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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Switching my mare from Nutrena Senior to Purina Strategy, recommended for its low NSC. Anyone had experience with it?
 

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I like Strategy and have had good luck with it. There are actually two kinds........one is in a green bag and is made for feeding with alfalfa hay and one comes in a white bag and is made for feeding with grass (or mixed) hay.

I'm actually feeding Nutrena Safechoice Original currently just because I got it on sale and I only feed a tiny bit as a treat. But I've always had a little more faith in Purina products for some reason.

I couldn't tell you which is higher in NSC. That is something you will have to study up on. I think both companies should have their nutrition information posted on the internet.
 

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I've fed Purina products for many years....many different products not just Strategy actually.
I was very happy and satisifed no matter which product it was and I fed different only because the needs of the horse dictated "specialty" feeding.

So, I have a question of why if you are feeding a Senior feed you are leaving the Senior feeds and going back to "regular" feed?
Many people do not feed or go to Senior feed unless there is a need showing.. :|

Senior feed, no matter the manufacturer is made so it can be fed alone to a horse who may have issues with eating or digesting hay.
That is not to say it can't be fed to horses who eat hay, but it is made different in manufacturing...
Make sure you not leave a style of feed manufactured and replace it with something else the horse may not be able to digest quite as well, losing nutrients.
Senior feeds are made and processed differently than other feeds making nutrient absorption easier for "older citizens".
However, most senior feeds can safely be fed to any horse over 5 years of age...not just "seniors".

So, ...
Purina Senior Active is a formula of 9% starch, 7% sugar, with 14% protein, 10% fat and 18% fiber which are nice numbers.
Nutrena Safechoice Senior is a formula of 14% starch, 6% sugar, 14% protein, 8% fat and 16% fiber, not such nice numbers...

Now, we get to the Strategy line of feeds.
Yes, there are 2 recipes here just like near every "line" of feed has a slightly different recipe and counterpart made.
So....
Strategy GX is the original formula.
With a 14% protein, 6% fat and 12.5% of fiber levels it is also one of the highest dense calorie feeds on the market anyplace today.
I went to read the PDF file and it states 0% low sugar/starch which just doesn't seem possible to me but it is what the bag documents state. :shrug:
Number of calories per pound is dense or very rich a formula so many people get good results with less product fed which is a $ savings and also safer for a digestive tract not being overloaded.
Strategy Healthy Edge is the newer formula.
With 12.5% protein, 8% fat and 18% fiber levels with a starch of 12% and sugar 7% in this recipe.

So, I have found the Strategy Healthy Edge was a nice feed, but was "greasy" with a oily look to the inside of the bag that was unappetizing to me but my horse ate it OK.
Strategy GX formula was also a really nice feed that I fed and many of my friends feed to their competition horses with good results of "staying" quality in their performance during training and competition.
I was able to feed less Strategy by 1/3 and keep the same appearance to my horse and not have a "hot" horse from high sugar and starches affecting him.
Senior feed, I only fed the original formula, it was the only formula then available and I had great success with it taking a rescue from a score of 1.5 to a full 5 in a matter of months.
Again, Senior and the Strategy lines of feeds are safe to feed to horses that have matured...basically anything over 5 years of age once their growth spurts and nutritional needs of the growing body have settled down and not spiking in need.

So, I have fed many lines of feeds throughout my lifetime of horses...both when I owned as now, and when I worked/managed show & competition barns.
Good quality feeds have to still be fed in recommended amounts for the horse to have the daily amounts of vitamins and minerals administered, but some feeds just work better for some horse than others.
All food, hay & feed.. is fed in pounds not quarts as many commonly make a comment of...fed by weight.
I have had experience that some brands others rave about were junk and a waste to the horses I took care of in what that feed did for them and then feeds I fed did the junk quality to their horses.
Each horse is a individual and needs fed as such.

