Teaching abused/uneducated horse to lunge - Page 3 - The Horse Forum
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post #21 of 26 Old 11-20-2018, 07:06 AM
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Many times, professional trainers don't care about a horses past. I've handed my horses over to trainer in varying capacities and started to give them a 101 on my horse and get told to stop. They want to ride the horse they have right now. How they got there matters less than what they are giving at that moment.
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post #22 of 26 Old 11-20-2018, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by thecolorcoal View Post
I know that discounting a horse's history and past is common here, but I disagree.

I know a 20 year old horse who had very rough, aggressive reining training from 2-3 years old. He flunked out after he bucked off someone and broke their back.

To this day the horse is very finnicky about the bit. If you open his mouth you can see patches of scar tissue on his lips from where a big bit cut into them once.
And if he were my horse, his history still wouldn't matter to me.

So he's finnicky with the bit. It doesn't matter to me whether he's finnicky about the bit b/c of being abused in the past or if that's just the way he is. I still try to help the horse the same; no matter the REASON behind why he is the way he is.

So that's what I mean about "discounting" a horse's past. It doesn't matter. Just deal with the horse you have in front of you; history aside.

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Originally Posted by thecolorcoal View Post
he won't tolerate anyone he does not know handling his face. Fast movements around his head terrify him.
I would desensitize him to fast movements around his head, the same way I would do for a horse (for example) that was an unhandled mustage. Again, it's doesn't matter WHY they are the way they are, because your training is still the same. You would help him get over it the same way you would for any other horse that was worried about fast movements around it's head.


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Originally Posted by thecolorcoal View Post

She will allow me to touch her face and ears but will not tolerate anyone else getting their hands near her head. I suspect she was either hit in the face or twitched.

There are more but those are the two that continue to plague us with strangers.

And there are plenty of horses out there who have NOT been abused in the past, but still will take advantage of strangers. This is again, where the past means less to me, and it's more important what the horse is doing now.


Sure, the abuse may have caused the behavior in the first place, that I don't deny,. But I guess what I am getting at is that the past does not change how you train the horse you have in front of you. I would treat/train the horse the same (that was disrespectful to strangers) no matter what caused the behavior in the first place (abuse or otherwise).

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post #23 of 26 Old 11-20-2018, 03:20 PM
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...And what we're all also saying in 'does not matter' as far as your egs go Colour Coal, is that we would not let it be an excuse to avoid dealing with the issues, as it seems you are saying.

Some info I've found helpful; [COLOR=Lime][B]www.horseforum.com/horse-health/hoof-lameness-info-horse-owners-89836/
For taking critique pics; [COLOR=Lime][B]https://www.horseforum.com/members/41...res-128437.jpg
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post #24 of 26 Old 11-20-2018, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by ApuetsoT View Post
Many times, professional trainers don't care about a horses past. I've handed my horses over to trainer in varying capacities and started to give them a 101 on my horse and get told to stop. They want to ride the horse they have right now. How they got there matters less than what they are giving at that moment.
Yes!! It does NOT matter what the horse has or has not done, what cues he was or was not trained for, what bad or good experiences he had. You fill in the holes as they come up. You ALWAYS work until you get the desired response, you ALWAYS quit as the reward....whether the horse has been abused, neglected, trained differently, not trained, needs chiropractic work, whatever.....

I don't break horses, I FIX them!
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post #25 of 26 Old 11-20-2018, 10:02 PM
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We have one horse (Gus) who was trained with some very harsh methods, was used for roping practice as a young horse until he had scars on several legs, and who was generally very shut down when we got him. We have treated him like any other horse -- with respect, kindness, and the expectation that he have good manners on the ground and under saddle. My husband is always firm and fair with him.

When Salty had his eye removed in May and I started to handle him after surgery, I was tempted to baby him and walk on eggshells around him. I decided I needed to treat him exactly like I did before surgery, with the expectation that he would be safe, have manners, and respect my space.

Both of them are safe, respectful and willing partners now, and have thrived with consistent, kind, respectful handling. We don't know who owned either of them beyond their past brief last owners. It doesn't matter. They are who they are. We have the expectations of safety and manners that are necessary for us to handle them. Horses are smart. They appreciate kindness and consistency in communication. They generally don't sit around feeling sorry for themselves -- they tend to live in the moment.

Train him like you would any horse. If you don't have experience training a horse, ask for help from someone who does so you don't confuse your horse with poor timing or cues. He may be confused anout what you are asking him, and you may be interpreting that as fear or disobedience. If you walk on eggshells around him due to his history, and make excuses for bad behavior, he may never reach his potential as a safe, well behaved partner.
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post #26 of 26 Old 11-20-2018, 11:25 PM
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I love @gottatrot 's advice, as I often do. She is good about considering a horse in the WHOLE, not just the parts.




Your first post, OP, is a bit confusing. What happened that the horse dragged you? REally think about what the horse does well, and what he struggles with and think about what are the FUNDAMENTAL differences between those two things, from teh horse's perspective.




One of the things you will want to get this horse to become able to do is to move his fore quarters away from you. The way that he keeps facing you, no matter what, is expected from a horse that has had a boatload of whipping or driving from behind. He faces you because that keeps you from being able to get into a 'driving' position.


Ok. he is worried about being driven. so, . . . don't drive him for a bit.
you get him out onto the circle by moving his shoulder out there, which is a little bit of driving, but is not pushing hard on his hindquarters.


you face this horse, who is facing you, and you lift the lead line and kind of 'point' out toward the wall, in the direction you envision his first footfall should be. this wil be his front, outside foot, which should rreach forward, and outward, toward th outside of your circle.


So, with the leadline telling hime where to step, you put some pressure on his face. this is asking him to follow the indication of the leadline, and step outward, away from you. you approach the horse, with your hand 'air tapping' on his nose, specifically on his inside nostril (by inside, I mean if you are asking him to step to your left, his right, outward toward the imaginary circle, then you push on his left nostril. I know, it's complex to explain in print . . but . . ).



he will eventually step away from your pressure, and follow the indication you have on your leadline to step to his own right, toward the circle.



hurrah! he moved his shoulders away from you!!!!! this is huge!

reward him by stopping the asking . just let your body go slack, and let him stand or even if he comes back to facing you, it doesn't matter, he did what you asked.


again, use your leading hand to sort of indicate the angle you want him to step out toward, and focussing on his inside nostril, you 'tap' the air toward him, and step toward him and you WATCH for him to respond.


if he is really dull, or resistant, or confused, you will be air tapping, and stepping toward him and you may end up literally 'running into ' his nostril with your tapping fingers, THAT shoudl make him step over and away from you. Again, reward this by complete cessation of the pressure.


do you see ? first you traiin him to step out and away from you, THEN you use that leading hand, which is still holding hte leadline, to suggest to him that now that he is not longer facing you, but is alinged on the circle, that he walk forward. you back this up with a littel bit of driving on his driveline.




This is a univers of gobbledygook words for something that I could show you in 10 minutes! I wish I could step through cyber space and help you. But, I know you'll figure it out.



I truly wish you the best, and hope you'll forgive my terribel typing!
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