HELP Please - Horse's behavior getting progressively worse... - Page 3 - The Horse Forum
 61Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #21 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 03:02 AM
Foal
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Northern Ireland
Posts: 162
• Horses: 1
Just another thought.. Is he receiving a lot of hard feed ie. Grain or concentrates? Has his food ration changed at all?
Just thinking he could possibly be feeling a bit fresh..especially as he is giving a buck and a skip out on rides? The nipping and restless behaviour could point to this as well.

Also, maybe check that nothing is pinching him, his saddle, bit, bridle, girth etc but I'm sure you have probably already thought of this.

On the other hand he could be feeling a little bored if he is riding the same place every day. Try changing the ride around a little if you think this is the case?

Good luck with him anyway! :0)

When in danger or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout. Robert A. Heinlein
Emeraldsprings is offline  
post #22 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 03:07 AM
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 20,538
• Horses: 0
Hi & welcome,

Agree with others for the most part but a few thoughts to add/consider. First & foremost, I STRONGLY suggest you find a good trainer/instructor to help you learn, because all the best written tips in the world pale compared to hands on, first hand help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kieran View Post
Mounting: He REFUSES to stand still. Won't do it, never has. Takes me 5-10 minutes to get on, and when I do, he backs up, goes forward, turns around, and is generally agitated by my presence.
This may be just one more eg of him trying to assert himself. But consider other possible reasons. ESP as you say he's never been good at this. Not standing to be mounted & being generally 'antsy' under saddle is very frequently to do with pain. So rule that out/treat it first. ESP if he's an ex racer, there are likely body issues that may not have been addressed.

I suggest using a mounting block(log, fence, whatever) as a rule, to reduce possible mounting discomfort. Just because you CAN get on from the ground doesn't mean you should, or it will be comfortable for him - even assuming perfect saddle fit & no back/body issues, especially if you always mount from the same side. Especially if you are a big person. If say, you were a 5' featherweight, then that probably wouldn't be such a consideration.

He may also have never been taught to stand for mounting, or that he can relax and stand under a rider.

Quote:
At first, perfect trail riding, calm, collected. Now, he randomly bucks, lifts a leg, crabs, and kicks out at the other horses (whom he lives with) on trail.
That all sounds like it could be due to pain, esp if his behaviour has changed with horses he knows well.

It can get quite scary, especially whilst along cliffs and rivers on a narrow path...I've checked his tack (all new), fitting, burrs, etc, but can't see why he's so bent out of shape. He also tries to bite my legs when we stop, only he can't reach
Quote:
He nips sometimes, but passively.
I find it difficult to understand how you can call that 'passive'. You also mentioned slobber on your sleeve. I would sit down & have a hard think about the 'manners' you want and how you're going to enforce - and reward - them consistently. For safety's sake, regardless of whether you mind slobber & him getting in your space, keeping his mouth away from you at all times & keeping him at arms length unless you get in his space or you expressly ask him to be closer are among the manners I think very important.

Re punishment for Wrong behaviours, timing is SO important and punishing after the event is not so effective, even if it's only by a second or few. Horses need instant associations & it's best to set it up that the horse punishes *himself* as he *starts* the behaviour if possible. Eg if he nips you & you're holding a wire brush or such - ouch! He's less likely to try that again!

Quote:
overall, I still think he's a great horse. Even on his worst day, he's still more-or-less manageable and never outright mean or vicious.
For fear of sounding... Fluffy I'm sure he's a great horse! Just that horses learn to do what's good for them & quit doing what isn't. So even if he were 'outright mean' you've got to ask yourself whats been going on that he's *learned* the necessity & effectiveness of that behaviour??

Quote:
What worries me is just that things are getting progressively WORSE all the time...I'd appreicate any thoughts on how to improve this!
You haven't told, aside from saying you smack him for biting etc, what you've so far done/tried to fix it?
Posted via Mobile Device
loosie is online now  
post #23 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 06:23 AM
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: SW UK
Posts: 15,151
• Horses: 0
Problems begin with all the talk of wanting to 'bond' with a horse and many people thinking that being nice is the way to go.
With horses this is often giving tidbits, ignoring the fact that the horse is searching pockets for these treats, pushing into the handler all going uncorrected because 'he is pleased to see me'

Truth is that the animal is not pleased to see you at all, he just wants the mobile treat machines that has arrived.

Bonding comes from respect. Respect comes from having rules, boundaries and regulations.

These are achieved from consistency and firmness. these rules need to be tight to start when every little thing is corrected. This might mean being physical with a whack with the rope if leading, a hard poke to make the horse move away, whatever it takes to get it to do whatever is wanted.

Very soon these little things disappear, the horse realises that you are going to follow through and stop trying things on. You can then use your voice for correction it will be enough. When the wanted behaviour is achieved again praise with the voice, a scratch in a favourite spot, release of pressure is ample reward.

Timing is everything as is consistency. The time spent correcting every little thing might seem wasted - it isn't, the effort with doing so saves hours in trying to correct escalated behaviour.

This owner is new to horses, the horse sounds as if he was a very good and suitable riding companion, he has learned that he can get away with the little things so, bigger things are happening.

Look at his feed, ample hay is probably all he needs, a handful of hard feed consisting mainly of chaff (chopped hay) is probably all he needs.

Over feeding is a common error of those not experienced, 90% of horses are overweight.
Foxhunter is offline  
post #24 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 09:23 AM
Started
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 2,246
• Horses: 0
Thank you so much for starting this thread. We just got horses and I'm learning so much from it! I am, by nature, a coddler with my animals. I've definitely learned what not to do here (and I was already making some mistakes). Once at lessons I saw our trainer give a horse a good hard smack on the nose when he nibbled at her arm, which I thought was so mean. Now, I see why she did it. Thanks to the original poster & all who replied!
Jan1975 is offline  
post #25 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 09:58 AM
Guest
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Ontario
Posts: 17,293
• Horses: 0
Smacking a horse's nose is not the way to deal with a mouthy horse as he will turn it into a game. Action must be immediate in making him move away from you. Ever watch a horse invade another's space and touch it? The other horse takes real offence and will immediately either charge the offender or turn heel, in both instances making the offender move away. In order to gain a horse's respect we need to do the same as this is what horse's understand. We teach them in their language, not ours.



greentree likes this.
Saddlebag is offline  
post #26 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 10:42 AM
Trained
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Palmyra, Wisconsin
Posts: 6,161
• Horses: 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnalisaParalyzer View Post
For the nipping, a good hard smack works. The second you feel teeth, you need to send a quick hard smack to his jaw. If it's quick and hard enough, it should only take once or twice for him to get it.
I wouldn't wait to feel teeth.
natisha is offline  
post #27 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 12:49 PM
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: SW UK
Posts: 15,151
• Horses: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saddlebag View Post
Smacking a horse's nose is not the way to deal with a mouthy horse as he will turn it into a game. Action must be immediate in making him move away from you.
An open handed slap on the side of their muzzles will not turn it into a game if done hard enough - they usually do not try a second time.
Foxhunter is offline  
post #28 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 01:32 PM
Weanling
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 356
• Horses: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxhunter View Post
An open handed slap on the side of their muzzles will not turn it into a game if done hard enough - they usually do not try a second time.
I agree with this. I think everyone has different ways. If a behaviour is corrected fast enough I don't think it matters how, just the the horse understands that behaviour is not going to be allowed.
Posted via Mobile Device
Liligirl is offline  
post #29 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 01:49 PM
Started
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: New Brunswick Canada
Posts: 2,205
• Horses: 1
Only read to the second page but, some things I found alarming. First off, raising a hand when he nips isn't going to do a thing if a solid boundary isn't already in place. That comes after. He needs a solid smack to the lips when e does this. Another thing I find alarming is your mindset of "he doesn't really bite me, he bites to the side" and "he doesn't really buck it's only a couple inches." This is still a serious problem. Act like a drill sergeant. He won't hate you for this he will trust in your absolute leadership. Don't give him any leeway, when he bucks-even the tiniest amount- smack him with that crop and turn him in a tight circle. Make it clear that that is NOT allowed. When he tries to nip you, even if it's in a mock bite, whack him fast and whack him good. Get in his face, think along the lines of how DARE he threaten his leader. Then calmly go back to grooming. When he kicks out at horses on the trail make him canter hard and circle back around to the others. Walk by them again. Or slap him with that crop and circle back yet again. There's many ways of getting it through that that is absolutely not allowed. I'd also have him checked for ulcers, as that seems completely probable.
Avna likes this.
WhattaTroublemaker is offline  
post #30 of 31 Old 12-20-2015, 01:57 PM
Started
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: New Brunswick Canada
Posts: 2,205
• Horses: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saddlebag View Post
Smacking a horse's nose is not the way to deal with a mouthy horse as he will turn it into a game. Action must be immediate in making him move away from you. Ever watch a horse invade another's space and touch it? The other horse takes real offence and will immediately either charge the offender or turn heel, in both instances making the offender move away. In order to gain a horse's respect we need to do the same as this is what horse's understand. We teach them in their language, not ours.
Technically it is in their language. A new gelding biting another's rump in the pasture got a swift kick in the teeth a few months ago. Resulted in bloody lips and a chipped tooth. You can bet your butt that he never bit him since. Our corrections don't need to be that harsh but they still need to get the point across. I rarely see our horses charge one another, but lightning quick strikes and kicks have gotten the point clear. Now that they're settled in not a lot happens. Usually it's a look that tells them to move. But, in the beginning there had to be some sort of violence to make those looks mean something
Avna likes this.
WhattaTroublemaker is offline  
Reply

Tags
aggressive , nip , pinned , problem , shy

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Horse Forum forums, you must first register.

Already have a Horse Forum account?
Members are allowed only one account per person at the Horse Forum, so if you've made an account here in the past you'll need to continue using that account. Please do not create a new account or you may lose access to the Horse Forum. If you need help recovering your existing account, please Contact Us. We'll be glad to help!

New to the Horse Forum?
Please choose a username you will be satisfied with using for the duration of your membership at the Horse Forum. We do not change members' usernames upon request because that would make it difficult for everyone to keep track of who is who on the forum. For that reason, please do not incorporate your horse's name into your username so that you are not stuck with a username related to a horse you may no longer have some day, or use any other username you may no longer identify with or care for in the future.



User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Old Thread Warning
This thread is more than 90 days old. When a thread is this old, it is often better to start a new thread rather than post to it. However, If you feel you have something of value to add to this particular thread, you can do so by checking the box below before submitting your post.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Horse getting worse rather than better lately... NRW Horse Training 31 06-08-2014 10:39 PM
Worse Than Horse Slaughter! Midnite711 Horse Talk 57 06-08-2014 03:11 PM
Possible horse with founder but ends up worse then we think. ahoover0729 Hoof Care 18 07-14-2013 11:45 AM
Whats worse for a horse??? opinionss megannnn Horse Health 18 02-05-2010 11:38 PM
Drugs no worse that horse riding Pinto Pony Horse Talk 8 02-09-2009 12:56 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome