ATTN Dressage People! - Page 2 - The Horse Forum
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post #11 of 16 Old 01-24-2018, 03:11 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone :)

This is uh... not what I wanted to hear. But it's definitely what I needed.

She IS capable of lifting her forehand, I've seen and photographed her doing it, but maybe I'm not experienced enough to get her to do it under saddle. She is also capable of lifting through the base of her neck and making a lovely shape with herself, though I haven't asked her to do it with a rider because she's green and therefore not strong enough. And um... again... I don't think I quite have the experience.

I'm bareback at the moment whether I like it or not because I do not have a saddle that fits her...
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MAKORA THOROUGHBRED SPORTHORSES
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post #12 of 16 Old 01-24-2018, 06:17 PM
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When I learnt to do it and I only did it maybe once or twice correctly as it can hard to get a grip on, you donít stop and then do it. The way I was taught was to come through the middle of the round yard and slow almost like youíre going to stop and then move through the forehand. You donít stop and then do it, itís something that flows. True pirouettes take time to develop and take a lot of organising so donít feel discouraged get an instructor to help you :)
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post #13 of 16 Old 01-24-2018, 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted by blue eyed pony View Post
She IS capable of lifting her forehand, I've seen and photographed her doing it, but maybe I'm not experienced enough to get her to do it under saddle. She is also capable of lifting through the base of her neck and making a lovely shape with herself, though I haven't asked her to do it with a rider because she's green and therefore not strong enough. And um... again... I don't think I quite have the experience.
There we go, she is young and green, and not strong enough.....good for her to learn to turn, move away from your leg etc, true pirouettes come way later in training.....but one that you can for sure work towards.

ABC's before reading Shakespeare.....

ďNever attribute to malice that which can be attributed to stupidityĒ
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post #14 of 16 Old 01-25-2018, 06:27 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone :)

It's interesting, she responds like a far more educated horse, but lacks a lot of strength. Balance wise she's really getting there now. She tries her heart out to do what I ask her to, and resistance only means she can't do it or she's finding it really hard or she doesn't understand what I want. She's very light and responsive, and when I'm riding well enough, she'll come lovely and round in all three gaits (we uh... don't gallop I figure she's done enough of that for a while, being an ottb). But yeah... I'm definitely the weak link in this partnership. I know I need more lessons! Just got to get her a saddle that fits so my coach can be tough on me without me ending up rubbed raw in some very sensitive areas

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post #15 of 16 Old 02-01-2018, 10:47 AM
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I think in terms of actual benefit for you and your mare I would work on establishing a true-pure rhythm in all 3 gaits. ALWAYS think of that forward 1-2,3-4 of the walk, she needs to be much more forward than you have her in the video. It should be a marching walk, all good quality work begins with the quality of the gaits. Even in collected work you do not lose the energy, it's more like coiling of a spring but they must first be in front of your leg (which honestly almost EVERY upper level rider I see at local US shows lacks true collection because their horses shut down in the collected work). When you ask for the forward it should never be grind in your hips, DO NOT sit heavier otherwise it's like points digging into her spine, instead sit in a way that moves her rib cage between your legs (feel her rib cage sway between your right and left leg, when you feel her right rib cage push into your leg push lightly with your right leg, same with the left) like youre swaying her rib cage between your legs but not in a strong way. When you apply an aid you're not going to push the horse over, always think light aids. Think of your aids like your talking to her in a room full of people, she should be able to hear you whisper and sometimes hey don't understand so you have to be stronger or talk louder to make the message clear but then return to the whisper. Think of it as here this is what I want, okay you reacted properly good girl! Whenever you're showing a horse something you're developing their reactions, evaluate their reaction to the aid rather than whether or not the task was completed. Training is a gradual build up of reactions. Even on a dull horse once I've taught them my expectation I barely touch them with my leg or with my ottb I just think it and he's eager to do whatever I ask. Leg yields are a thought.

With rhythm same with trot 1-2 and canter 1-2-3. I ALWAYS have a rhythm set in my head and I count on every horse because it is so easy to break out of rhythm. But everything build from having true gaits and pure rhythm.

As for actual benefit I think turns on the forehand are generally more beneficial than turns on the haunches for training. Both are good so you can have body control of the shoulders and the haunches but turn on the haunches is often one of the first things we teach young horses because it teaches them how to connect the inside hind to the outside rein. It's also the base exercise that eventually develops into a leg yield. Which honestly a lot of laterals I begin by teaching them from the ground. Shoulder in, leg yield, turn on the haunches and turn on the forehand. I also moderate it so say turn on the forehand but I want them to step over laterally with their front leg too so they're stepping their body over. Body control and understanding.

Also in terms of training walk pirouettes it's really not that magical in which a horse needs to be a certain age or super strong, nor is it far down a horse's training. It just needs the development of good basics and fair communication. It's not usually from a strength issue but undeveloped basics and unclear communication. Forward clear walk rhythm, developed collected walk and shoulder in, haunches in, bending through the rib cage, leg yield, etc which honestly most horses can learn pretty quickly. They just wont be confirmed in it or strong enough to maintain immediately. The walk pirouette is pretty basic but do not be discouraged if you're struggling, to be honest horses usually learn much faster than people do. And it is hard to learn the timing and feel if you have no one to help you or having something to ride that has the feel to offer.

Last edited by DanteDressageNerd; 02-01-2018 at 10:55 AM.
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post #16 of 16 Old 02-01-2018, 07:14 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you very much! <3

This green baby ottb is my main horse and my only other mount is uh... even greener. I haven't had an educated horse since my jumper retired and even then he wasn't at all a dressage horse! If I was lucky, on a good day, he'd step over off my leg... IF I was lucky. I actually HAVE ridden a very very nice dressage horse a couple of times (I think they told me he was an Inter I horse? Whichever one is the step down from GP) and I know for a FACT I couldn't get the best out of him but it was certainly enlightening as to where my unevenness was, and he showed me a lot of my inconsistencies.

I also don't have enough money to get my coach more often than, uh, occasionally. Hence posting here. I'm basically trying to figure this all out on my own. Ikora is not my first young horse by a long shot (I've had several and broke two to ride myself) but she's the most challenging and also the most talented.

She'll stop if I sit heavier so don't worry about that! She is very very sensitive and first and foremost before anything else I taught her to respond to my seat. I sit heavier and breathe out to ask her to halt. 99 times out of 100 that's all it takes and I only very rarely have to touch her mouth.

You know what's interesting? She will not, absolutely will not, turn on the haunches on the ground... but is light and beautiful turning on the forehand. Ridden, she'll turn on the haunches beautifully, but insists she doesn't understand if you ask her to turn on the forehand.

I guarantee I've missed something important in her training... I'm just trying to establish her flatwork to the point of her having what she needs to jump nice courses, and then she's going to be my showjumper... but yeah... I want the basics in place and solid first.

I need to get another video now I'm in a saddle again!

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