What could I feed my thoroughbred instead of alfalfa cubes which makes him hot - The Horse Forum
 15Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 11:32 AM Thread Starter
Foal
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25
• Horses: 0
What could I feed my thoroughbred instead of alfalfa cubes which makes him hot

I have been feeding him alfalfa cubes this winter to keep his weight up and I went to ride him yesterday and he was very hot and spooky, he is on a very good feed Seminole Wellness dynasport and gets free choice hay but the hay is not the best quality, what could I give him instead of alfalfa cubes that won't make him hot
Codybruce is offline  
post #2 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 11:37 AM
Green Broke
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Northern Florida
Posts: 4,686
• Horses: 4
When was the last time that you rode him?

There will be only one of you for all time. Fearlessly be yourself.
Coffee is my spirit animal
LoriF is offline  
post #3 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 11:40 AM Thread Starter
Foal
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25
• Horses: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoriF View Post
When was the last time that you rode him?
In February
Codybruce is offline  
post #4 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 11:55 AM
Green Broke
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Northern Florida
Posts: 4,686
• Horses: 4
I would be more inclined to put the hot and spookyness on lack of being ridden often more than I would on the alfalfa. I know that a lot of people believe that alfalfa makes a horse hot but I don't belong to the club that thinks protein does that. Alfalfa usually if not always has less sugars in it than grass does. There are 11 horses on the properry where I keep my three and they are all on alfalfa and grass except for the ponies and no one is hot and spooky.

Energy needs to flow somewhere so more riding will direct it to where you want it to be rather than the horse directing to where he thinks it needs to be.

Actually the 30 year old pony eats alfalfa too

There will be only one of you for all time. Fearlessly be yourself.
Coffee is my spirit animal
LoriF is offline  
post #5 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 12:27 PM Thread Starter
Foal
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25
• Horses: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoriF View Post
I would be more inclined to put the hot and spookyness on lack of being ridden often more than I would on the alfalfa. I know that a lot of people believe that alfalfa makes a horse hot but I don't belong to the club that thinks protein does that. Alfalfa usually if not always has less sugars in it than grass does. There are 11 horses on the properry where I keep my three and they are all on alfalfa and grass except for the ponies and no one is hot and spooky.

Energy needs to flow somewhere so more riding will direct it to where you want it to be rather than the horse directing to where he thinks it needs to be.

Actually the 30 year old pony eats alfalfa too
I didn't put him on alfalfa last winter and I didn't ride much because of the weather and he wasn't hot when i rode him after a month of not being ridden so it has to be the alfalfa
Codybruce is offline  
post #6 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 12:29 PM
Foal
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 181
• Horses: 2
Did he lose condition last winter when he wasn't on the alfalfa?
buggy is offline  
post #7 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 12:36 PM Thread Starter
Foal
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25
• Horses: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by buggy View Post
Did he lose condition last winter when he wasn't on the alfalfa?
Yes he did
Codybruce is offline  
post #8 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 12:44 PM
Foal
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Ashton, MD
Posts: 166
• Horses: 3
I agree that I highly doubt it's the alfalfa making him hot. I don't think alfalfa makes horses particularly hot, in fact I usually find horses are more mellow on it because it helps with their stomach acid and keeps their weight on.

You've barely ridden him and he probably hasn't been outside of his barn/paddock much in that time so of course he's going to be up and excited. I would absolutely have lunged for 15-20 minutes first to get any excitement or bucks out and then not expected much for the first ride in a month. Get him back into work slowly and let him adjust back to his working schedule, some horses come off the winter offended that their "retirement" is over.
waresbear, LoriF and PoptartShop like this.

Mains doux - Jambes forts - Esprit sensť

Je n'ai pas peur dans la selle
SansPeurDansLaSelle is offline  
post #9 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 12:56 PM
Started
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: In Sunny, HOT and HUMID S.C.
Posts: 1,644
• Horses: 2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Codybruce View Post
I have been feeding him alfalfa cubes this winter to keep his weight up and I went to ride him yesterday and he was very hot and spooky, he is on a very good feed Seminole Wellness dynasport and gets free choice hay but the hay is not the best quality, what could I give him instead of alfalfa cubes that won't make him hot
I strongly recommend that everyone who owns a horse take a course in Equine Nutrition and in Equine Digestion. I preach this to so many people, but unfortunately I realize that it's not something everyone can easily do since they might not have access to these educational opportunities.

Horses do not need "high energy" hay or foods that are high in NSC. They really aren't very good for them and can lead to health issues that could shorten their lifespan. (Secretariat was put down at 19 due to laminitis which was almost certainly the result of his feed being grain and top quality hay). So don't feel bad about the hay not being high quality. I feed low quality hay and pray that my supplier's son will continue supplying it when his 80 year old father stops, because he's the only source in over 100 miles.

The "modern" style of equine has been around for about 10 million years (if we go back to when it was a dog sized animal it's about 50 million, but we're not over concerned with the first 40 million years). In that time nature designed them to live on low quality forage. It's what their digestive system is designed to work with. A lot of long fiber (grass....or hay) and low NSC (grains and grain products are high in NSC). Too much starch creates problems in the hind gut, but I'm not going to get into trying to give a Reader's Digest version of tiny portion of a course in Equine Nutrition or Digestion. I've posted enough stuff on this site to give me writers cramp and poor eyesight from pouring over old class material *laugh* and even then I miss things.

