthy feet only.

How is she shod? Conventional rims, or...? How is her hoof balance? How often is she trimmed & what terrain is she worked on? I ask because I don't believe that shoes - even steel peripheral rims - are necessarily a bad thing, but it depends, and especially with already unhealthy feet, they tend to be too compromising, just make matters worse. Therefore, regardless how she's shod, I suspect she would still be better off shoeless, at least until her feet can become healthy & strong.

Most horses need artificial protection/support for some situations at least, and especially if she has such weak feet, she will likely need hoof boots, or some form of artificial protection for some things at least, but unless she's really bad, she will likely be fine barefoot at home in her paddock though - should only need extra protection for some/all 'work'.

You might like to post some pics of her hooves here. If you do, please first take a look at the link in my signature line below for what's required of hoof photos.

Some info I've found helpful; [COLOR=Lime][B]www.horseforum.com/horse-health/hoof-lameness-info-horse-owners-89836/
For taking critique pics; [COLOR=Lime][B]https://www.horseforum.com/members/41...res-128437.jpg

Last edited by loosie; 05-31-2019 at 10:18 PM.
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post #7 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 10:56 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverMaple View Post
Oiling hooves can cause them to be too soft. My farrier says he sees lost shoes on horses that get oiled regularly than hooves that can dry.
Yes. But regularly is defined by what. They are not oiled daily. Sometimes weekly sometimes by weekly. When her feet dry they split and she already has plenty quarter cracks that have damaged the coronary band .

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post #8 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 10:57 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ApuetsoT View Post
What kind of shoe? Hot or cold shod?

If the underlying trim is inadequate, the shoe won't sit right. Too long, uneven, ect.

The solution to my lost shoe problem was clips, hot shoeing, and maturity. We're at two months without bell boots without a lost shoe.
Cold shod. They are steel shoes with side clips. I have been through every farrier within 5 hours of this area. Noone can keep shoes on her for a full rotation.

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post #9 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 10:58 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TeeZee View Post
I have a horse that I cannot give a water tank to during the summer when it's hot. He will stand in it til he gets so hungry, he has to go eat. Then right back in the tank. And yes, it will ruin his feet as they become so soft he can't hold a shoe. I would suggest no oil on your horse's feet. Let them dry and get naturally hard.
Her feet dont really ever get hard. When they get dry they just chip and crack worse. She already has numerous permanent cracks that have damaged the coronet band.

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post #10 of 109 Old 05-31-2019, 11:07 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loosie View Post
Hi,

If the horse is on constantly - or mostly - wet footing, this will cause hooves to be softer, weaker, prone to distortion, infection etc. Dry - or at least mostly dry - footing is best for horses' hooves.

If you've ever looked at trimmed sections of wall material in the summer, after a day or so, you will know that yes, dry hooves shrink, contract(which would make nail holes looser), and moisture keeps/makes them 'expanded'. But I don't think that's relevant, or the reason for your issues. For one, outer hoof wall is impervious to moisture, unless cracked, etc. And the inner hoof wall is 'moist'(more so closer to the laminae, less so further out) anyway. So wet footing will allow the sole & ground surface of inner wall to absorb too much moisture. Cracked areas of wall, and in nail holes will absorb too. But not deeply. IF it's about too much moisture, see paragraph above.

Not saying farrier is necessarily to blame, but I don't believe, just because horse has had 'history' of this prob rules out bad farriery in the least. Yes, I think poor quality hooves, maybe just from too wet footing, quite possibly from other factors too, including the way the horse is shod, is the probable cause.

Nutrition can well be a cause of weak feet - can't make a good cake without all the right ingredients! So perhaps the Farrier's Formula is a good option for her. (Tri acta appears to be a joint supp so not sure if it's got anything in it good for hooves) It's important too for nutrition to be well balanced, and depends what's in the horse's diet as to what she needs in a supp to 'fill all the gaps', so if you haven't best to do a diet analysis, then you can work out whether the FF is indeed an appropriate supp for her & whether it's providing all she needs.

Oiling hooves does nothing at all for their health & is potentially problematic, esp if she is in wet footing/there may already be infection present. It not only potentially softens hooves, but seals in moisture & infection... and hoof infections are almost invariably anaerobic - thrive in airless environs. So I'd save the hoof oil for cosmetic only 'prettying' of healthy feet only.

How is she shod? Conventional rims, or...? How is her hoof balance? How often is she trimmed & what terrain is she worked on? I ask because I don't believe that shoes - even steel peripheral rims - are necessarily a bad thing, but it depends, and especially with already unhealthy feet, they tend to be too compromising, just make matters worse. Therefore, regardless how she's shod, I suspect she would still be better off shoeless, at least until her feet can become healthy & strong.

Most horses need artificial protection/support for some situations at least, and especially if she has such weak feet, she will likely need hoof boots, or some form of artificial protection for some things at least, but unless she's really bad, she will likely be fine barefoot at home in her paddock though - should only need extra protection for some/all 'work'.

You might like to post some pics of her hooves here. If you do, please first take a look at the link in my signature line below for what's required of hoof photos.

This horses hoof wall is less than half the thickness of a normal horses hoof. And she has numerous quarter cracks on each hoof. I've been through about every single farrier in this area I am lucky to even have one at all as I know a lot of people who cannot get anyone at all. This one does a great job.

I've already had a hay and pasture analysis and she is on a ration balancer according to those levels. This horse sees a nutritionist regularly and all of that stuff is in good order.

Her shoes are steel with side clips. Her hoof balance is good. She is trimmed every 6 weeks. She is worked on all terrain. Sand. Clay. Roads (pavement) and gravel. Her feet have never and will likely never be healthy and strong unfortuneatly. Ive owned this horse for 7 years. She really cannot go without shoes. She will be lame lame lame. Her soles have bruised to the point of almost gushing out blood when i once tried gradually introducing her to the same terrain to "toughen her up" had a lame horse for weeks.

She is a Barrel horse in the making so barefoot really doesn't accommodate us right now even if she had good feet. Which i wish she did. But the amount we travel on roads and gravel is just too much for her. She only has front shoes but she does go a bit tender on the hinds if we ride on gravel a lot.

"Your fear often contains your greatest growth."
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