Would love your comments on this horse's way of going, conformation, etc - Page 3 - The Horse Forum
 38Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #21 of 32 Old 09-03-2015, 11:08 AM
Trained
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Colorado
Posts: 8,228
• Horses: 1
^Informative post!

OP, are you any closer to making a decision?

The sensitivity of the internet baffles me.
Zexious is offline  
post #22 of 32 Old 09-03-2015, 12:22 PM
Showing
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: southern Arizona
Posts: 12,065
• Horses: 4
If the horse isn't moving right due to training, retrain him.

Bandit was used for some sort of racing. His rider was probably over 200 lbs in his socks, using a western saddle, and Bandit is probably around 800 lbs. When I first asked him to trot, he exploded into a very fast trot. I was bouncing so much I wondered if I had forgotten how to sit a trot. It took a while for me to realize that no matter what I did, he braced his back like an I-beam.

He had been ridden in open country using a bosal as primary, but needed a bit to stop him because he was competitive. At least, that is what I was told. I like bits, and he knew the basics of a bit. But I found him hard in the mouth with little flexibility. If I took the slack out of the reins at a trot, he would slam on the brakes and come to a complete stop before all the slack was out. The first time caught me by surprise and I bumped my hands against his neck to keep from being thrown off the front of the saddle. He also did all transitions like that from trot to stop.

We started working on it in early July. This was on our first arena ride:



I asked for advice on HF, dug into some dressage books I own for ideas, and re-read Littauer's "School Your Horse" and Chamberlin's book on training a horse from the beginning (can't remember the title right now).

There were also issues with his feet. He was very sensitive after pulling the front shoes, and his left front hoof has been changing angle - coming back - over the last 3 months, with more to go.

One of the dressage books I bought on HF recommendation summed it up like this - and it is pretty similar to Littauer and Chamberlin and others:
"The three cardinal principles of riding are: Forward, Calm and Straight...

...When the horse is carefully steeped in a consistent routine; hand-led with firm kindness and respect, the animal becomes mentally matured and mellow...a willing and generous worker, confident in mankind" - pg 49 & 51

"When training the horse - do little and frequently.

Any artificial placement of the horse's head must be strictly avoided...

One will always be able to trace any riding problem to the breaking of one, or all, of the cardinal rules of horsemanship: 'forward, calm and straight'" - page 58
So, after 60 days, is he "fixed"?

No. Most of what I've read says it can take a few months to a year or more to really establish a solid foundation of forward and calm, particularly on a horse who has been ridden a lot without that base.

But his back is much looser. He braces when he is scared, but he is starting to use his back. Littauer recommended working on 3 speeds of walking and 3 speeds of trotting. For my purposes, I emphasize forward and calm on every ride, even if it means we don't trot at all. And we work on TWO speeds of walk, and two of trot. That is about what he can handle right now.

But I can ride him with light contact if needed (I'm more western than English). He responds to an opening rein. I can ask him for a turn with my pinkie, and he responds some to my leg. My goal is what Barry Godden used to call "A Gentleman's Horse" - a reliable horse who can be ridden lightly, can trot side-by-side with another horse, handles himself around traffic or a trail, takes care of himself and his rider, etc. Bandit is making progress and I think he'll be a pretty decent horse by spring. He's 7 now. I'm 57. If we get good with each other, I might be riding him for 20 years...so I have time.

He'll always carry his head higher than some, given his breeding, but he's starting to carry it a lot lower as he relaxes.

On the plus side, he arrived here liking and trusting humans. I doubt I'll ever race him. I doubt I'll ever use him to chase coyotes - something he has done in the past. But he has a decent mind, like people, trusts people and tries. That's huge in my book!

If you aren't in the market for a finished horse, and I assume you aren't given the age of this one, then there is a lot to be said for looking for sound legs, sound mind, willing spirit and likes people. Then apply the training that meets your goals.

The result may not take you very high in competition. But you'll learn a lot, and there is always a good market for a horse of sound mind who moves well and can handle the basics even with a kid on his back.

I like Bandit better than Trooper. We're a closer match that way. He's a better match for what I need in a horse than Mia was. But I miss the personality of the two Arabian mares I've owned. If Bandit and I bond over the next year or two, we may be together until he dies. If not...then a year or two from now, I'd have no trouble finding a good home for a reliable, confident, relaxed trail horse. I don't need to make him perfect. If I can make him a "Horse Without a List" (as Cherie would put it), I'll always have the option of finding him a good home and moving on.

Good luck with whatever you decide.
natisha, dlady and ecasey like this.

