Foundered mare still needs to drop some weight - Page 3 - The Horse Forum
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post #21 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 02:51 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Yogiwick View Post
Agree she is not losing because she's WAY overfed. Wonder what she was getting before.

1.5% of ideal weight in hay. Empower if needed (you can cut that out too if it's too much but it's a balancer correct?). NO beet pulp. Beet pulp is BEST at putting weight on a horse!

I'm not surprised she's still sore. You want her on the lean end esp with her foot issues..and now she has extra lbs to carry on top of all that.What does the vet say? Do get x-rays. I'm concerned that the horse has been lame for 5 months..

Why does she need hard feed when she's getting the Empower?

I hate weight tapes. My Arab is 14.2 or so and about 850 and is a stocky Polish/Crabbet..

Weight loss shouldn't be that hard.
Before I took over feed, and my grandpa was feeding, he was giving her 5lbs of Strategy and 2lbs or so of cracked corn a day, plus sweet feed for snacks. Unlimited Timothy hay too. He is awful about sneaking feed, I've had to get on him quite a bit with her. Thankfully he's not at the barn much anymore and when he is, he knows better then to mess with her.

She's not getting any hard feed just the ration balancer . Just the 1lb of Balance with her beet pulp. I'll cut out the beet pulp, I've heard the no molasses added one was good for weight loss, which is why she was on it.

X-rays were done and she had mild rotation, we caught it early. My vet thinks that a bad farrier was what really set her off more so then diet.

She's not lame. But ouchy on hard ground, which is where my pen is for lunging.
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post #22 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 02:59 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by loosie View Post
Definitely cut the beet pulp. If she 'throws a fit' because others have more, separate her, so she doesn't steal theirs. As beet pulp and also the empower are high in calcium & have no magnesium, I'd definitely get as much of that into/onto (it's very absorbable through the skin) her. I'd personally do away with the empower & just give her a low dose 'ration balancer' or such, with maybe a handful of copra meal or such, to mix other mins in.

If she needs that much hay to keep her going through the day, you may need to soak & drain it before feeding, or put a grazing muzzle on her part time, to slow consumption further.
She does get Remission. Is that enough magnesium? She is on 2 scoops a day.

What about a vit/min mix instead of a ration balancer?

I really hate to cut back her hay. I just feel so guilty letting her see her herd mates pig out while she "starves". She's alreaduy quite ****y about getting the 1inch hay nets and her limited rations. The poor girl thinks she's dying.

I can get Bahia hay. Is that okay for foundered?
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post #23 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 03:03 AM
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Originally Posted by alexischristina View Post
She's not losing weight because you're over feeding. A horse needs 1.5 - 2.5 % of their ideal body weight per day in hay if you're trying to get them to lose. I would cut the hay down to 20 pounds tops, cut out the beet pulp all together.

I would get in touch with your vet and ask what percentage they think you should be feeding.
I agree entirely; overfed. She is getting 27 pounds between hay and feed. Others have already offered some good advice, but if you want numbers...

If you want her at 850 pounds:
1.5% of her body weight is 12.75 pounds
2% is 17 pounds
2.5% is 21.25 pounds

If you aim for 825 pounds:
1.5% is 12.38 pounds
2% is 16.5 pounds
2.5% is 20.63 pounds


I'll just add that having hay always available doesn't work for every horse, especially those with metabolic issues or founder. Slow feed nets are great, and if that doesn't work having her meals spaced out throughout the day won't kill her. Free choice/always available hay is unheard of where I am, though that's not to say I wouldn't prefer it if it was available. In Misty's case the extra weight from the hay will be more harmful than intermittent feedings. Sometimes you have to weigh the options and choose the lesser of two evils. Good luck!
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post #24 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 03:12 AM Thread Starter
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Quick question guys. She's kept with Rebel since Ty passed, and I do know she's been finishing her hay net first and going to his, though their isn't much left since he's a piglet, though thankfully not as easy of a keeper as she is, and is at the perfect weight.

Do I have to totally separate them for hay too? Or would it hurt him to get the same amount of hay as her in spaced out feedings?

He's 14.3, stocky little Mustang cross, and is about 900 (havent taped him recently so might be off) which is perfect for him.

If I throw out 5lbs in the morning of hay in the slow feeder, and another 5 lbs when I get home, and then another 5lbs before bed for each of them, would that work?

