A couple questions - Page 59 - The Horse Forum
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post #581 of 1323 Old 11-03-2015, 09:37 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dreamcatcher Arabians View Post
#1 - EVERYONE at one point or another attributes human emotions to their animals. We're human, it's what we do. What's important is to recognize that we're doing it and it really isn't something that the animals can relate to.
True and I am trying my best to do this.

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So, in that case they're "right" and you're (and the rest of us too) "wrong". Remember what I said about the Right Fighters? What does that get them? Not a friggin' thing.
Well it proves that what they said to me was correct and I need to adjust to that if anything.

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Now, you answer me to the best of your ability. What did/does it hurt that you are feeling sorry for her when she's getting "picked on" and "pushed out" of the herd?
Cause Ive seen bullies before in herds who bully and are mean and cruel to a new member - usually the youngest too. I just dont want that happening to my mare.

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I felt sorry as all hell when Patti got mad at Goldie and ran her through the fence. Goldie is no jumper and she knocked the fence down pretty good on her way over, that can't have felt good. I felt sorrier still when she tried to come back over the fence and stuck a T-post through her leg and ended up in Horse ICU at the Vet School. And I was sorrier still when I got the multi thousand dollar vet bill. But I was very happy I didn't lose the horse and yes, I babied her a LOT while she was on the injured list.
Ouch. And this is why I want to avoid injuries like this.

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Just because horses are tough on each other and they accept it as a fact of life, doesn't mean we can't feel a little sorry for them or imagine they aren't feeling a little sorry for themselves. What does it hurt?
Well I dont see anything wrong with feeling sorry for a horse. But again, we shouldnt cause thats human emotion!

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If you start talking like she's your girlfriend with those kinds of feelings, well, then we have a problem and the law will have a problem with it too. But when you're just horse mad and bringing her carrots and such, and thinking she's glad to see you because you're you and not because you have carrots, it's not a problem.
Well tonight, the BO actually decided not to keep her in the herd for the night (he wants at least a couple more nights, I dont blame him), so they put her back in the area next to the herd.

I brought her carrots and didnt halter her, didnt do anything with her except give her carrots from the outside of the paddock. But after I was about to leave walking towards the gate and she wanted some attention so I went in for a couple minutes and said hi.

Even though she tried nipping my fingers a couple times after all the carrots were gone, I gave her a couple quick whacks on her muzzle right away. Her head went up right away and she looked at me with her head 45 degrees towards me. What does that mean?

I didnt halter her, didnt do anything with her. Saw her for maybe 5 or 6mins. The rest of the time I was sitting in the car and watching and observing the herd.

Trainer said that she thinks its a great idea that i now give her at least 2 days off a week, where I dont handle her and dont ask anything from her.
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post #582 of 1323 Old 11-04-2015, 12:42 AM
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Can I ask why he keeps taking her in and out of the herd and not just leaving her there ?
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post #583 of 1323 Old 11-04-2015, 01:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Hoofpic View Post
Well it proves that what they said to me was correct and I need to adjust to that if anything.

Take it with a big dose of salts and don't dwell on it. I guarantee that if their little "Pookie" was getting pushed around they'd be the first ones fussing.

Cause Ive seen bullies before in herds who bully and are mean and cruel to a new member - usually the youngest too. I just dont want that happening to my mare.
Thing is, they're not bullies. They are giving the lowest/youngest lessons that will stand them in good stead for life. When a foal is first introduced to the herd with his mother, he gets to wear her stripes while he's still on her. Once he's weaned, oh boy. It's Katie Bar The Door, the horses and especially the older mares are going to give that weaner what for and he's going to learn quick that his dam earned her stripes and now that he's on his own, he's got some earning of his own to do. You'll see a lot of foal mouthing and licking and chewing going on for quite a while. The lessons are harsh but they'll help keep that foal a member in good standing of the herd, which will help him stay alive.


Ouch. And this is why I want to avoid injuries like this.

But see, if Goldie hadn't fronted Patti off, Patti wouldn't have felt the need to run her out. For that to have happened, Goldie had to be pretty darn disrespectful and confrontational to Patti. Patti is #3 in the hierarchy and Goldie & Dunny kind of share the #4 spot. Goldie must have thought she was going to make a move and Patti told her in no uncertain terms that she was NOT going to make a move on her and she enforced it with her heels and teeth. Goldie has not offered to be the least bit disrespectful since then. Tough lesson to learn but now she's been very clearly told where she stands and she's accepted it.



Well I dont see anything wrong with feeling sorry for a horse. But again, we shouldnt cause thats human emotion!

Pfffffffffffftttttt!


I brought her carrots and didnt halter her, didnt do anything with her except give her carrots from the outside of the paddock. But after I was about to leave walking towards the gate and she wanted some attention so I went in for a couple minutes and said hi.

Even though she tried nipping my fingers a couple times after all the carrots were gone, I gave her a couple quick whacks on her muzzle right away. Her head went up right away and she looked at me with her head 45 degrees towards me. What does that mean?

When Cloney does that, he's just done something to get in trouble for and I think he's looking to see if it's safe to bring his nose back down in my reach. I also suspect he's trying to look cute and make me giggle or laugh, he knows it's all over and forgiven if I do. He's a regular Dennis the Menace, so he gets in Dutch fairly regularly.

Trainer said that she thinks its a great idea that i now give her at least 2 days off a week, where I dont handle her and dont ask anything from her.
I think your trainer has a good idea. She needs down time to just be a horse.