Anytime you switch feeds do it slowly and watch super careful for changes in personality, working traits and stay-ability and how they look.
Any change-over should be done slowly and with days of change taken not a sudden mass change to lessen the chance of digestive upset, aka colic.
Some horses also just don't like certain feeds and will not eat well, so do watch...
As with anything, tweaking of a diet needs to be done as you watch the horse in work and rest to meet that animals needs properly.
A little more, a little less and finally, just right. :smile:

Be vigilant and watch close the transformation take place from one feed to another and what it can do.
Good luck with your change...

:runninghorse2:.....
jmo...
 

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I don't feed any type of bagged feed, but just what each horse needs, beside the forage, plus free choice minerals and salt

Agree on making a change slowly, but most importantly, be able to interpretate that feed bag label, and apply it in relationship to the horse's total diet.
Unless that is the only feed the horse is getting, then it means nothing, far as total diet, without considering the forage the hrose is eating, which should be the main part of his diet
Do you know as to what you are trying to supplement?
Calories? Protein?Vit a and e, lost quickly in hay?
 

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I forgot about Strategy Healthy Edge!

So unless they discontinued them, there are three versions of Strategy:

Strategy AX (for feeding with straight alfalfa hay)
Strategy GX (for feeding with grass hay)
Strategy Healthy Edge

I've actually fed all three of those, but it's been some years ago.
 

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I forgot about Strategy Healthy Edge!

So unless they discontinued them, there are three versions of Strategy:

Strategy AX (for feeding with straight alfalfa hay)
Strategy GX (for feeding with grass hay)
Strategy Healthy Edge

I've actually fed all three of those, but it's been some years ago.
I have never seen nor heard of "Strategy AX" by me...
It exists, there is a "listing" for it but it is not a common feed sold...and I only saw it on some actual store websites, not from Purina website.
I'm wondering if it is a more "location destination feed source" as some areas of the country just don't get everything in the extensive line of foods offered.. :think:

I went looking and found it to be a protein level of 16%.
Fat and fiber amounts which most "regular" owners/riders and barns need were ridiculous low.
Few, truly few horses really require 16% protein...
Most average, and most of us are in the just average or below work situation, need no more than 14% and do well with 12% protein, truth.
Most of us have horses that do well not being fed a rich diet of alfalfa hay which is why special feed is needed with specific nutrient levels to offset the amounts ingested with alfalfa hays.

As with everything, investigative work needs to be done to choose feed that is easily purchased, abundant and complimentary to what other roughage are location fed and used by many so fresh shipments are common.
:runninghorse2:....
jmo...
 

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I would not consider a feed with just 6% fat, being a high calorie dense food
You would think not Smilie, but when you questioned that I went doing some research just like you did and found quite a few interesting charts and comparisons from many feed companies and different kinds of foods available... shared below.
I certainly am not going to argue with the PHD researchers and nutritionists.

So, here is more information to read, confuse you possibly and data to do fact informative choices and not fiction informed choices of food on the market for our hooved friends...
Some of these are outdated as when I looked some "newer" food styles were not listed, but the idea is there for you.
All these are the links to what I found...
http://www.ranch-way.com/images/uploads/content/Equine Feed Comparison Chart Edits.pdf
http://laminitishelp.org/CalorieFeed.pdf
https://equineink.com/2011/12/05/calories-density-and-ncs-understanding-different-feeds/


What I did find though is a list of the NSC in feeds all listed and spelt out...that was what you went searching for...
http://www.horseforum.com/horse-health/common-feeds-nsc-levels-14767/
A special thanks to our members who took the time to do the investigating, lists made and shared with us.

I'm sure there are more UTD stats available, but a quick search I found a lot of information.

So...
Get some beverage of choice, comfortable reading spot and take notes cause it is going to bombard you with data shortly... hope it helps you :smile:

:runninghorse2:....
jmo...

 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I have a hard keeper and it was recommended I go with a feed that was high fat. I don't like to feed straight grain, I'd rather feed something in pelleted form.

She gets 20 lbs of hay, so i was really just looking for a ration balancer. And everyone other places likes Strategy (white bag) so I figured i'd give it a shot.
 

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You have nothing to lose by trying the feed.
Hard keepers are sometimes not so hard but missing a vitamin or mineral in proper amount in the diet.
Sometimes they do just need more fat in their diet too.

If you add the feed you may also be able to reduce the hay as 20 pounds is a serious amount of hay fed a day..
If quality, good nutrient rich hay...
Sometimes horses do better on a slightly different kind of hay too...
Say,... so instead of straight timothy you feed a mix of T&A....

If you really don't want to do "feed" do consider other hay options.
And if you do a ration balancer, go with a good one.
It makes a difference as they are not all the same in quality of ingredients or percentages reached in a daily dose.
:runninghorse2:....
 

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I have a hard keeper and it was recommended I go with a feed that was high fat. I don't like to feed straight grain, I'd rather feed something in pelleted form.

She gets 20 lbs of hay, so i was really just looking for a ration balancer. And everyone other places likes Strategy (white bag) so I figured i'd give it a shot.
Purina makes a Ration Balancer called Enrich Plus (32% protein & 5% fat). It ends up being less expensive to feed than just about any other QUALITY feed because you only feed 1 or 2 pounds per day. I use it and Strategy GX (14% protein & 6% fat), when I was in CA & AZ we fed the AX version. If you just want to add fat without a whole lot of other things, you can buy Amplify in 50 lb bags (14% protein & 30% fat). There's also Ultium Competition formula (11.7 Protein & 12.4 fat). Decide what she needs, either the amino acids to help top line, overall weight (fat), muscle, all of the above, coat enhancement and then you can figure out what will best meet your needs.
 

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I have never seen nor heard of "Strategy AX" by me...
It exists, there is a "listing" for it but it is not a common feed sold...and I only saw it on some actual store websites, not from Purina website.
I'm wondering if it is a more "location destination feed source" as some areas of the country just don't get everything in the extensive line of foods offered.. :think:

I went looking and found it to be a protein level of 16%.
Fat and fiber amounts which most "regular" owners/riders and barns need were ridiculous low.
Few, truly few horses really require 16% protein...
Most average, and most of us are in the just average or below work situation, need no more than 14% and do well with 12% protein, truth.
Most of us have horses that do well not being fed a rich diet of alfalfa hay which is why special feed is needed with specific nutrient levels to offset the amounts ingested with alfalfa hays.

As with everything, investigative work needs to be done to choose feed that is easily purchased, abundant and complimentary to what other roughage are location fed and used by many so fresh shipments are common.
:runninghorse2:....
jmo...
It's probably just something sold in the Southwest USA because alfalfa hay is the "norm" here. You actually have to pay more for grass hay and most owners just feed alfalfa and are none the wiser. I've been feeding both grass and alfalfa hay (no pasture here either!) and sometimes people at the feed store ask me what I am feeding the grass hay too. Like they aren't sure why anyone would buy it when you can get alfalfa for less. So yes, I'm sure other parts of the country have no use for Strategy AX but out here, most people feed alfalfa.

I happened to go to my local Tractor Supply today and they still sell all 3 types of Strategy here. Healthy Edge was the most expensive at $18.50 a bag. Strategy AX was the next cheapest at (I think) 17.99 a bag. And Strategy GX was $16.99 a bag.

Which is why I usually end up with Nutrena Safechoice because they send me $2 coupons, they sometimes do buy 3 or 4 and get one free, and they have a program where you buy 10 bags and get one free.

Purina used to send me coupons and specials but they must have dumped me because I haven't had a Purina coupon in I don't remember when. I like their feed too. I have more faith in Purina because they always say their horse feed is not produced in the same plant as any other type of animal feed. So you won't get the risk of poisoning from cattle feed additives. I don't know if Nutrena does that but I think it is a good idea. So if all things were equal, I would always buy Purina.
 

