I am trying to teach my horse to load into a trailer and having very little success. After watching numerous videos the message I am getting is that my horse does not respect me ... or consider me a leader.
I don't believe in harsh training practices and prefer to use passive persistence to accomplish my goals.
Can anyone offer me any exercises to build my horses respect for me?
I do not think there is anyone on these forums that believes in knocking a horse around to get,results
What is respect? The dictionary says :-
Admiration felt or shown for someone or something that you think has good ideas or qualities.
I also think that respect also carries a bit of fear/guilt with it. I never went out and robbed a bank because I knew that either of my parents, for whom I had great respect, would be let down by my actions and, their disappointment and punishment would be greater than anything the courts could dish out!
You gain the respect by being consistent, firm and fair, correcting the little things in day to day handling of the horse. By setting, at the start, tight boundaries which as trust grows, widen. Trust leads to respect.
Being able to read a horse makes a difference as to how I teach it to load. One that has trailered very little I will allow time to look, smell and because I have the experience and confidence, follow me into the trailer.
The horse that says he is not going into that trailer because he doesn't want to, will get far firmer handling with a no nonsense approach.
Hello!
Before I give you my suggestion, I want you to know that I am not a professional by any means. I just know what works with my horses and what I have been taught.
I have been taught that getting a horse to move his/her feet is the way to get his respect. Take a look at horses in a pasture. When the herd leader wants another horse to move, he will push, shove, bite, etc to get that horse out of his way. When that horse moves his feet, he is submitting to the herd leader therefore respects the leader.
Getting your horse to move his feet; forwards, back, left and right; is the way to gain his respect. Backing is a great exercise for gaining respect. Teaching the horse to get out of your space is a good start. If he is pushing and shoving against you and then you move out of his way, he is showing his dominance and becoming herd leader. Make your horse move out of your way and out of your space. Yielding the hindquarters is another good exercise. Pretty much any exercise that makes the horse move his feet when you tell him will begin to gain his respect.
I realize that you said you prefer a soft approach to training, but I suggest taking a look at Clinton Anderson's Method. He isn't as harsh as some people make him to be. I recently went to one of his tours, and seeing him interact with horses in person is a lot different then watching him on YouTube. He really isn't hurting the horse anymore than horses hurt each other by biting and kicking.
I hope I could help and good luck with your horse!
It most likely has nothing to do with respect, horses not getting in trailers is typically fear based.
In general horses are naturally claustrophobic, they don't like confined spaces. They are flight animals when you confine them you are taking away their ability to flee, that takes trust. You need to gain your horses trust and teach him to be comfortable in the confined space.
Depending upon the level of fear will determine where you begin. Will your horse stand comfortably next to a fence, will your horse stand comfortably next to a fence with another barrier on the other side like a barrel. Is your horse comfortable facing a wall with barriers on both sides, ect. Determine how comfortable your horse is in a confined space.
Is your horse comfortable stepping up onto other surfaces.
The easiest way I have found to teach a horse to load is feed them in, at and around the trailer. When we are teaching our horses to load the only place they get their grain is at the trailer.
We start out putting panels behind the trailer and feeding on the outside of the trailer, as they get more comfortable we move the feed closer to the door. Then up on the back of the trailer then farther and farther in until it is getting fed from the manger. Once they are loading themselves into eat, then we gradually work on closing the doors, close the door open the door. If at any time they worry about the door we stop and back up to a more comfortable place. If they want out they are free to get out, we never want them to feel trapped.
Eventually we add hay to the feeding in the trailer and they will stand in there happily munching their hay with the doors open or closed for an hour.
It is a bit of a pain to constantly be having to have the trailer hitched to the truck but it does not take very long and they are self loading. We have the opposite problem and cannot get out horses out of the trailer. We also have to be mindful to always keep trailer doors closed so a roaming horse does not climb in.
Using this method it has never taken more then a couple weeks for even the most reluctant horse to start loading in the trailer. Food is very motivating, they need it to survive. This way is also very low stress and the horse has time digest what is happening and get comfortable.
Respect is a complex concept located in a part of the human brain that the horse does not even posses. Period. This is from leading research and brain scans showing various parts lighting up under different circumstances.