Cloney stole our hats often enough that I got him one of his own. He wears it a lot.



Dennis the Menace of horses.
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post #584 of 1323 Old 11-04-2015, 10:11 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Rainaisabelle View Post
Can I ask why he keeps taking her in and out of the herd and not just leaving her there ?
Safety precaution basically. Theres no doubt because shes only 4.5 that hes gone the extra distance in terms of safety cautions as compared to an older horse.
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post #585 of 1323 Old 11-04-2015, 10:13 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dreamcatcher Arabians View Post
I think your trainer has a good idea. She needs down time to just be a horse.

Cloney stole our hats often enough that I got him one of his own. He wears it a lot.



Dennis the Menace of horses.
Well it wasnt my trainers idea on giving my mare more down time, I took the advice from people on here and made the adjustment myself a few weeks ago. I just mentioned it to her last night because I dont see or really talk to her a lot so shes kinda out of the loop.

Does he really wear that hat a lot? Hhaha thats so cute.
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post #586 of 1323 Old 11-04-2015, 10:19 AM
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Have you asked the BO why he keep taking her out of the herd? Why such an emphasis on her age?
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post #587 of 1323 Old 11-04-2015, 10:28 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dreamcatcher Arabians View Post
Take it with a big dose of salts and don't dwell on it. I guarantee that if their little "Pookie" was getting pushed around they'd be the first ones fussing.
Thats the thing. IF it was THEIR horse, they would see where Im coming from.

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Thing is, they're not bullies. They are giving the lowest/youngest lessons that will stand them in good stead for life. When a foal is first introduced to the herd with his mother, he gets to wear her stripes while he's still on her. Once he's weaned, oh boy. It's Katie Bar The Door, the horses and especially the older mares are going to give that weaner what for and he's going to learn quick that his dam earned her stripes and now that he's on his own, he's got some earning of his own to do. You'll see a lot of foal mouthing and licking and chewing going on for quite a while. The lessons are harsh but they'll help keep that foal a member in good standing of the herd, which will help him stay alive.
Are you sure theyre not bullies? Cause the herd I saw when I was at a barn in Feb of this year volunteering, the ladies working there said this one grey horse was being picked on and they ended up having to move him to another herd.

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But see, if Goldie hadn't fronted Patti off, Patti wouldn't have felt the need to run her out. For that to have happened, Goldie had to be pretty darn disrespectful and confrontational to Patti. Patti is #3 in the hierarchy and Goldie & Dunny kind of share the #4 spot. Goldie must have thought she was going to make a move and Patti told her in no uncertain terms that she was NOT going to make a move on her and she enforced it with her heels and teeth. Goldie has not offered to be the least bit disrespectful since then. Tough lesson to learn but now she's been very clearly told where she stands and she's accepted it.
Oh I see.

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Pfffffffffffftttttt!
But feeling sorry for a horse is infact attaching human emotion to them right?

Quote:
When Cloney does that, he's just done something to get in trouble for and I think he's looking to see if it's safe to bring his nose back down in my reach. I also suspect he's trying to look cute and make me giggle or laugh, he knows it's all over and forgiven if I do. He's a regular Dennis the Menace, so he gets in Dutch fairly regularly.
So your gelding does the 45 degree look as well?

Maybe Im the only one who thinks this, but I would think that by her still maintaining her eye contact on me as she does it is a good sign as opposed to her turning her head 45 degrees and looking away.
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post #588 of 1323 Old 11-04-2015, 10:31 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jenkat86 View Post
Have you asked the BO why he keep taking her out of the herd? Why such an emphasis on her age?
No I didnt ask cause I dont want to question him but I trust his judgement since he is there all day and sees my mare much more than I do.

Its basically just extra safety precaution. Its not just from her age but also her personality cause he knows she can have an attitude at times and can be pushy and is more dominant than submissive.

This is why hes sat in on my first couple lessons, and the first time my trainer rode her, and watched as she was getting her teeth floated.

It doesnt bother me anyways, from talking with him last night he said its only for a couple more days. I still feel a bit uneasy about her in the new herd for the night since they dont know each other yet and havent sorted things out yet.
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post #589 of 1323 Old 11-04-2015, 10:45 AM
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Feeling sorry for a horse....yes- it's attaching human emotion to them, but with all things horsey, don't draw such a defined line. I have 2 mares of my own. In addition, a family friend keeps her mare at our place. I feel sorry for this mare every second of every day. Her owner very much has the mentality of, "out of sight out of mind." Keep in mind, she's 17 years old, so the horse is very much out of mind for her. The mare's hooves have been trimmed three times since January. She has an extreme case of heaves that I try to manage to the best of my ability, but the fact is...she needs constant maintenance and specific feeding to manage the heaves and I can't do it. She wasn't getting dewormed, so I took control of that. The only time she gets groomed is if I take the time to do it. So yeah, when I go outside every day and see this horse standing uncomfortably and struggling to breath, my heart breaks a little. I will ALWAYS feel sorry for that horse, and I will ALWAYS be mad at the owner for allowing this to happen to that horse. And yeah, sometimes when MY mare is picking on her I want to make her stop...but I don't. That's the line.
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post #590 of 1323 Old 11-04-2015, 10:49 AM
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I think it's a bit strange that he's taking her out and then putting her back in rather then letting her settle ?

But if you trust it then all good just a bit strange for me.
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