A couple questions - Page 91 - The Horse Forum
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post #901 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 11:43 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by greentree View Post
If you are teaching her to pick up her foot, and she is TRYING, by pawing, then you are teaching her NOT to pick up her foot. Go re read our posts on teaching. You HAVE to recognize a TRY.
Im not rewarding her for pawing. When I bend over facing her HQ, I tap her leg and then run my hand from her knee down to the hoof. If she picks up and paws, I pull my hand away and say "quit" and let her put it back down. Then wait a few secs and try it again.

When she picks up her hoof gently off the ground, as soon as it comes up, I reward her. The good thing is that Im fortunately able to tell 100% as soon as the hoof comes off the ground whether shes lifting her hoof to have it cleaned or shes going to paw. I can tell by the way she has her foot take off and the hoof cant be coming off the ground until I at least tap her leg and run my hand down her leg. Doesnt even have to be all the way down, even just an inch would work. I feel she has made that connection because when she lifts willingly, she does it well before my hand reaches her hoof.

Remember, Im not even grabbing her hoof, Im just tapping the inside leg, run my hand from her knee to her hoof so that she can make the connection (and I feel she has). This is why I allowed 1-2mins between each time doing it so she can think about it.
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post #902 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 11:49 AM
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[QUOTE=Hoofpic;8276426]Im not rewarding her for pawing. When I bend over facing her HQ, I tap her leg and then run my hand from her knee down to the hoof. If she picks up and paws, I pull my hand away and say "quit" and let her put it back down. Then wait a few secs and try it again.

When she picks up her hoof gently off the ground, as soon as it comes up, I reward her. Remember, Im not even grabbing her hoof, Im just tapping the inside leg, run my hand from her knee to her hoof so that she can make the connection (and I feel she has). This is why I allowed 1-2mins between each time doing it so she can think about it.[/

SHE IS doing what you ask...picking her foot up. TRYING. Grab her foot when she lifts it to paw, and pretend that is what you want.
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post #903 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 11:57 AM Thread Starter
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[quote=greentree;8276466]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoofpic View Post
Im not rewarding her for pawing. When I bend over facing her HQ, I tap her leg and then run my hand from her knee down to the hoof. If she picks up and paws, I pull my hand away and say "quit" and let her put it back down. Then wait a few secs and try it again.

When she picks up her hoof gently off the ground, as soon as it comes up, I reward her. Remember, Im not even grabbing her hoof, Im just tapping the inside leg, run my hand from her knee to her hoof so that she can make the connection (and I feel she has). This is why I allowed 1-2mins between each time doing it so she can think about it.[/

SHE IS doing what you ask...picking her foot up. TRYING. Grab her foot when she lifts it to paw, and pretend that is what you want.
Grab her foot while she tries to paw? Wont that confuse her?

I know shes doing what I ask by picking up her foot, but if she lifts it to paw, then I do not reward for that.

I can tell what her intentions are, right as the hoof comes off the ground because when she picks up her foot in anticipation to have it cleaned, its slower and she will always hold it up for me so when I reward her, her hoof is still in the air, or just starting to come down.

If she paws, then her hoof comes off the ground a lot more aggresively and faster.
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post #904 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 12:52 PM
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If I am behind you, and I tap you on the shoulder and you turn around, but What I WANT is for you to turn around twice, how am I supposed to teach you to turn around twice if I punish you for turning around once? I have to get you to turn around ONCE. Then I can reward THAT, and work on the second one.
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post #905 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 12:55 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by greentree View Post
If I am behind you, and I tap you on the shoulder and you turn around, but What I WANT is for you to turn around twice, how am I supposed to teach you to turn around twice if I punish you for turning around once? I have to get you to turn around ONCE. Then I can reward THAT, and work on the second one.
Im confused
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post #906 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 12:57 PM
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But it COMES off the ground, which is the response you are looking for. She DOES NOT know the difference. The pawing may be a response to being confused, but she still should not get punished......
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post #907 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 01:38 PM
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Perfectionist tendencies will confuse her. Get there a little at a time. Grabbing her foot when she starts to paw will answer her question of "what does hoofpic want----oh, he wants to hold my foot after I pick it up". You are making it a multiple choice question and not helping her with the right answer.
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post #908 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 01:46 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by greentree View Post
But it COMES off the ground, which is the response you are looking for. She DOES NOT know the difference.
OH ok I get it now!

The thing that confuses me is that, if she picks up her hoof with the intention of pawing, if I grab it and hold it (how long do I hold it for?), then l let go, doesnt that tell her "hey I was wanting to paw, I was trying to paw, but my foot got grabbed and i got rewarded for it"?

Quote:
The pawing may be a response to being confused, but she still should not get punished......
Im not punishing her for pawing, I just say quit.
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post #909 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 01:48 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Whinnie View Post
Perfectionist tendencies will confuse her. Get there a little at a time. Grabbing her foot when she starts to paw will answer her question of "what does hoofpic want----oh, he wants to hold my foot after I pick it up". You are making it a multiple choice question and not helping her with the right answer.
Oh ok. by holding her foot after she picks it up (even if she is pawing) will tell her right away thats what she wants?

But what if she paws and I havent even given her the que to lift (which is tap the leg and run my hand down it). Theres no way i should reward that because technically i dont want her lifting her foot until i give her the que right? In other words when I "Ask" for it.
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post #910 of 1323 Old 11-19-2015, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Hoofpic View Post
Oh ok. by holding her foot after she picks it up (even if she is pawing) will tell her right away thats what she wants?

But what if she paws and I havent even given her the que to lift (which is tap the leg and run my hand down it). Theres no way i should reward that because technically i dont want her lifting her foot until i give her the que right? In other words when I "Ask" for it.
What if you catch her when you think she is about to paw and hold it for a second, rewarding her by putting it down when she relaxes? Then you reward the holding it, not the pawing. Are you able to do that? Can you hold on? If she is pawing to avoid you picking up her foot, what better way to foil her idea?

If you hold her foot up, do it until she relaxes, then put it down. Even if it is only one second. The reward should be immediate. Gradually, over time, increase the time you hold it, letting it down for the reward when she relaxes. She will soon get used to it, trust you, and fall asleep while you are cleaning her hoof.

I don't tap the leg first and run my hand down. I just reach down to the point where I want to hold it and she just picks it up. Maybe you are giving too long of a cue.
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