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post #861 of 1323 Old 11-16-2015, 08:46 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by egrogan View Post
Sort of. Observe, note reaction, yes. And start to see patterns of when certain behaviors happen in response to other behaviors.
Ok good plan.

I usually watch from my car while in the parking lot, do you think that is ok? Obviously with her in the herd, I cant just sit in the herd or outside and watch. Plus I kinda dont want my mare to know im watching her herd.

Quote:
But horses don't perfectly follow the sheet of signs, so you have to be willing to stay flexible and understand that there are general trends but not hard and fast rules where sign x always equals behavior y.
Ok

Quote:
Example: the droopy lip thing...my mare is an old lady, she has a droopy lip like many older gals do. But don't let her droopy lip fool you, she may look sleepy but she can go from droopy lip to prancy in the blink of an eye.
Hmm oh, not sure if my mare has a droopy lip. What does it mean when they do it?

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I think this is where you and I just have a different opinion. A solid partnership is something we all probably aspire to. But having to wait a year to "have that partnership" before riding, that's not why I have a horse.
No no, Im not wanting or waiting for my mare and I to have that partnership until I ride her. Im not riding her right now because shes too green and Im not good enough of a rider for her yet. My trainer said I need to spend more time in the saddle before getting on her because shes not very forgiving.

Quote:
I like to ride, and I don't wait months to get to know a horse before riding it first. In fact, I first rode the horse I own now when she was a lesson horse (a job she clearly hated)- and then started free leasing her, and then bought her. After awhile, I think she figured out I was "her person." But at a boarding barn, I don't do all her feeding and care, so while she recognizes me, I'm certainly not the only person she knows or behaves for.
But Im sure you are a more experienced rider than I am.

Quote:
The riding- and going out exploring, or working in the ring on challenges that help us both improve our skills- to me, that's where the partnership comes in and once we started doing a lot more riding on trails alone, that's when I started feeling that she was willing to try hard things for me, and learning things from me.
The previous owner said that my mare will try her hardest to make you happy, which is a very good thing to hear.

Quote:
You're taking riding lessons on a school horse, right?
Yes and the trainer intentionally paired me with one of the mares who is similar to my mare. She tests you, she will resist at times, and can push your buttons. She didnt want to put me on a super forgiving school master because it would be too much of a jump going to my mare. So by putting me with a mare who is similar to mine, it will make the transition smooth. I think this is a very wise move on my trainers behalf.

Quote:
You didn't wait 5 months to get to know that horse before you rode it. So while it's obviously your decision, I just don't see why there's so much hesitation to just get on and ride your own horse. It certainly doesn't need to be all you do with your horse- but it's FUN! You're missing out
I know, but see the above. I stated why Im not riding her right now.
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post #862 of 1323 Old 11-16-2015, 09:40 PM
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I think you and your trainer are being wise Hoofpic. Obviously, your mare is not the horse anyone with any experience would have picked for you, but you picked her and you're doing what it takes to make the match work. I think sometimes we get all wrapped up in Green + Green = Black & Blue and forget that sometimes there is a way around it if the person is willing to take the time and spend the money to get the training for both horse & rider.

I have a little situation here that's going to test me in the next few weeks. My barn helper is a real good hand with the horses on the ground and she's good with the real experienced and broke horses. She is not nearly assertive enough with a mare who likes to get away with things. She's what I call freight and not a driver and because of that my Shining Spark mare, who is green as grass and can be expected to try things, has learned to buck. Barn Gal is not savvy enough to see/feel when she's getting ready to go bronc on her. So, she's not riding her anymore and I have to ride out the bucks and persuade her it's not in her (the mare's) best interest to buck like that. Not riding her is not an option, if she's not pregnant she's got to be rideable by any one that wants to. Bucking is one of 2 things that will get her sent off real quick. I didn't spend the amount I spent on her to have to sell her for a loss at auction, so that means I have to ride her out. I'm almost 60 years old and that's why I have barn help, to ride my green horses. Obviously this gal, while willing, is not able and would get herself hurt. Watching the mistakes she (who actually is a pretty darn good rider, just not terribly pro-active) makes is one of the reasons why I keep telling you to take things slow, be assertive, stick with a good trainer, etc etc etc. If you try to ride your mare without enough experience, for both of you, you could end up in a real unhappy situation or worse, hurt.

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post #863 of 1323 Old 11-16-2015, 10:51 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dreamcatcher Arabians View Post
I think you and your trainer are being wise Hoofpic.
Yes Im confident I am doing the right thing for the both of us.

What really stands out for me is the fact my current trainer advised (at first when meeting her) that I ought to get riding her ASAP. But when we did our first lesson, she changed her mind and saw that I cant ride her right now, defeinitely not.

My past trainer said, "yes I feel you are ready to ride her."

And the trainer before that said that im possibly ready to ride her, but she needs more groundwork to fill holes in her past training. The thing is, with these two trainers, neither was never able to fully tell if i was ready to ride her or not because they never got to see me ride since I never once did a single riding lesson with them, only ground work. So what good is that right? If they cant see how I am in the saddle (just on any horse) then they are unable to assess my riding and whether or not Im ready.

And since neither of them rode my mare, it limits them even further because they dont know what my mare is like in the saddle. Whereas my trainer now FULLY knows because shes been riding her for the past 6 weeks, going into her 7th. So she has a full view and clear consise view on what my mare is like in the saddle and what she needs worked on, and she knows what im like in the saddle and what i need to work on to get myself up to my mares green level.

Quote:
Obviously, your mare is not the horse anyone with any experience would have picked for you, but you picked her and you're doing what it takes to make the match work.
I was far more inexperienced when I got her just over 5 months ago. Yes I went a bit too fast when looking for a horse, and if I was to buy her today, yes I would have taken a much different approach (cause I know what to look for, do, etc before buying a horse), but theres no point in dwelling on the past. What done is done. If I didnt see something in her that really appeals to me, I wouldnt be keeping her.

I cant quite put my finger on it but like my past trainers have all said, they said they feel we can be a great fit over time and that she is a fun little horse. Though she is sensitive (shes a paint and paints are known to be sensitive), she is very bright and will try her hardest to please. I say this not only because the previous owner has told me but I have witnessed it this past summer.

It does make me wonder, if I was to buy her today (having gained the knowledge and experience that i have over the past 5 months), what a difference i would have made right from day 1, but like I said, what is done is done. Move on and keep progressing forward.

Quote:
I think sometimes we get all wrapped up in Green + Green = Black & Blue and forget that sometimes there is a way around it if the person is willing to take the time and spend the money to get the training for both horse & rider.
My past two trainers were full aware of this, plus obviously my trainer now as well. My two past trainers had full faith in me being able to make this work. Why? My attitude and my drive to learn. It all stems from my pure passion for horses. Its amazing where passion will take you, there really is no limits. I experienced it first hand this past summer. Even though the old place wasnt a long term solution and I left on bad terms, I learned and gain some very valuable things and experiences from there that I will never forget.

Quote:
I have a little situation here that's going to test me in the next few weeks. My barn helper is a real good hand with the horses on the ground and she's good with the real experienced and broke horses. She is not nearly assertive enough with a mare who likes to get away with things. She's what I call freight and not a driver and because of that my Shining Spark mare, who is green as grass and can be expected to try things, has learned to buck. Barn Gal is not savvy enough to see/feel when she's getting ready to go bronc on her. So, she's not riding her anymore and I have to ride out the bucks and persuade her it's not in her (the mare's) best interest to buck like that. Not riding her is not an option, if she's not pregnant she's got to be rideable by any one that wants to. Bucking is one of 2 things that will get her sent off real quick. I didn't spend the amount I spent on her to have to sell her for a loss at auction, so that means I have to ride her out. I'm almost 60 years old and that's why I have barn help, to ride my green horses. Obviously this gal, while willing, is not able and would get herself hurt. Watching the mistakes she (who actually is a pretty darn good rider, just not terribly pro-active) makes is one of the reasons why I keep telling you to take things slow, be assertive, stick with a good trainer, etc etc etc. If you try to ride your mare without enough experience, for both of you, you could end up in a real unhappy situation or worse, hurt.
Exactly. And like my past trainer said, my mare is only 4.5 yrs old, she has a lot of time in her life ahead. There is no rush to ride her. Yes of course I want it to happen sooner than later and Im oh so curious to see and experience the doors that open up once I do, but Im doing this all for her. I dont want to mess her up. It takes 3,4, 5 times the amount of time and effort to reteach horses from past mistakes than if you were to just be more patient with the horse, allow them more time and have them trained right.

