[loosie]

Well ok you guys o/s have true big cats, so this is 'small fry' for some, but this is a domestic pussy cat after a number of generations gone feral. Australian natives have little defense, not evolved for big predators like this so these ferals have the run of the place, getting bigger & meaner with each generation.

If youre wondering about our depleted wildlife, its estimated there are around 10million feral cats in the wild here & the stomach contents of this one had 2 sugar gliders & a velvet gecko - times that by 10mil & consider thats the DAILY toll from cats... then we have Cane Toads up north too...

 

[aubie]

I was wondering what this post was about.

 

[seabiscuit91]

Sheesh that is huge!

 

[anndankev]

How were cats introduced to Australia?

On second thought, scratch the above comment. Doesn't matter anyway.

How about this idea? Make a government committee called the BCM (Bureau of Cat Management).

Round up and capture 45,000 to 50,000 of the feral cats and keep them in holding pens for the rest of their lives.

That should about solve your problem, right?

 

[k9kenai]

While the damage from the feral cat populations in Australia is real (I read an article stating that they have a plan in place to euthanize two million cats by the year 2020), that photo is from 2013 and the validity of it is questionable. Most feral cats would NEVER be able to reach that size, even on a good diet. I've been working with feral cats for over a decade now and I have never, ever seen one even close to that size, not even the largest males. If it is a valid photo, that is most definitely not the norm. Also, in all the stories I found with the photo that caption was not included so I do not know if any of that is valid or not.

Even with euthanizing all of the cats, without a spay/neuter program in place the problem will only return. TNR works along with dedicated caretaker assistance to help feed colonies and manage vet care to cut back on wildlife killings but it is expensive to put into place initially and you need a lot of support (but it is still much better than just killing all of the cats because that's a temporary solution, not a permanent one). Mandatory spay/neuter of pet cats will also cut down on people's cats getting out and breeding which contributes to feral and stray cat populations.

 

[Kaifyre]

I absolutely loathe feral cats. They are an invasive pest and do a lot of damage to native bird populations, among other species. They also kill more than they eat, so even though the stomach contents of this cat showed 2 mammals, a bird and a reptile, who knows how many other creatures it killed that day. Where I live there is a massive feral cat population. they climb on people's vehicles and scratch the paint, poop in gardens, attack domestic cats and dogs (I watched a feral tom attack some poor woman's toy poodle without provocation, while she was walking him on a leash, the other day right in front of my house. By the time I made it out my front door she'd managed to beat the cat off her dog but the poodle had several deep cuts on his face requiring a vet visit) and generally make a giant nuisance of themselves.

Tell you what, if I'm ever sitting in my backyard with my parrot on her leash and a cat attacks her or me ... that cat will be hanging from our crabapple tree as a warning to all the other ferals out there. Only way to take care of the problem is to eliminate it.

-- Kai

 

[Light]

Feral cats have been caused by humans. It doesn't surprise me to hear the human response of "KILL THEM". Idiots!! You created this overpopulation of cats by not spaying and neutering to start with. Then once these cats are abandoned, starving, trying to survive without human assistance, you want to kill them.

I think every human should live one day as a feral cat before they start spewing their venom about them. They live the hardest life of all creatures because they are not understood. They don't communicate like people or leash monkey dogs. They are not easy to figure out. I have dedicated much of my life figuring them out. I had to stop because after a while the human ignorance is just to much to take any more.

Cat in the picture is not a feral cat. I call total BULL on this. Feral cats cannot get that big. A species is not going to evolve bigger and tougher than it was especially when it is not indigenous to that area.

The cats that are forced to survive in such a hostile world with the closed minded ......anyway, they did not chose to live there. One of your people, many of your people dragged them over there and then abandoned them. Why don't you hang them from a flipping tree.

Once again I am disgusted by people and their need to destroy all they do not understand.

You know the flipping birds can fly away.

 

[Kaifyre]

Agreed, feral cats are the responsibility of every cat owner who allows their cats to roam outside unfixed. I've never owned a cat (nor would I ever own a cat or dog that wasn't fixed) so I can safely say I have not contributed to this problem. I've never understood why people do this ... in most places it is considered poor ownership to let your dog, for instance, run loose. Same with horses. Same with just about every other pet I can think of. Why, then, is it acceptable to allow one's cat to roam? The excuse of "they're outdoor animals" doesn't hold water since, as many people have proven, cats can be trained to walk on a leash, thus allowing them to enjoy the outdoors without risk of being eaten, run over, lost, or any number of other things. Personally I feel that if someone truly cares about their animal they would take steps to ensure its safety, up to and including keeping it off the streets.

I do understand their plight, such as it is. However I disagree that they are starving ... at least every one in my area isn't. They are in good body condition most of the time, unless they have been set upon by another feral pest. I will however, NOT tolerate attacks on me, or on my animals. I don't care about the ferals three blocks over, or the one across town, or that one over there ... I care about the one(s) that make my life, or my pet's life, miserable. The problem children are taken care of. I will not sit idly by and coo over the poor helpless kitty that tears my leg up because he's just hungry, or the one that attacked that poodle. A cat that attacks people and animals needs to be put down just like a dog that attacks people and animals - or a raccoon, or a bear, or anything else.

-- Kai

 

[loosie]

Most feral cats would NEVER be able to reach that size, even on a good diet. I've been working with feral cats for over a decade now and I have never, ever seen one even close to that size, not even the largest males. If it is a valid photo, that is most definitely not the norm.