Avoiding "hot" foods is smart. It's best for your horse, because hot foods are high in NSC. Horses do need small levels of NSC (just as humans need small levels of fat) for proper health, but they get enough from low quality hay and from grass (they can get too much from some hay and from grass that is too lush....reason some horses founder in late Spring/early Summer)

The best "cold" feeds I know of are copra (solid remains of the meat of a coconut after 95% of the oil has been extracted) and beet pulp (solid remains of the beet after the sugar has be extracted). Both are highly digestible (beet pulp being fiber, more nutritious than the best hay and handled in the hind gut, copra is so digestible it's taken from the foregut straight to the liver), both are extremely low in NSC and both provide plenty of useable energy (beet pulp is a favorite with many endurance racers).
Word of caution. Beet pulp is high in Ca, but has almost no P. Copra is high in P with low levels of Ca (which is the opposite of what the proper ratio is suppose to be for a horse). I solve this by feeding both copra and beet pulp mixed together so that my Ca to P ration is around 2 to 1, but you can also use supplements to create the balance needed.
I wouldn't worry about the low quality hay. I feed "cow" hay (Bahia grass hay). We've fed that to our working horses since my grandfather's time (and he was born in the 1800's). Timothy, CB, and the host of high quality "horse" hay will almost certainly have more NSC than you want.

A quick explanation for why people feed grain and rich hay. It's a long standing tradition started a very long time ago in Europe. They did not understand equine digestion. They kept the horses confined (so that they couldn't graze to keep the sort of diet nature designed them for). Grain was on hand, easy to store so it made an easy feed. Hay was later looked at the same way as we developed "high energy" hay. Knowledge about NSC and it's effect, how equine digestion worked, and what their nutritional needs actually were didn't come along until much, much later. Although it is interesting that the great horse societies of the world (Scythians, Mongols, etc. etc.) did not feed their horses grain or on high quality grass or hay. They ranged their horses over large areas which allowed them to have a natural diet without some of the problems faced by horses in Europe (and later in places colonized by Europeans).
loosie likes this.

They're always going to be bigger and stronger so you better always be smarter. (One of my grandfather's many pearls of wisdom)
its lbs not miles is offline  
post #10 of 24 Old 03-30-2017, 01:00 PM
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Olds Alberta Canada
Posts: 12,041
• Horses: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoriF View Post
I would be more inclined to put the hot and spookyness on lack of being ridden often more than I would on the alfalfa. I know that a lot of people believe that alfalfa makes a horse hot but I don't belong to the club that thinks protein does that. Alfalfa usually if not always has less sugars in it than grass does. There are 11 horses on the properry where I keep my three and they are all on alfalfa and grass except for the ponies and no one is hot and spooky.

Energy needs to flow somewhere so more riding will direct it to where you want it to be rather than the horse directing to where he thinks it needs to be.

Actually the 30 year old pony eats alfalfa too
I agree that lack of riding is most likely the real problem, and not some alfalfa cubes
However, while it is completely true that excess protein causes neither mood highs, risk of laminitis, colic, in proportion to amount fed, as once thought in the early 80s, and that the culprit is instead, excess NSC, it is also true that some horses can't handle a lot of alfalfa.
This fact is in spite that alfalfa is often found to be lower in sugars then some grass hays, but not always. It depends a great deal on where that alfalfa is grown.
I know for a fact, that horses who are laminitic where I live, absolutely can't have alfalfa. There is another mechanism involved, beyond NSC, that, far as I know, is not completely understood
Smilie is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Horse Forum forums, you must first register.

Already have a Horse Forum account?
Members are allowed only one account per person at the Horse Forum, so if you've made an account here in the past you'll need to continue using that account. Please do not create a new account or you may lose access to the Horse Forum. If you need help recovering your existing account, please Contact Us. We'll be glad to help!

New to the Horse Forum?
Please choose a username you will be satisfied with using for the duration of your membership at the Horse Forum. We do not change members' usernames upon request because that would make it difficult for everyone to keep track of who is who on the forum. For that reason, please do not incorporate your horse's name into your username so that you are not stuck with a username related to a horse you may no longer have some day, or use any other username you may no longer identify with or care for in the future.



User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Old Thread Warning
This thread is more than 90 days old. When a thread is this old, it is often better to start a new thread rather than post to it. However, If you feel you have something of value to add to this particular thread, you can do so by checking the box below before submitting your post.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Alfalfa vs. Alfalfa/Timothy Cubes BigRedEquine Horse Nutrition 4 03-26-2015 09:25 PM
best way to feed alfalfa cubes hemms Horse Health 13 12-13-2013 07:23 PM
Alfalfa Cubes socks Horse Health 1 06-14-2012 10:14 PM
Alfalfa cubes - How much to feed? QHDragon Horse Health 39 06-24-2011 12:07 AM
'Alfalfa makes a hot horse'- Myth? Clair Horse Nutrition 53 03-14-2011 06:53 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome