Why I Gotta Trot - Page 255 - The Horse Forum
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post #2541 of 3032 Old 11-16-2018, 11:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Hondo View Post
The article by Martin Black was really really interesting and almost comprised a training manual in my mind. Temple Grandin talks about the development dendritic fields in natural based and confined animals. Makes the idea of owning a mustang very compelling.
That's fascinating. For around thirty years now, I've been closely comparing stable/yard-raised horses with horses that were born into a herd that always runs on the pasture together, with some room to roam and with plenty of unhampered social opportunities on tap. That's because my birth family and some of their acquaintances were breeding in a stable/yard setup, but the larger commercial horse farms from whom you could buy yearlings had herd-raised, pasture-fed horses.

And although there is individual variation, when educating them to harness, the yearlings from the pasture/herd situation overall seemed significantly more mature, more thinking, more confident and less spooky to me than the stable/yard-raised horses, who displayed many of the traits we associate with institutionalisation in humans as well. If the bought-in pasture/herd-raised horses were kept confined on their own, they often developed so-called stable vices, and ritualised behaviour - even self-harming behaviour.

Thank goodness though for neuroplasticity, even in adults! Taking several horses from a lifelong isolated stable/yard setting to retire at our place with lots of terrain and a herd to socialise in has really turned them into very different horses - just from that environmental/social change - even without any further training.

SueC is time travelling.
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post #2542 of 3032 Old 11-17-2018, 04:44 AM
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@SueC Your comments connected me to some thoughts. First, I've known two or three adults that were home schooled. I have no idea if this holds true across the board but the adults that I've known had some quality about them I can't quite describe but maybe "mentally clear" or "centered" might hit around it somewhere. At any rate, I was positively impressed with them as individuals.

Second, I thought about the direction some schools are experimenting with in just letting kids be kids and doing whatever outside or inside. The little boogers just may be out there growing their little dendritic fields for later use as an adult.

Fascinating!

Were it not for the internet, I would likely be unaware of so many things.
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I think it important to always be mindful that the horse actually owes us nothing at all and it is we who owe the horse. "It's a goal"
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post #2543 of 3032 Old 11-18-2018, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by gottatrot View Post
Once I had a hunt saddle, it turned out I needed a dressage saddle for my riding lessons. Three saddles for one horse? My husband had questions about that but I assured him that all the saddles were absolutely necessary. He admitted he did not understand how this whole horse thing worked.


I know this is a pain in the posterior to experience, but you made all that tragedy into such an entertaining post! (p4, for those who've missed it, like I had)

Quote:
One saddle would slip forward. One would feel as though it put my leg too far forward. Another might bridge a bit on my horse's back. The more I knew about saddles, the more critical I became. I'd fall in love with a saddle, ride in it for awhile, and then notice some tiny little fault and it would grow in my mind until I could not believe I was using the saddle at all.

Saddles came and saddles went.
It could be worse. It could be men, not saddles. Bet you your DH is glad it's not. Remind him of this when you buy your next saddle!
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post #2544 of 3032 Old 11-18-2018, 02:03 PM
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it could be men, not saddles remind him of this when you buy your next saddle!
trouble maker!! :):):):)

I think it important to always be mindful that the horse actually owes us nothing at all and it is we who owe the horse. "It's a goal"
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post #2545 of 3032 Old 11-18-2018, 02:09 PM
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Well, you know, @Hondo , the males of the species reading could always swap out the genders to fit their situation. Which reminds me, has anyone seen @bsms ? He has many saddles and could use this line of argument...


This whole thing reminds me...Here's a little gem I couldn't find on the Internet and actually had to copy out of an old school book. Perhaps we could modify the metaphor to include saddles...

How To Select A Husband
by Robbie Poor

When selecting a husband, you should consider several important points. First, keep in mind that you must take the same care in selecting a husband that you would in selecting an automobile. Certainly you will want the one that will give you the best mileage. A large man, like a large car, will be more expensive to keep up, and the amount of fuel the larger model burns will make a difference to your budget. On the other hand, a large model wears well and is more comfortable than a smaller model - and it is certainly the best for long hauls. You must remember, however, that when the larger model ages, there is more to show: the interior is shot, the cushions sag and bulge, and the top is often shiny.

If you are petite, it is all right to look at the smaller models. If you are not petite, get a good view of the two of you together before you make a final decision: you may look like an Amazon steering a toy around. The myth that you can park any easier with a small one than a large one is just that - a myth.

The next, and perhaps most crucial, point to consider when selecting a husband is temperament and personality. Here again, as with a car, looks may be deceiving and hide what is underneath. It little matters what the model looks like, for it is how it behaves that counts. If it is a slow starter or if it snarls and growls when the going gets rough, then you need to keep shopping. Assuredly, the model should be dependable and reliable, for there are rough streets as well as paved roads to drive. Sometimes even an older model is the best buy, if picked with caution. But always be wary of a model with retreads: they tend to break down as the speed is increased. And look closely for paint used to cover up damaged areas. These give way under stress.

Another thing to look for as you make your selection is a model that is easy to handle, one that responds well to your lightest touch. You certainly do not want to spend your time with one that wears you out as you steer it. Select one that you can manoeuvre with ease.

Take extreme caution when breaking in your model. Use a light touch. Take it in for frequent tune-ups. Above all, use the right fuel.

SueC is time travelling.

Last edited by SueC; 11-18-2018 at 02:14 PM.
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post #2546 of 3032 Old 11-19-2018, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by knightrider View Post
Where is @bsms ? He would appreciate this discussion...There is one statement I am not comfortable with: "...Insecurity in ridden and handled horses is largely a result of confusions in training...."

