Considering Euthenasia - My Heart is Breaking - Page 5 - The Horse Forum
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post #41 of 55 Old 06-04-2014, 12:58 AM
Green Broke
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: abilene,tx
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no pit bulls are not supposed to show any kind of human aggression period, animal aggression yes.

This dog is agin not mentally stable enough to be any kind of watch/guard dog.

Why risk a known biter , this isn't a one time thing, this isn't a dog that hasn't had any work done with it. This is a dog that has now had a chance to make a turn around and instead has bitten on multiple occasions, one being a man he had been around regularly NOT a stranger. Why keep a dog that is a lawsuit waiting to happen. Sure it is your responsibilty but you can not help stupid people. Even if she puts a beware of dog sign up that just means she is admitting she knows she has an aggressive dog.

This dog in my world would not be getting a second chance for the simple fact, he is not stable and i am not going to spend my day muzzling every time he goes out and/or worrying who he might possibly get next and if that person will sue. It is not a game anymore this dog is not a dog worth putting a ton of effort into when there are thousands in the pound that are sane and could make a turn around to be a safe canine citizen.
As for the big cat thing I disagree with that as well, they are not pets its not a matter of if they will escape or injure someone its a matter of when. There are highly trained big cats who ahve turned on their trainers who have raised them. Big cats are a whole nother ball game then a known aggressive biting dog.

just a small town girl with a big town dream :]
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post #42 of 55 Old 06-04-2014, 01:06 AM
Yearling
 
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Am I the only one who thinks that unless your dog is protecting you they should never bite? I would have euthanized this dog a long time ago. There are too many homeless dogs that are perfect with anybody and everybody to justify keeping one that you have to keep locked up or muzzled. I've taken in feral dogs that were scared s***less of humans, and they have never once offered to bite. Fear is not an excuse for a dog to bite.

Sully ~Sullivan's Fly Supply~ [17.1 TB] RIP 2/24/14
Rio ~Camperio~ [18.0 Oldenburg]
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post #43 of 55 Old 06-04-2014, 01:12 AM
Green Broke
 
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Exactly sullysrider!!And even then they should be properly trained to know protection work not just bite because someone makes them think you are threatened. I am 100% with you on that. My doberman has been put in some stressfull positions and never once has she even let a growl slip. I do not see the point in keeping a known biter with all the sane stable dogs in the shelters and rescues, more being added hourly, not daily but hourly.

This dog knew the latest person he bit, a simple act done many times before and he still bit. That isn't fear that is just unstable.

just a small town girl with a big town dream :]
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post #44 of 55 Old 06-07-2014, 04:37 PM
Weanling
 
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A quick note on Children and dogs.

Dogs are very tolerant when raised correctly. That does NOT mean that they are absolutely guaranteed not to be dogs. Children have to learn to respect dogs as much as vice versa.

If a child is bit by the dog TALK TO THEM and ASK what they were doing to the dog before the bite. Answers like "I was barking at him" or "I pulled his Ears/Tail/Legs/Skin" or "I put my face next to his!" are ALL the child's or parent's fault.

These sort of things (being "in your face" to the dog or pulling on them) are, in a Dog's Body Language, a Challenge and a very Uncomfortable Situation for the dog to be in. These, between dogs, will cause dog fights. Between dogs and humans, it can cause actual bites. It is also a child's parent's fault for not teaching their child proper etiquette for being around a dog. It's in this case that it is NEVER the dog's fault (just like it's never a horse's fault) when the dog bites.

If there is no apparent reason (as in I was petting him and he just bit me!) that is when you should consider rehoming, sending it to the vet/behaviorist/pound, or in EXTREME situations, euthanasia. Remember. Not all dogs are children loving or tolerant. Just like not all humans are dog loving or tolerant. Even the most child loving/tolerant dog can snap. Always supervise interaction between dogs and children.

My Dog Bit My Child has a lot of useful information on dog and child interaction.

Remember too, a young dog (anything under 2 years old) is still technically a puppy/teenaged dog. They are unruly, have a lot to learn and in need of molding. From 8wks to 1yr they are pretty good. They start to challenge their owners after 1yr and can start as early as 8mos.

Get educated on dog behavior and body signs just the same as you would a horse. Because it can save a lot of bites.

The path is different for you and me, but the journey begins in the heart.
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post #45 of 55 Old 06-07-2014, 07:26 PM
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How is fear not an excuse to bite? It's the dogs only defense. This dog needs worked with. When you are scared in a situation does it ever cross your mind to protect yourself? What if there is impending danger? Would you not resort to your only defense?
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post #46 of 55 Old 06-07-2014, 08:42 PM
Green Broke
 
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Some people just do not get along well with other animals. My dad is the one person in my family that is most likely to get bitten, stomped on, or scratched.

