Seeking advice - Page 3 - The Horse Forum
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post #21 of 31 Old 06-20-2019, 05:48 PM
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Sorry didn't see page 2 until the above posted. Smokey Black and likely roan. If the inner ears are light then nd1 could be part of the genetic makeup. I say could be because I have had and know of one other that had light inner ears but was not nd1.
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post #22 of 31 Old 06-20-2019, 07:36 PM Thread Starter
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The mare is underweight.. I feel guilty as I said before, I checked up on her every 2 or so weeks if I could. He said this has been progressing over time, so it is likely I completely missed the signs of it. He still wants the mare & baby back, he came over today to check up on the baby.. he thinks he is a blue roan, what he wanted. (Said he looks more "blue" today.) if he got this mare back she would be bred back. I told him about my vet, how he diagnosed her with DSLD and he simply brushed it off.
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post #23 of 31 Old 06-20-2019, 07:41 PM Thread Starter
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I told my vet, my vet has never had him in his office so he's never taken his animals here. (He is the local livestock vet!) My vet is looking into him and his other animals. I hope they are nothing like this mare that I had.
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post #24 of 31 Old 06-20-2019, 07:42 PM Thread Starter
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I found the stud, he is Rnrn & Ee.
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post #25 of 31 Old 06-20-2019, 07:45 PM Thread Starter
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I'm not sure about the mares genetics as I never got her tested when I had her. She is out of two buckskins.
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post #26 of 31 Old 06-21-2019, 12:08 PM
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So the additional info on the genetics doesn't help narrow it down unfortunately, it's simply proving that all those things ARE a possibility, that's why hidden genes are so interesting!

Don't feel guilty! You're doing SO much for this mare and I can completely understand what a frustrating situation this must be!! She is SO lucky to have you and this foal too! I would ask him flat out at what price he would be willing to sell her for. I would remind him that she used to be yours and you've done x y and z to help out at no charge to him. I wouldn't fight with him just say you regret selling her and want her back. A price similar to what she would sold for would be more then fair given her condition (it SHOULD be much less but if he wants her so badly...). Pretty much any horse can produce blue roan (black + roan), the special thing about your mares color is she guarantees a cream gene (so ironically this foal CANNOT be black at best it can be smokey black, unfortunately that can look the same). So there's nothing special about her color that another horse can't produce if that's what his goal is.

I am not surprised the only vet doesn't know him! Yikes! I'm glad you have a good vet who is taking this seriously and will check the guy out, hopefully there's something that can be done and if the vet himself makes a report it will carry a LOT more weight. I'd give it a little more time and then touch bases with him. I sort of hope the other animals are in similar condition, just because that way something can be done about it. At best he is providing minimal care but I hope it can be proven he is providing less then minimal so someone can step in.
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post #27 of 31 Old 06-21-2019, 08:34 PM
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Roan is special because it is linked to extension. If the sire has red foals then you know he is Ee. If he has had blue roans out of nonroan mares then roan is linked to E and any black that inherits his E will be roan. I didn't go back to see if there was other info on the sire or foals by him.

If he were Ee and roan was linked to e then any red babies would be roan.
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post #28 of 31 Old 06-21-2019, 11:11 PM
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Sorry Op but I'm going to highjack your thread for a minute.

@QtrBel , I want to see if I'm understanding what you are saying about roan and I'm going to use the example of 2 mares I bought as 3 in one deals.

Mare #1 was sorrel quarter horse. When bred by a blue roan stallion foal #1 was a red roan and foal #2 was a bay roan.

Mare #2 was a red roan qh. When bred by the same blue roan stallion both foal #1 and foal #2 were solid black.

Obviously the first mare was eeAa while the second mare was eeRnrn (agouti unknown but probably aa) and the sire was EeRnrn. So the stallion could only pass on roan through his red gene? As for the roan mare not passing on roan that was just luck of the draw? Do I have that right? Very interesting. Genetics have come a long way since I thought I understood them. LOL

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post #29 of 31 Old 06-22-2019, 09:52 AM
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I am slowly coming up to speed with it and am trying to absorb as much as I find it fascinating. It is all about location and proximity of the genes. There are cases where the gene "jumps" and links to the allele it wouldn't normally pair with. But my understanding is if a Ee stallion that is roan has foals that are red roan and black roan he would be rn/RN with roan attached to e and he is passing eRN. If he only had black roans then the RN would be attached to the E and only those that got E would be roan and since E is dominant they would all be black. The ones that got the e would be non roan as it is not attached to that. To confuse matters further it is located where tobiano is located so if you have a roan tobiano then you would need to know which is attached to what to determine who gets the tobiano or who gets the roan. Easy if stallion is Ee as all Es would get what is attached there and all e what is attached to that so say E(RN) and e (T) get would be black roan if inheriting E(RN) but if they got the e then T would be what is passed. In that case they could still be black if that is what they got from the mare but would be carrying that T from the sire along with his e.
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post #30 of 31 Old 06-22-2019, 11:04 AM
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@QtrBel , being more awake this morning I realized I had it wrong because for the bay roan the sire would have had to pass on his E with roan and with the red roan he would have passed on e with roan since the mare was ee with no roan. All were solid quarter horses, no paints.

R.I.P. JC 5/19/85 - 12/9/14. You made my life better.
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