...As far as spooking, I think much more depends on the horses' personality, not whether or not you confuse them in training...
I haven't spent much time lately online, particularly involving horses. It is a time of change for our family. My youngest leaves for boot camp next month. My son bought a home in California and his wife and kids will move to join him after Christmas. So after nearly 32 years with kids in the house, we'll be home alone. Two people in a 5 bedroom house.

Our tentative goal is to fix up the house - having two families in it for the last few years has been hard on it - and sell it. It also raises questions about horses. 2 people. 3 horses. And only one person who really likes riding. Hmmmm. Lots of options to explore and no answers. We're going to check out the Camp Verde area in early December for a potential place to move. We also want to check out parts of southern Utah, which in spite of my being a Baptist, feels like "God's Country" to me. The area I'm in continues to grow, and grow, and grow, and it has outgrown where I want to live. And my wife wants "greener" - the Filipina in her, I guess.



Anyways, I agree on spooking. I don't think it has much to do with aids or equitation training. I think it has far more to do with the horse's personality, experiences, and trust in humans - the independence of their thought. Bandit had a hard time dealing with the switch from NE Arizona to southern Arizona, but Trooper never flicked an ear at the difference between his mountain and desert time in central Utah and being ridden through a human neighborhood here. Bandit still finds human neighborhoods stressful. Trooper just really never gave a rat's rear. Nothing to do with riding style.

Saddles are a mixed bag. Some just feel right, but I think a rider ought to be able to adjust to a wide variety of saddles. A specialized sport or style of riding may benefit greatly from the right saddle, but you ought to be OK running, stopping, turning, etc in any saddle. I tend to dislike any saddle that tries to put you in a certain position. The Abetta I'm using now tends to have the stirrups set too far back. Oh well.

Riders ask "How?" Horsemen ask "Why?"
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post #2547 of 3032 Old 11-20-2018, 01:06 AM
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Dear @bsms , if you move to the right kind of place, you could take up this sport involving one person and multiple horses:



Is there enough room in Monument valley? And not too many cacti?



You'd have to trailer out, of course. Preferably from someplace green.

The chariot driver in the photo above in not wearing a helmet. Is this a health and safety concern?


PS: Imagine much less house cleaning and maintenance there is when you move to a smaller place - and what you two can do with that time and energy...

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post #2548 of 3032 Old 11-20-2018, 01:55 AM Thread Starter
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@Hondo and @SueC , you both are so funny!

@bsms , sounds like some big changes. Camp Verde looks like a pretty place. I have to say that if you choose to keep only one or two horses, boarding at the right place can be very nice if you want to have the ability to travel and such. Your family must all be very agreeable in order for you all to live together like that. My family is very nice but I don't think any combination of us could manage it.
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post #2549 of 3032 Old 11-20-2018, 09:19 AM
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@bsms Camp Verde is getting up in my neck of the woods.

@gottatrot Families from the same household living together have a long long history of failure. Both on the farm where I was raised and on the ranch where I'm now living.

Heck, it can become a challenge to keep just one household in order much less two.

@SueC Can't just go traipsing around in Monument Valley. It is reservation land.

I think it important to always be mindful that the horse actually owes us nothing at all and it is we who owe the horse. "It's a goal"
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post #2550 of 3032 Old 11-20-2018, 09:44 AM
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@SueC , when I went to college in Utah, they used to have chariot races on Saturday. During the winter, so wrecks landed in snow. The chariots were homemade and I don't remember any of them using more than one horse. It was all done purely for fun. Probably a thousand safety violations an hour, but I don't recall anyone getting hurt.

Boarding will probably be required someday. With two horses 20 years old or more, and one 10, odds are good I'll end up with one horse - unless I sell Bandit. Even then, unless the older horses coordinated their deaths, I'll eventually have one horse. And I think Bandit would do fine in a boarding situation. I think he'd enjoy watching all the other horses and people doing things around him.

I ought to look at selling him. I'd hate to do it, but Mia is better off in her home now than with me. Bandit might be better off living with an avid trail rider who would ride him daily. But I enjoy riding. In a different location, I might be willing to buy a good trailer and haul horses somewhere. Most of the places we're thinking about have 9,000' mountains nearby. Or higher. And less than a hour's drive. These are photos from Utah. Campe Verde has warmer weather, but I'll admit Utah is a place I love:




My wife would enjoy riding in places like that, too. And I think Bandit and Trooper would both be quite willing to spend a couple days camping and riding around in places like that. It would be SOOO nice to ride without constant worry about rocks and cactus, and where the heat and lack of water doesn't limit one to an hour or riding! I love southern Arizona, but this is a brutally harsh environment to ride in:



So...we'll see. Cowboy? In many ways he's my favorite horse. Too small for me, really, although OK for an hour of walking. But I don't think he'll ever really trust humans again. He's an excellent trail pony. Good for the farrier. Sensible on the trails. But even a mildly odd behavior by a human near the corral will scare him. If we have land, we can take him with us.

Another option would be finding a retirement place for him where he can be around other horses and not have much to do with humans for the remainder of his life. It is a sad commentary on what horses think of humans and how too many lesson horses are treated! He's OK with us, but he sure wouldn't miss our company any! Not if he could be around other horses and largely ignore humans.

So...it is all in the air. I dread the thought of moving. The sheer effort of it! But it won't get easier with time and we know we don't really want two of us living in this big house for the next 20 years. It has served us well for 13 years. But it is not where we want to spend the rest of our lives. And thanks to gottatrot for hosting a thread where I can feel free to share these thoughts!

Riders ask "How?" Horsemen ask "Why?"
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