Last edited by Hoofpic; 11-16-2015 at 10:58 PM.
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post #864 of 1323 Old 11-16-2015, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Hoofpic View Post
Ok good plan.


No no, Im not wanting or waiting for my mare and I to have that partnership until I ride her. Im not riding her right now because shes too green and Im not good enough of a rider for her yet. My trainer said I need to spend more time in the saddle before getting on her because shes not very forgiving.



But Im sure you are a more experienced rider than I am.




Yes and the trainer intentionally paired me with one of the mares who is similar to my mare. She tests you, she will resist at times, and can push your buttons. She didnt want to put me on a super forgiving school master because it would be too much of a jump going to my mare. So by putting me with a mare who is similar to mine, it will make the transition smooth. I think this is a very wise move on my trainers behalf.



I know, but see the above. I stated why Im not riding her right now.


Seriously. Wise words!
As long as you stick to your plan and try to get some good riding time in and continue to work toward getting on your mare as soon as you're ready, I think you are being smart. The most important thing is that you can ride confident and relaxed, the rest will come with time.



This is why I still follow 'A Couple Questions', a couple thousand questions later!
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post #865 of 1323 Old 11-16-2015, 11:22 PM Thread Starter
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Seriously. Wise words!
As long as you stick to your plan and try to get some good riding time in and continue to work toward getting on your mare as soon as you're ready, I think you are being smart.
Thats why on just my 2nd lesson with my trainer, she asked what I wanted to do and she suggested I ride on a lesson horse. She said the sooner I get riding, the better.

Even though she hasnt said it, I do feel that she does see potential in me. She knows what my strengths and weaknesses are when riding. For a newbie rider, she said I have pretty good form and very good balance. Im not surprised that i have good balance. It started right from the very first time I got on a horse, i never struggled to balance myself and keep myself from falling. And yes I learn quick, the adjustments she got me to make in the first lesson automatically carried over to the 2nd lesson.


Quote:
The most important thing is that you can ride confident and relaxed, the rest will come with time.
I think so as well. I feel relaxed and confident when taking direction from my trainer. She really is good at what she does. The most important thing is that im relaxed and confident when doing lessons with her. She doesnt make me nervous at all.

Im looking forward to Sats lesson and hoping to pick up a nice set of much lighter boots to ride in and pants so that I feel lighter in the saddle and can use my legs more effectively. I think the shoes and pants make a big difference and play a signifcant role in how well you are able to use your legs and hips especially since everything starts from my legs, then hips and my hands are last! Legs and hips are what im primarily focused on since my trainer wants me to use my hands as little as possible.

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This is why I still follow 'A Couple Questions', a couple thousand questions later!
Yes. :)
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Last edited by Hoofpic; 11-16-2015 at 11:28 PM.
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post #866 of 1323 Old 11-17-2015, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by egrogan View Post
Sort of. Observe, note reaction, yes. And start to see patterns of when certain behaviors happen in response to other behaviors. But horses don't perfectly follow the sheet of signs, so you have to be willing to stay flexible and understand that there are general trends but not hard and fast rules where sign x always equals behavior y. Example: the droopy lip thing...my mare is an old lady, she has a droopy lip like many older gals do. But don't let her droopy lip fool you, she may look sleepy but she can go from droopy lip to prancy in the blink of an eye.



I think this is where you and I just have a different opinion. A solid partnership is something we all probably aspire to. But having to wait a year to "have that partnership" before riding, that's not why I have a horse. I like to ride, and I don't wait months to get to know a horse before riding it first. In fact, I first rode the horse I own now when she was a lesson horse (a job she clearly hated)- and then started free leasing her, and then bought her. After awhile, I think she figured out I was "her person." But at a boarding barn, I don't do all her feeding and care, so while she recognizes me, I'm certainly not the only person she knows or behaves for. The riding- and going out exploring, or working in the ring on challenges that help us both improve our skills- to me, that's where the partnership comes in and once we started doing a lot more riding on trails alone, that's when I started feeling that she was willing to try hard things for me, and learning things from me.

You're taking riding lessons on a school horse, right? You didn't wait 5 months to get to know that horse before you rode it. So while it's obviously your decision, I just don't see why there's so much hesitation to just get on and ride your own horse. It certainly doesn't need to be all you do with your horse- but it's FUN! You're missing out
Absolutely! Hoofpic I think you worry a lot about doing it so perfectly and not making mistakes you are missing out. It's never gonna be perfect, mistakes will always be made. Not the end of the world. Hoofpic DONT WORRY! Remember why you have a horse!

Maybe get off this thread more and see what other people are dealing with, it could help.
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Last edited by Whinnie; 11-17-2015 at 11:44 AM. Reason: add
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post #867 of 1323 Old 11-17-2015, 11:43 AM Thread Starter
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Absolutely! Hoofpic I think you worry a lot about doing it so perfectly and not making mistakes you are missing out. It's never gonna be perfect, mistakes will always be made. Not the end of the world. Hoofpic DONT WORRY! Remember why you have a horse!

Maybe get off this thread more and see what other people are dealing with, it could help.
Im not so much worried about making mistakes (I am to a certain extent), but I just want to make sure Im consistent, clear and concise in giving my mare directions. This doesnt just go for riding but even when I did ground work with her. I put so much emphasis on consistency because horses will always be consistent every time when working with them, its up to us to go about the same ways when giving ques each time when teaching them something or asking something from them. (This is advice from past trainer).

I do like to observe other boarders at the barn as well. Im not the only one who is a novice rider and has a green horse (but also I have the youngest mare on the property). There are others boarders in my shoes and from what Ive noticed Im the only one who is not riding their horse.
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post #868 of 1323 Old 11-17-2015, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Hoofpic View Post
Im not so much worried about making mistakes (I am to a certain extent), but I just want to make sure Im consistent, clear and concise in giving my mare directions. This doesnt just go for riding but even when I did ground work with her. I put so much emphasis on consistency because horses will always be consistent every time when working with them, its up to us to go about the same ways when giving ques each time when teaching them something or asking something from them. (This is advice from past trainer).
I know that.

[/QUOTE]I do like to observe other boarders at the barn as well. Im not the only one who is a novice rider and has a green horse (but also I have the youngest mare on the property). There are others boarders in my shoes and from what Ive noticed Im the only one who is not riding their horse.[/QUOTE]

There you go.
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post #869 of 1323 Old 11-17-2015, 12:16 PM Thread Starter
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There you go.
I do agree with you though 100% that perhaps (much sooner than i would think), I can get on my mare and just ride her at a simple walk for 10mins with my training by my side. This wont be happening right now but perhaps sometime in the winter.

Im just a bit nervous thats all, I dont know how shes going to respond. My trainer says shes very sensitive and it takes the absolutely lightest amount of pressure to get her to respond. Cause theres been times where the trainer gave a bit too much and my mare swished her tail at her telling her to back off.
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post #870 of 1323 Old 11-17-2015, 01:29 PM Thread Starter
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Question about riding attire.

I should be able to ride in what ever i find most comfortable right? If so, then I would choose to ride in my trackpants and runners. Is runners a bad idea?

I dont mind running over to the thrift store to get new pants and shoes if I need it but if I dont, then I got lots of clothes at home.
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