So 6am, 4pm and 11pm for hay.

I really don't want to separate them if I don't have too. Misty was moping so bad after Ty died, and Rebel's perked her back up. I don't want her sulking again.
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post #25 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 03:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Rain Shadow View Post
She does get Remission. Is that enough magnesium? She is on 2 scoops a day.

What about a vit/min mix instead of a ration balancer?

I really hate to cut back her hay. I just feel so guilty letting her see her herd mates pig out while she "starves". She's alreaduy quite ****y about getting the 1inch hay nets and her limited rations. The poor girl thinks she's dying.

I can get Bahia hay. Is that okay for foundered?
But she's NOT 'starving' and she will get over it. In the long run you're doing her no favours by feeding her extra just to keep her happy... you need to cut her hay, or nothing's going to change.

Why can't you lunge her on softer ground? You don't need a round pen for lunging. I've done so in my arena, back yard, paddock if I have to. She needs some exercise.
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post #26 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 03:17 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jazzy475 View Post
Have to feed for their ideal weight not their current weight. I'am sure you know this already.

I just can't keep quiet gotta get in my 2 cents worth.
This right here is where I'm messing up. I am feeding for her current weight, not ideal. Duh moment.

Now just gotta figure out how to get her onto the super diet plan. She's going to smother me in my sleep with her copious amounts of fat.
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post #27 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 03:19 AM Thread Starter
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But she's NOT 'starving' and she will get over it. In the long run you're doing her no favours by feeding her extra just to keep her happy... you need to cut her hay, or nothing's going to change.

Why can't you lunge her on softer ground? You don't need a round pen for lunging. I've done so in my arena, back yard, paddock if I have to. She needs some exercise.

I know. I know. I just feel quilty. She was rescued from a starvation situation before I got her, and I keep thinking of that when cutting. I'm far to soft hearted with her for my own good.

Not an option. My grandfather owns the property and riding and running is only allowed in one pen so we don't tear up the property. Only so much I can do when I'm just boarding here.
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post #28 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 03:23 AM
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I know. I know. I just feel quilty. She was rescued from a starvation situation before I got her, and I keep thinking of that when cutting. I'm far to soft hearted with her for my own good.

Not an option. My grandfather owns the property and riding and running is only allowed in one pen so we don't tear up the property. Only so much I can do when I'm just boarding here.
Then take her for hand walks, get her moving. Even if it's around the paddock or around the barn or up and down the road. Anything to get her feet moving.
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post #29 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 03:27 AM Thread Starter
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She actually is good about moving around. She is a pacer when her food runs out, and she runs and plays when turned out into the bigger 2 acre paddock area.

I can probably pony her off of Harley or Star or hand walk.
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post #30 of 33 Old 01-31-2015, 05:28 AM
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Yayyy, my pet peeve, founder/ laminitis/IR
First and foremost, if she's still ouchy on hard ground, her trim is definitely not right and she's not quite over the founder. Can you take pics of her feet? Loosie has a how-to link in her signature
Second, diet. Horses shouldn't go more than 4 hours without hay, or the stomach acids start eating away on the stomach lining=ulcers, plus, once they eat, insulin spikes, which you definitely want to avoid with a most likely insulin resistant horse like Misty. Has she ever been tested,btw?
Since Arabs are the poster child for IR( ask me how I know, lol), and she has foundered and was overweight, you can safely assume that she is.
My first action would be weighing the hay to about 20lbs, and divide, a smaller portion for the day, the larger for the night. I'd definitely ditch the RB for a better balanced mineral supplement more tailored towards IR, iron free, like California Trace, add flax, 2-4oz, salt, 10g magnesium and 2000IU vitamin E, in a carrier of a couple of handfuls rinsed-soaked-rinsed beet pulp. That should cover her mineral needs and give her everything she needs but didn't get because it's present in grass, but not hay.
I'd also soak her hay, 1 hour in cold or half an hour in hot water, it washes up to 30% of sugars and the excess iron out, which means less calories (less sugar =less calories).
Best thing about this diet is that any horse will do well on it, even if not IR, so her buddy can have the same, and should he need more to keep condition, you can add some rice bran or oil to his to get more calories. My three are on it, the little IR Arab, a QH and a TB, the two bigger ones get rice bran and less magnesium and are doing well.
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