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PS. The only reason I mentioned the Strategy AX is because I thought I remembered from another post that the OP is in California. But I might be getting her confused with someone else since it doesn't say under her user name. It was just sort of a "heads up" that you need to pay attention to which one you buy or you could accidentally pick the wrong formula.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Hi @horselovinguy, the new barn feeds the best quality hay money can buy. She gets fed 3 times a day, so she has hay in front of her from 7am to about 7pm. 12 hours. By 9pm all the horses are laying down for the night. I wouldn't call it free choice because when her dinner ration is over, our barn manager doesn't come and refill her portions. but for 12 hours she has an unlimited supply of hay.

Right now she recieves 2 lbs rice bran and 4 lbs of the nutrena senior. That's split into 2 meals: 1lb rice bran and 2 lbs senior fed at 12pm and 5pm. She's in amazing weight right now. Doesn't need to gain a pound, just needs to maintain. She works an hour each day, so a 7 hour work week for her. She goes on one trail ride a week of 2 hours. That's really helped the muscle growth. The senior feed would also be considered a forage which is why i switched back to it, as until I asked for a higher hay amount for this horse she was eating 15 lbs of hay.

Morning portions are 10 lbs alfalfa from 7-8 (if she doesn't finish all of it, there's leftovers for dinner), 5 lbs of alfalfa/timothy hay in turnout in a small-hole feed bag, and 5 lbs bright green timothy hay at dinner. With the senior feed, she receives a total of 24 lbs of forage a day.

She is 16.1 and 1118 lbs.

I'm looking for vitamins and minerals to add to her 20 lbs of hay. I am not feeding enough senior for it to be of any benefit to her nutritionally. The bag recommends at least 7 lbs a day for a horse in her weight and work schedule. I simply don't feel comfortable feeding her that much, and my feed bills go up so I was hoping for a compromise with Purina Strategy.

Does this feed make sense for her nutritional needs? She also receives MSM, tri-amino, and aloe vera pellets for her ulcer prevention along with her daily low-dose of ranitidine.
 

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Right now she recieves 2 lbs rice bran and 4 lbs of the nutrena senior. That's split into 2 meals: 1lb rice bran and 2 lbs senior fed at 12pm and 5pm. She's in amazing weight right now. Doesn't need to gain a pound, just needs to maintain.

I'm looking for vitamins and minerals to add to her 20 lbs of hay. I am not feeding enough senior for it to be of any benefit to her nutritionally. The bag recommends at least 7 lbs a day for a horse in her weight and work schedule. I simply don't feel comfortable feeding her that much, and my feed bills go up so I was hoping for a compromise with Purina Strategy.
I'm sorry...I don't see the issue of feeding a daily total of 7 pounds of senior feed broken into 2 meals...
Right now she is fed 6 pounds daily total = 3 pounds of food 2x a day...
You are referring to a increase of 1/2 pound of food in each feeding meal.
That is not a issue to me.

If you fed senior you wouldn't need the rice bran probably either.

Fed at the rate of her size to work ratio and hay "reduced' she would be fed about the same poundage as she receives right now.
As she only needs to maintain, not need to gain she would probably need less hay fed and or less feed fed or both to maintain and not gain like a blimp.

Where the number differences are that I see is in starch and sugar percentages she would be eating...
That would have me changing feeds...
:runninghorse2:....
jmo...
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
@horselovinguy, I'm definitely also concerned about the NSC of Nutrena Senior. I have heard so much about Strategy and I was just over at TSC and I saw a bag and thought "well let's try it." It says you can feed less strategy per pound of hay than Nutrena Senior, which is another reason I switched. The lady recommended I keep the rice bran with the strategy if my horse was a hard keeper.

Should I keep Nutrena? Should I switch to Strategy? Maybe I'm still not understanding. I'm happy to nix the rice bran - makes things more financially friendly, but only if I know without it her diet will be balanced and she will receive good fat intake.

Please help, haha! Maybe explain a bit more?

Don't really have too much of a choice in the hay amount. She seems to be doing really well and tapers her consumption, eating bits at a time. I like this new barn's set up. Grain is for a treat and to supplement vitamins/minerals. At our old barn she only got 10 lbs and was always hungry/couldn't keep weight on.
 

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At your old barn your horse was not being fed enough hay at 10 pounds a day and being actively ridden.
A minimum of 1.5 % pounds needs fed based on her weight what she must have to survive...to thrive she needs more like 2% = the 20 pounds. This is based on the 1000 pound horse and yours weighs more..
Now that she is fed more and sounds like a better quality of hay too...adds up to her looking now as she does. :D

Me, I would ditch the Nutrena feed and get into something with better NSC numbers...or at least try it and see how she does with a different diet.
Every horse is as individual as we humans are in how our body responds to food...till you give it a go, no knowing what the outcome shall be.
I would also do away with the rice bran for now...
You won't know if she is doing well on being fed the Strategy if you are adding this or that.
Take pictures and measurements and keep a documented "diary" of her for the next 60 days as she completes a total changeover, works and exercises during the winter months.
By documenting with measurements and pictures you will see changes of good or bad or maintain of what you have...baseline information.
Once you though have her on just whatever it is you decide to go with if she needs "more" then add rice bran.
Document, document, document all...
Realize though that feeding the correct amount of say Strategy is how the nutritional daily numbers are achieved...adding in this or that can also throw off those ratio numbers and create a unbalance of nutrients. :|

So yes, I would switch her.
Record changes...
Make note of any changes in temperament, work ethic, attitude...anything and everything.
Good luck.
:runninghorse2:...
jmo...
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
At your old barn your horse was not being fed enough hay at 10 pounds a day and being actively ridden.
A minimum of 1.5 % pounds needs fed based on her weight what she must have to survive...to thrive she needs more like 2% = the 20 pounds. This is based on the 1000 pound horse and yours weighs more..
Now that she is fed more and sounds like a better quality of hay too...adds up to her looking now as she does. :D

Me, I would ditch the Nutrena feed and get into something with better NSC numbers...or at least try it and see how she does with a different diet.
Every horse is as individual as we humans are in how our body responds to food...till you give it a go, no knowing what the outcome shall be.
I would also do away with the rice bran for now...
You won't know if she is doing well on being fed the Strategy if you are adding this or that.
Take pictures and measurements and keep a documented "diary" of her for the next 60 days as she completes a total changeover, works and exercises during the winter months.
By documenting with measurements and pictures you will see changes of good or bad or maintain of what you have...baseline information.
Once you though have her on just whatever it is you decide to go with if she needs "more" then add rice bran.
Document, document, document all...
Realize though that feeding the correct amount of say Strategy is how the nutritional daily numbers are achieved...adding in this or that can also throw off those ratio numbers and create a unbalance of nutrients. :|

So yes, I would switch her.
Record changes...
Make note of any changes in temperament, work ethic, attitude...anything and everything.
Good luck.
:runninghorse2:...
jmo...
Thank you sir! I've already started the transition, so hopefully she likes it! Do you have a recommended amount for 20 lbs of grass hay?

I will journal with gusto!
 

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Nope....
Right now you are changing feed...
Leave the hay alone...
When you do changes only change one thing at a time..
Add one thing at a time, subtract one thing at a time...
If you do several things though at once you will not know what it is if there is a problem, undesirable reaction or problem arises...
You treat a horse with new foods same as a baby being introduced new food...one at a time.
Change one thing at a time...simple and easy...
One thing at a time.

Me, I would not change her hay though probably at all.
If she is cleaning it all up, not wasting it she has what her body needs.
The type of hay she is fed is also agreeing with her it sounds like...she gained much needed weight and she enjoys her food is more than half the battle.:smile:
:runninghorse2:....
 
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