Horses do NOT have the ability to respect or disrespect. This is from "Animals In Translation" by Temple Grandin.
Another favorite of mine, Mark Rashid, says, "If you want to fight a horse, he will always oblige you".
My suggestion would be, FWIW, that the horse is probably frightened about the trailer. Why else would he not want to load?
I would try slow steady desensitization. Probably in several small lessons over several days. With ample rewards for ANYTHING positive. Even looking at the trailer.
It may take a bit of time, but when you are finally done, you'll be done. And happy.
The fear may look irrational to you as you can clearly see there is nothing to fear. But apparently not so irrational in the horses mind.
BTW, if you have become irritated with the horse in the past for not loading, which is entirely understandable, the desensitization may take a little longer. That bad memory will need to be overlaid with better memories. They remember a lot more detail that humans.
Think about what type of leader you would respect.
You might obey a leader who makes demands and enforces these demands with punishment if not obeyed. But would you really respect such a leader?
While respect also involves obedience, it includes trust as well. We tend to trust a leader who we feel is knowledgeable. We tend to trust a leader who will clearly explain what he or she wants in a way that we can understand. We tend to trust a leader who will help us develop the skills necessary for a task before asking us to fulfill that task. We tend to trust a leader who does not follow a demand by setting up obstacles that hinder our ability to fulfill that demand. We also want a leader who we can trust to protect us from harm as well as providing for our physical needs.
A leader must sometimes use discipline (punishment) to maintain order. Such discipline should not destroy our trust in the leader if: 1) the punishment is deserved; 2) the punishment is appropriate; and 3) the punishment is brief and ends when we submit. The discipline must also be applied in such a way that we understand the behavior that brought it about.
We also tend to respect a leader that acknowledges our efforts to please. This acknowledgment may come in the form of pay (treats for horses), a pleasing touch (a rub rather than a pat for horses), or verbal praise (“good boy” or “good girl”).
Specifics depend on the individuals involved as well as the particular situation. Everything we do with a horse, however, influences our relationship with that horse. Thankfully, horses seem to be more forgiving than many people when we make mistakes.
We also tend to respect a leader that acknowledges our efforts to please. This acknowledgment may come in the form of pay (treats for horses), a pleasing touch (a rub rather than a pat for horses), or verbal praise (“good boy” or “good girl”).
Specifics depend on the individuals involved as well as the particular situation. Everything we do with a horse, however, influences our relationship with that horse. Thankfully, horses seem to be more forgiving than many people when we make mistakes.
My BO says that my horse should ALWAYS stand at least an arms length away from me, ALWAYS. Is this true? It doesnt make sense cause what if Im leading her and I just want her and I to stand next to each other?
Sometimes I let my horse come in and stand right next by my side.
The arms length is a safety issue IMO. I am far more tolerant of horses "invading" my personal space than I am of people doing it, and I don't see it as any disrespect on the part of the horse. What I do expect is for the horse to cooperate if I ask them to step away or lead at arms length. Once a rapport is established horses also know when something is okay and when it's not. I can graze horses on the lane to the paddocks when I have time and when I don't a verbal "NO" keeps them from trying to put their head down.
As for treats . . . very useful at times as a reward after good behavior. I usually have a pocket full of carrot chips. My mare knows they are there and sometimes will just ask for some. Other times she gets them as a reward or right before I leave. I have never seen it develop any problems except with a few ponies that learned to grab because the children didn't know how to give treats correctly
I use treats as reward - as long as you always insist that the horse is always polite about them they aren't a problem.
There's a top Arabian barn near me that has an Open Day every year where buckets full of carrots are put out for visitors to give to the horses, people who go there for lessons are encouraged to give the horses a carrot after they've finished and not a single one of those horses bites because they've never been allowed too
The same goes for my horses - they know that treats come with rules.
Horses aren't 'cave dwellers' so a trailer is something they'll naturally distrust. Open it up as much as you can to let the maximum light in and be patient, a horse that's not used to trailering will only get more tense if you use a lot of force and too much pressure. Its better that the trailering experience is a 'feel good' experience so the horse will be relaxed when you actually start to move off
I think letting strangers feed treats to horses is a bad idea. They dont know what the diet is like for that horse or if that horse has any restrictions.
The very first night I moved my horse to the new barn, the BO put up a sign on my horses paddock door, for any guests NOT to feed my horse treats. Cause his #1 pet peeve is the kids who come to ride in the day on a lesson horse then their parents take them around the barn petting and feeding all the horses treats. Im glad he put up this sign cause I dont want anyone feeding my horse any treats without at least asking me.
The BO doesnt even like people touching horses that arent their own. He says theres no reason to go around and rub and scratch horses that you do not own. Its a good excuse for people to get bit and then come back to the BO to blame.
He does bring up a point though. People shouldnt be touching other peoples horses.
Expecting a horse to experience respect in the same terms as humans is a mistake of major proportions.
Same for transferring how we regard a human to human leadership and human to human deserved punishment. Some of it may work, but not because the horse experiences it as do we humans or reason it out as we do. The horse has no idea what "deserved" means and never will.
Horse stay at arms length? I think it depends on many things. Depends on the horse. Depends on the human. Depends on what type of relationship is desired. For a working cowboy that changes horses daily and even at noon sometimes the answer would be different than for a horse that a person has for both riding and as an animal companion.
A horse is a horse for certain and those basics need to be addressed. But beyond that there are so many correct ways to go that it's almost impossible to say which is best without a ton of information.
My horse is both my companion and riding partner and about October 1st will be gathering cattle about twice a week. He walks right up to me anytime and is encouraged to do so. I feed treats. Not as a reward or as a bribe. I feed him treats because he likes it. Same reason I scratch him when he itches.
Listen to everything people say, but also listen to your own heard, your own mind, and for certain your horse.
I prefer not to use treats but I did use treats a couple times over the past week when getting my horse to stand tied. I knew it was difficult for her and made sure I rewarded her after as I untied her.
I always see videos of people using treats while in the arena, each thing they do thats right, they give them a treat. Only thing is, they are giving treat after treat after treat and thats just too much IMO. So if they are doing sequential work with them and say its 7 steps...they get 7 treats. Too much.
In other words if I want my horse to have treats, I put it in her feed bucket when I give her grain.
One thing Ive noticed with many boarders at my old barn is that each time they go to catch their horse (even if theyre in a paddoc), they give them a carrot or treat. Why? It only takes a few times before the horse starts expecting them each time you catch her. SUre I would love to give my horse a treat everyday when I first catch her, but she will get nippy.
I know with my horse, her previous owner hand fed her WAY TOO MUCH. Cause she will sniff new people when they come up to her, but she wont do it to me because she knows I dont like my pockets sniffed and I will nudge my knee, leg whatever and that immediately sends he the message to knock it off. Im very thankful my horse isnt nippy.
Hondo--If you don't think that some variation of respect plays into herd dynamics, how do you explain it?
Sorry for the slightly off-topic question~ :>
Fear. Fear of being beat up and fear of losing the herd protection.
I claim no expertise on the concept of respect, just relaying from those who do that it comprises a concept too complicated for horses to achieve. I just tend to lean toward what they say.
I think, and that's THINK in capital letters, that horses see things as threatening or non threatening.
On a really difficult trailer loading situation, I would have a dish of pellets located near the trailer but not close enough for the horse to become anxious about the trailer as I led him to the dish. Let him eat half and then lead him away.
Next day do the same with the dish being a little closer. Just keep messing with him on a daily or multi-daily basis until the trailer is not threatening but associated with something he does not want to leave. FOOD!
I very rarely ever gave hand treats, I would usually throw a carrot into their manger. Many small children would come to the barn and I would let them feed a carrot.
One thing I would have them do is to hold a carrot at the end rather than on the flat of the hand.
Every horse knew better than to snatch. Most would try to break the carrot but little hands aren't strong enough to hold on.
I have seen children hold the carrot with two hands and the horse feeling with lips as to where tiny fingers are before biting into the carrot.
It all boils down to them respecting people regardless of size.
One thing I have done with horses or dogs that snatch is give them a treat which they snatch then giving a pickled onion which they will snatch. Makes them pause and sniff and take gently.
It is all about knowing your horse and how you train it. None of mine bite or snatch because they know its not allowed and won't get them what they want.
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