My puppy gets excited easily and instead of trying to keep her calm my dad gets her more excited, resulting in the puppy nipping or scratching him.

He also pets my cats really rough. My cats avoid him if they can, but he has gotten bitten about 3 times now, and had to go on antibiotics (and once to the hospital) as the bites get infected. One time it was my bf's very sweet cat. I don't know what my dad did, as that cat has never offered to bite anyone, but he got nailed. Another time it was my timid female cat who is super sweet.

It is only him who gets bitten! It doesn't matter how much I explain how he should behave, or not to be so rough with the animals, he still does the same thing!

He also seems to think that if he is walking the cats or dogs should move out of his way immediately. It just doesn't work. Sometimes he trips over them or steps on their tail! Or they stand under his feet and get stepped on.

"relative of a relative that was there walked across the camp waving a large sunshade, backed her to the end of her lead into a corner so she was choking herself to get away and before anyone could stop him, she nipped him and ran."

This sticks out to me, why on earth would you approach a dog who is trying to get away from you? Especially when it is not your dog?

And this:
" The barn owners husband came up from behind her and tried to step over her."

These people are not the owner of this dog, and yet they behave as if they are, and expect the dog to just put up with it. If I'm visiting someone's house, I would be going around their dog, not getting into the dog's personal space.

My childhood dog bit my friend in her face... She stuck her face right up into his face and he felt threatened. He wasn't a mean dog, but we were kids and I don't think she knew better.

Yes you can put your face next to your own dog, or step over your own dog, but would you do that to a strange dog? I don't think children would understand that difference. It appears some adults don't either!
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post #47 of 55 Old 06-08-2014, 05:42 AM
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4horses, there is a difference between what the OP's dog has done and what you are saying your father and friend has had done to them by animals.

The barn owner stepping over the dog should NOT have startled a sane dog into a fear reaction. OP had been working on relations between him and the dog, and he surely made noise. I could understand maybe a growl, or the dog moving away. But biting?

The case at the camp was different - in that case, I don't think anyone really blames the dog. But it's the other cases that show how unstable this dog is.

OP has chosen the best path - one more chance, with all possible precautions in place. This dog should NOT be rehomed, unless there is somehow a perfect home out there where this dog will never feel fear. By this stage, OP knows as much as anyone possibly could about how this dog behaves. This dog is OP's responsibility, and they have tried and are still trying to give this dog a chance. It would be irresponsible for OP to palm this dog off onto someone else.
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post #48 of 55 Old 06-08-2014, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bitinsane View Post
How is fear not an excuse to bite? It's the dogs only defense. This dog needs worked with. When you are scared in a situation does it ever cross your mind to protect yourself? What if there is impending danger? Would you not resort to your only defense?
The dog had no reason to go into a fear response. And we put our dogs into potentially fearful situations all the time. Does that means our dogs should go around biting us or someone every time they're in a fearful situation? No. Even when a dog attacks someone who is attacking you, that is not a fear response.

Sully ~Sullivan's Fly Supply~ [17.1 TB] RIP 2/24/14
Rio ~Camperio~ [18.0 Oldenburg]
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post #49 of 55 Old 06-08-2014, 06:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SullysRider View Post
The dog had no reason to go into a fear response. And we put our dogs into potentially fearful situations all the time. Does that means our dogs should go around biting us or someone every time they're in a fearful situation? No. Even when a dog attacks someone who is attacking you, that is not a fear response.
That is why I stated that this dog needs worked with.
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post #50 of 55 Old 06-08-2014, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bitinsane View Post
That is why I stated that this dog needs worked with.
Well I was more so responding to the biting out of fear comments. I have a dog that is afraid of clippers, but he is a long haired dog and I live in TX, yesterday we had a heat index of 105. I cannot leave his hair long, even though he is an indoor dog, he obviously has to go outside. Should he bite me because he is afraid while I'm clipping him?

I rescued him when he was around 2 years old, he had lived feral his whole life before I picked him up. The first time I put a collar on him he refused to move for 2 hrs, the first time I put a leash on him he refused to walk, when he did he crawled everywhere as long as he had a leash on (which went on for a few weeks). He was scared to walk through doorways, he was scared of human touch. He never once offered to bite, and you can bet he was plenty fearful of pretty much everything. Fear is not an excuse for a dog biting.

Sully ~Sullivan's Fly Supply~ [17.1 TB] RIP 2/24/14
Rio ~Camperio~ [18.0 Oldenburg]
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