Riders ask "How?" Horsemen ask "Why?"
bsms is offline  
post #23 of 32 Old 09-05-2015, 10:32 AM Thread Starter
Started
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: I'm an American girl living in southwest France
Posts: 1,563
• Horses: 6
No, still on the fence. There's someone else coming to look at her in a couple days. If they don't take her then I'll take that as a sign that I probably should! :)

“When I bestride him, I soar, I am a hawk: he trots the air; the earth sings when he touches it; the basest horn of his hoof is more musical than the pipe of Hermes. ” ~ William Shakespeare
ecasey is offline  
post #24 of 32 Old 09-05-2015, 02:53 PM
Showing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 47,419
• Horses: 2
if they do, take it as a sign that you should have.
Yogiwick likes this.
tinyliny is online now  
post #25 of 32 Old 09-05-2015, 03:00 PM
Showing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 47,419
• Horses: 2
I would judge the horse based on her conformation (standing still), her movement at liberty, her personality while being handled and free lunged/lunged on a line, her react to new things if you can expose her to some, and lastly, how she rides.

and, if possible, you ride her. the thing is, if the horse has a way of pulling down and behind the bit, that can be due to that rider, or to her riding history. if the hrose has a lifetime of going that way, you won't be able to change that. if they are very young, you can influence and change that, within the limits of their conformation.

for me, I would not want to buy a horse that had had a ton of Western Pleasure training. could be a real nice horse, but the horse would be wanting to jog slow and I'd be wanting to trot faster, and we'd hate each other. same for a barrel trained horse; that horse would want to blitz, and I'd be scared and hauling back, and we'd hate each other. If the training is really ingrained, then it's hard to change and not fair to the horse. and, above my riding level to retrain it.

a young horse that moves pretty evenly and has an open attitude is more of a blank slate.
ecasey likes this.
tinyliny is online now  
post #26 of 32 Old 09-05-2015, 03:16 PM
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: CT USA an English transplant
Posts: 33,867
• Horses: 3
I had a horse on trial here for about 8 weeks that had winnings in WP but she had no trouble at all riding 'English' and trotting out at 'normal' speed with her head up so I think even they can be re-schooled.
I didn't keep her in the end but that decision wasn't based off her inability to become a forward moving horse - probably not the best wording to describe what I'm trying to say!!!
bsms likes this.
jaydee is offline  
post #27 of 32 Old 09-05-2015, 03:31 PM
Showing
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 47,419
• Horses: 2
but you are a good rider.
it can work, but some horses find themselves all upset being asked to trot out after years of being castigated for doing that.
jaydee likes this.
tinyliny is online now  
post #28 of 32 Old 09-05-2015, 04:09 PM
Showing
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: southern Arizona
Posts: 12,065
• Horses: 4
During the months that I took lessons, almost all of the horses came from a WP show background. Most were in their 20s. One refused to trot unless you carried a crop and hit him once, hard, to prove you were serious. All the rest had no trouble at all with trotting forward when asked. They all cantered with a real canter, too.
dlady likes this.

Riders ask "How?" Horsemen ask "Why?"
bsms is offline  
post #29 of 32 Old 09-06-2015, 01:14 AM
Weanling
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 387
• Horses: 3
I have 3 geldings. Today I visited a friend and rode 1 of her mares, a 17 year old that has been doing western pleasure since it was 3 years old. 15.3h, kind gentle eyes and one of the calmest horses I've ever ridden. Except her trot, if you post, you will get the ride of your life. To her posting means speed up. The more you post, the faster she trots. A light tug on the reins and she slows down only to speed up again if I kept posting. If I sit the trot, she is very calm and relaxed. She seems very eager to please her rider. I'm going to work with her in the round pen a few times to try to get her use to me posting because the sitting trot is not one of my specialties.

If your horse is being ridden with contact on the bit, that may be why it's pulling down or going behind the bit. Most all western pleasure and reining horses that I've met has been trained to ride on loose reins, without any contact on the bit.
bsms and ecasey like this.

"Don't let doubt, fear or the negativity of others stand in the way of your dreams and goals." - Clinton
dlady is offline  
post #30 of 32 Old 09-06-2015, 01:27 PM
Trained
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Colorado
Posts: 8,228
• Horses: 1
To be fair, I'm not sure that basing your decision off of someone failing to purchase a horse is a good idea xD
Subbing, to see how things turn out :>
Yogiwick likes this.

The sensitivity of the internet baffles me.
Zexious is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the The Horse Forum forums, you must first register.

Already have a Horse Forum account?
Members are allowed only one account per person at the Horse Forum, so if you've made an account here in the past you'll need to continue using that account. Please do not create a new account or you may lose access to the Horse Forum. If you need help recovering your existing account, please Contact Us. We'll be glad to help!

New to the Horse Forum?
Please choose a username you will be satisfied with using for the duration of your membership at the Horse Forum. We do not change members' usernames upon request because that would make it difficult for everyone to keep track of who is who on the forum. For that reason, please do not incorporate your horse's name into your username so that you are not stuck with a username related to a horse you may no longer have some day, or use any other username you may no longer identify with or care for in the future.



User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Old Thread Warning
This thread is more than 90 days old. When a thread is this old, it is often better to start a new thread rather than post to it. However, If you feel you have something of value to add to this particular thread, you can do so by checking the box below before submitting your post.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
APHA Solid-Bred Mare. Would love conformation critique! VLBUltraHot Horse Conformation Critique 15 10-27-2013 07:07 PM
Funniest horse comments Allegro Horse Talk 9 11-20-2012 05:12 PM
Could you let us know your comments on this horse fence? horsepanel Horse Talk 16 07-04-2012 03:14 AM
Conformation critique pleaaase!!? it would make me love you :) cosmomomo Horse Riding Critique 7 08-31-2010 12:40 AM
Your Comments on This horse please? Ladywantsahorse Horses for Sale 4 12-28-2009 01:48 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome