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Honest critique wanted: 2Yr old filly with dubious past

6K views 40 replies 15 participants last post by  muumi 
#1 ·
Hi all you knowledgable peoples...

As part of my current decision making process, I would really like some honest opinions of this filly, from people who don't know her personally.

But some info: 2 year old, filly, 15hh at the moment, mixed breed and as I said in the title, dubious past... Here she is when she arrived round Christmas, wild as a hare:





Very skinny, and summer coat, albeit a very staring and rough coat due to the condition she was in.

Here she is now, gaining weight (slowly, on a vet approved diet), and in her winter coat.









I hope these pics are ok for critique, was alone, and kind of in a hurry... bad me. And I forgot to take any from the other side... :oops:

And for those of you that remember her, and helped me pick her way back when... I hope this thread also serves as an update: she is doing so well! And I am more than relieved not to be able to see every bone in her spine anymore...

Thanks so much for looking!
 
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#3 ·
She looks better and will continue to improve. With some proper work she should shape up better also when she starts developing some muscle tone. The thing that sticks out as a neg. is her hind end and legs. They just don't look right to me.

Are you doing anything with her to develope some balance and shape her up a bit?
 
#4 · (Edited)
Thanks so much Ripper and Churumbeque for your quick and positive responses.

Yes, her hind end and legs have had me up at night, I don't really know enough about the skeletal structure of horses though, to be able to see what is going on.
I haven't done much with her at all, due to her age and condition. As she was unhandle-able when she arrived, its been about groundwork, trust exercises, join-up and especially, learning to stand for the farrier.

But, I am sooo up for suggestions, Churumbeque, what exercises would you suggest for her at this point? Any help would be appreciated so much...
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#5 ·
Ist off I am not about lunging or round penning for exercise but more for training. You horse is immature physically and I would treat her as such.
Either round penning or lunging I would work on getting her to do a relax extended walk where she can get her body freed up and moving. Work on her length of stride in the rear being equal to length of stride in the front end.

It took me a long time to learn this but it has been some of the most valuable things I have learned.

Voice commands are important to get down pat so they don't break gait when you push them on and get them to use there hind end. You will need to push her forward with a lunge whip and not break into a trot to get a good extended walk.

I then would work on lengthening the trot with expecting her to take some time and conditioning to be able to do it for any length of time. It is important that she keeps her head down and relaxed so as not to develop the underside of her neck.

I would also get skilled at long lining so you can get more control as your training progresses. But I don't want to bombard you with information all at once.
 
#6 ·
So I am posting 2 different pictures so you get an idea. The driving picture she is pulling her around by her front end. Look at her length of stride, the front is much larger than the rear and she is out of balance.

I spent many months trying to improve her balance and stride and as you can see her stride is much nicer in the lunging photo. Both of these photo's are when she was 3 in the early stages of training.

Had I known more ab9out stride I would have started working on this on the ground though as a yearling. I also keep my circles large so not to stress her legs
 

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#11 ·
thanks so much for your suggestions and for taking the time to post them... I have already started booking bi-monthly 'lessons' with this filly with one of my instructors, of which we have already had one lesson (mostly centered around trust and desensitisation), but I will also show him your comments, so that even if I will struggle on my own, he can work with me to effectively be able to achieve the extension and balance that you mentioned. So don't worry about bombarding me... I am taking notes :)
 
#7 ·
Nice job on her so far. In the next 1-2 years she is going to look a lot better as she gets more mature and muscled up. She should look more balanced in time.

The one thing that I am seeing is she is sickled hocked on the back end. Also, front pasterns look a bit more angled than they should be - but this may be the trim or the way she is standing since she isn't fully squared up.

What would you like to do with her in the future?
 
#13 ·
I didnt get her for a particular job... I just wanted to help out at that point.

But I ride English, and I wouldn't mind her being a trail companion/pleasure horse and do some lower level competing, in whatever, for fun. If there is something in particular she takes to, I'm all for that!
 
#8 ·
I'm not going to pick on her confo, as I've seen people fall out of love with a perfectly good horse because of someone picking on small or even large faults that don't affect the way the horse goes or its soundness.

She's a lovely looking little filly who is going to grow up and fill out and be very nice to own. Do you have a 2nd horse who is under saddle, that you either own or can use, to pony her around with? Taking her out on a pony line and riding with her, everywhere over every kind of terrain you can think of, will do WONDERS for her over all shape and it will start getting her ready to be a steady, unflappable mount.
 
#12 ·
Your first sentence is one of the most amazing things I have read in a while (especially for the state of mind I am in right now), I will definitely remember it and quote you on that if I may!

As for ponying her, it actually just thought about it today as well, and I was wondering whether it would be beneficial... so I will definitely start doing that! Thanks so much for the suggestion.

She certainly does battle a lot with being nervous about a lot of things, she was kept in a small pen for almost two years before she came to me, so its almost like she's been in a sensory deprivation tank in a manner of speaking.

I have started taking her out on hand-walks on trails recently, and although it started out pretty nerve-wracking, she has made a bunch of progress, which I am so proud of her for.
 
#9 ·
there is definitely something off about her back end. She has a very small him compared to the proportions of the rest of her body and she looks like she might be a little cow-hocked. Her hips might just need proper development to look nicer and once her body and weight get regulated to whatever her job will be, I think, she will start to shape up nicely. In all she is a very lovely looking horse.
 
#10 ·
Again, thanks to all of you for your wonderful and positive comments...

You cannot imagine how much I appreciate it! Its the first time I have taken on a horse like this, and I've been worried sick about some thing or another along the way... and its just so amazing to hear people say that it will end up ok. This is truly why I love this forum, its the honesty, the knowledge and more than all that, its the compassion that one receives that really helps a lot of people that feel overwhelmed in a situation. Its certainly helping me.
 
#17 ·
She looks lovely to me.. Since she's a youngster she's still missing all the muscle that will make her really pretty. I'd guess she has some Quarter in her as she's slightly overbuilt, and most Quarters are. This makes her a bit less suitable for dressage (mainly high degrees of collection), but you said that was not your plan for her, so no biggie. The cow-hocked thing is so slight, that I don't think it will ever be a problem. It might just be a posture thing due to lack or increased tension (unlikely in a young one) of muscles that will completely disappear as you start working her. The way horses hold their body (and where they put their feet) doesn't necessarily have to be a conformation problem, unless they consistently show it as they progress through training (my horse has his front feet slightly turned to the inside, but it doesn't bother him or us in any way).
 
#18 ·
her back legs do look a little off to me but....shes a 2 yr old and shes growing so im guessing alot of what looks hinky to me is that she is growing so her hind end in that picture is higher. she looks great tho! gotta love Palis! i think once you get some more muscle built up shell start shaping up better and be one BEAUTIFUL mare!
 
#24 ·
I think she is a cutey and you have done a great job with her! Right now her hind legs look too long for her, but as she is still growing I wouldn't stress about it too much. She may grow out of it, or she may not, but I don't think it is likely to be a big problem for her if you are not looking for a high lever competition horse. She has a super cute face/neck too :).
 
#28 ·
A wise horseman once said, "Look at the horse at 3 days, 3 weeks, 3 months and then not again til 3 years.". What he meant was avoid being over critical at the gawky stages (yearling uglies ring a bell?) and to wait until the horse has had time to develop a bit once they've past the "baby adorable" phase. This little filly is only 2 and still growing, which she'll likely do until she's 5 PLUS she's being rehabbed from being uncared for. She looks a whole lot better than she did in her first 2 pics and in 6 more months she'll look a whole lot better than she did in the 2nd set of pics. Because she was not cared for, she may lack the tone in her legs to correct the cow hocked stance that many young horses have in the beginning. They lose that stance once they are steady on their feet, eating well and playing to build the muscle and tone needed to hold their legs straight. If she was kept in a small corral or stall, she may not have ever had the chance to correct that.

So rather than say something that may end up not true later on, I want to wait and see this filly again in 6 months and at that point I may say something. Right now I don't see anything wrong with her that good groceries, exercise and time won't cure.

We DO get so wrapped around in pedigrees and bloodlines that we miss a perfectly good animal standing in front of us, and I'm one of the WORST in that regard. Helping out an animal who doesn't have all your "must have criteria" is pretty pure selflessness and needs to be applauded. Good job Muumi, she's looking awesome, keep it up.
 
#30 ·
Thanks so much for your kind and awesome words... they are really helping me to get a little more grounded and a lot less stressed.

Before I picked her up, I went to visit all the youngsters at the facilities where they were kept to pick her, and as far as I could see, they were kept their entire lives in small pens, so when she arrived home with me, what struck me was that more than just being skinny, she just had no muscle whatsoever... her neck was hollow, from the back her thighs were gaunt, her chestbone stuck out, and I could see every bone in her spine.

It was so hard for me to pick one of the youngsters back then... they were all really scared and in bad shape, and it was a very overwhelming situation for me, that I didn't feel in control of.

Ugh... I have a lot to say about where she came from, etc... but its just quite hard to talk about.

Anyway, you're right... I realise now that I'm judging her at the worst possible time now... she is starting to fill out in all the previously hollow places, but she is far from developed, and on top of that, she is still growing.

I think I will stop worrying for now... and start exercising her more actively, as many people suggested, and keep up with the groceries, and then update in 6 months or so... hopefully it will be a pleasant surprise!

She is a terribly sweet little lady... with regards to her personality, I couldn't really have asked for anything more.

Thanks so much for your input and support, Dreamcatcher, it means a lot to me.
 
#33 ·
While it does seem you've been deworming her frequently, what has she been wormed with and was there an FEC done to identify the parasites that you needed to target? If she is carrying a parasite load that is not addressed by the product(s) you have used you are just throwing away money on a "cure" that doesn't address the ill ;-)
 
#39 ·
Yes, that is great advice... thanks so much! I haven't done a fecal for her, I will admit, and have only been deworming with the type of dewormer my vet suggests to me for the time of year etc. But it has been on my mind, and I will definitely ask for one now.

Somes times horses develop a pot belly when there protein is not high enough......in other words if you have a low quality hay that is coarse this could also create a pot belly.

Super Nova
This could be a problem, as I am not sure about the nutritional content of our hay at the moment... we don't have as many options of hay, it seems, as you get in the US... in fact I think there are only two main types, of which Teff hay is the most popular. Anyway, I digress. I am about to make my next months order of feed and hay this week anyway, so I will ask if they can give me a breakdown of the nutritional value of it.

I am late on this train, but I personally think she has a lot of potential. I love that light coat. It always makes a palomino look a little more magical. She definitely needs some more time and patience and needs some more on her bones, but she looks SO much better than her first pics.

And I have to say...I'm very curious about the "dubious past" part. haha
Thank you! I also prefer the lighter palomino's to the darker ones, but I think its probably because I'm biased towards her a little bit... ha ha!

I was thinking I should mention her shady past, just for clarity, so here's a summarised version: (I find it quite hard to talk about, so I think I tend to avoid it as much as possible)

She's from a local facility that breeds a batch of horses each year to be used for medical testing... specifically, vaccine testing. The youngsters were usually sent to slaughter after they were used, so there were really no efforts made to ensure the horses would have futures as riding horses: they weren't trained, handled properly or anything like that. Due to public pressure, they started releasing the horses to the public to be adopted; have stopped breeding apparently; and are making efforts in eliminating using live horses from their program altogether.

I'm not sure if I can/should post links or state names here on this forum, which is why I've been kind of careful about it. But if anyone is interested in knowing more... just let me know.

I agree somewhat with this statement and I'm glad you brought it up Dreamcatcher. Firstly, (barring major conformational flaws of course) most people are unlikely to truly require a conformationally perfect horse. Unless you are riding competitively in the mid to upper level echelons, or you are riding long and hard on a regular basis, minor conformational faults generally bear little significance to the average horse owner. Minor faults are unlikely to have much effect on a horse's ability to be a wonderful mount.

However, it is useful to know what those faults are, as in many cases the appropriate strengthening and/or training can have immense benefit to the horse, and therefore to the horse/rider combo. Getting the most out of what you have so to speak. So I think that honest critiques can be very useful, providing that the person receiving the critique is prepared to be objective about their horse, rationally assess the information and possibly undertake a course of action that will complement the faults that are highlighted.

To anyone that has fallen out of love with their horse due to a few conformational flaws - fall back in love cos trust me, most of us have less than perfect horses (we just don't like to admit it :wink:).
Absolutely wonderfully said! I really feel like there are so many people who would benefit from reading this, as I have...

Thank you so so much!
 
#36 ·
I am late on this train, but I personally think she has a lot of potential. I love that light coat. It always makes a palomino look a little more magical. She definitely needs some more time and patience and needs some more on her bones, but she looks SO much better than her first pics.

And I have to say...I'm very curious about the "dubious past" part. haha
 
#40 ·
Well now, I feel like I made this thread awkward and scared everyone off when I explained where she's from, ha ha! (awkward laughter)

So... I'm just going to post a link here... and everyone can just read up about it if they want. I feel like no one believes me when I tell this tale, but I know it sounds pretty unbelievable I guess, IDK.
 
#41 ·
OK... so hay update...
I feed them Eragrostis hay, but I wasn't sure whether everyone here on this forum would know about it, so I googled it, and it seems that its grown in the US as well, so maybe there are some opinions on that?

The only other hay options available here are Teff hay, but it has recently gotten so expensive, and costs twice as much as the Eragrostis, and obviously we have lucerne (alfalfa I believe its called too), but we don't feed that ad lib.

My feed store reassured me that the Eragrostis, although slightly lower in protein than the Teff, is of good quality, and should not give me digestive concerns. My other horses don't have hay bellies and are healthy and shiny coated...

They are all out to pasture during the day, and stabled at night, with hay. And are also fed a pelleted grain mixture that I know is of excellent quality as it was suggested to me by a vet, and the amount of which to feed was also determined by the vet for each individual horse.

I really don't know why I'm writing this... except that maybe someone has an opinion on Eragrostis hay specifically? Unless there are objections, I really would like to keep feeding it, based on my budget only. Of course I like Teff more, but the prices have shot up so much... :(
 
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