Very intersting info K9, thanks. BUT along with the many reports, I have seen with my own eyes one cat that was dingo size (med size dog for non aussies) & my husband has seen a couple of monsters in the outback(Kimberley & Pilbara). Thats not looking for them, he saw driving, i saw horse riding. So while i agree theyre generally not that big & maybe depends where they live & how many generations, they cant be that out of the ordinary. Perhaps in your region they not that big - ive never seen anything of the sort down here, only up nth.

Even with euthanizing all of the cats, without a spay/neuter program in place the problem will only return. TNR works along with dedicated caretaker assistance to help feed colonies and manage vet care to cut back on wildlife killings but it is expensive to put into place initially and you need a lot of support (but it is still much better than just killing all of the cats because that's a temporary solution, not a permanent one).

Hear hear about mandatory spay/neuter - while registration of dogs & cats is cheaper if theyre fixed, thats no real deterrant let alone answer & IMO it should be illegal to keep an intact beast without a permit/license to breed. I agree too that without that measure of course its not permanent to cull. Im very interested & surprised to hear about feeding programs & that they are effective at reducing wildlife decimation - i would have thought that would just encourage more to breed/thrive. Where abouts is this program running?

 

[loosie]

Feral cats have been caused by humans. It doesn't surprise me to hear the human response of "KILL THEM". Idiots!! You created this overpopulation of cats by not spaying and neutering to start with.

Boy, thanks for that lightning. THAT is a rather... narrow view IMO actually. Yes, humans created the problem - as we have oh so many - but why is that a reason to call people idiots for wanting to then address the problem??!

Then once these cats are abandoned, starving, trying to survive without human assistance, you want to kill them.

They are NOT starving, 'trying' to survive but THRIVING. Dogs dont do half so well without humans but cats do.

I think every human should live one day as a feral cat before they start spewing their venom about them. They live the hardest life of all creatures

You are seriously mistaken in your opinion, as per above - quite probably a domestic pussy newly dumped will do it hard for a while but you are just wrong that those born feral have a hard life. In this country, in most of its environs at least - i dont kno about those that live in the true deserts, only that theyre also numerous so cant be that hard.

Fwiw, i personally love cats, along with all animals(more than people as a general rule) & dont blame them in the least for doing what comes so naturally to them - hunting & killing. Accusing me of misunderstanding is also unreasonable. But thats no reason to leave them doing so, not try to manage their wiping out wildlife.

I call total BULL on this. Feral cats cannot get that big. A species is not going to evolve bigger and tougher than it was especially when it is not indigenous to that area.

Well youre just incorrect on that. I dont kno what evidence you think you have for the second assertion but as said to K9, i & my hubby have both seen a few ourselves so i dont doubt others stories of their size either. Perhaps as said to K9, its a regional thing or such, but im no expert on them as you seem to be.

You know the flipping birds can fly away.

Is that a serious comment or are you just being sarcastic or something?

 

[Captain Evil]

That is a big, big cat. How tall is the guy holding it, I wonder? And a big, big problem, with no easy answers. We, of course, have feral cats on our island and there are some feed-catch-spay-release programs around, but here, domesticated cats let out for the day kill a crazy amount of wildlife as well: birds, voles, frogs and the like. But nothing like the problem Australia has...:-(

 

[loosie]

I grew up with pet cats, love them & would love to have some, but i disagree with caging animals generally, esp those like cats, dont feel its fair, and i wouldnt let them roam so i was then responsible for the animals they kill. Therefore i wouldnt keep them in this environment at least.

I am not advocating just kiĺing them *necessarily* - tho in one of the early replies, comparing them to blm mustangs, i do think thats more humane than catching & keeping them in crowded cages for life. Agree with Evil that like so many problems we have created, there is not likely an easy or 'one size fits' answer.

 

[loosie]

Hey, guys from Maine, how do u reckon the size compared with a **** cat?

 

[RegalCharm]

Australia also had and still does have a feral rabbit problem.

https://www.thoughtco.com/feral-rabbits-in-australia-1434350

So talk to the wild cats and tell them to eat more rabbits.

 

[jaydee]

According to a 2017 article Australia may have the largest Maine **** cat - 47.2 inches. They're measured from front paw to back paw when stretched out. The second largest and current record holder is in the UK, 46.6 inches.
Its quite possible that these larger cat breeds have contributed to the increase in size of the feral cats if they've gotten into the feral population
We took in a beautiful male rescue cat in the UK that had been living wild for quite a long time. He was almost certainly a pure bred Persian though his coat was filthy and matted into clumps when he was caught. Being a pedigree doesn't seem to guarantee that they won't get abandoned.
Sure Europeans have taken their livestock and pets with them when they colonized other parts of the world - they did the same in the US.
We had a feral cat problem in the UK and there's a feral cat problem in the US
Sure some humans are irresponsible and don't neuter or control breeding - can't label all humans the same way though.
It's much fairer to say that some humans have created this problem and now some humans are left with the task of trying to fix it.
Yes birds can fly away but a hungry cat will eat the eggs and young of ground nesting birds and even those that nest in easily accessible trees its a lot easier.

 

[JoBlueQuarter]

That's a big cat! If they're really getting bigger every generation, then before long other animals such as horses will be in danger as well. I would say address the problem before they get that big! I agree that people should neuter/spay their cats, and this is partly the fault of unresponsible owners that don't, but if there are that many feral cats already, they have to be caught and a fair amount of them euthanized, for our own and our animals safety.
That being said, I'm not an Aussie; I haven't even been their, for that matter (although I'd really love to!), so maybe there is another solution to this problem.

 

[k9kenai]

Very intersting info K9, thanks. BUT along with the many reports, I have seen with my own eyes one cat that was dingo size (med size dog for non aussies) & my husband has seen a couple of monsters in the outback(Kimberley & Pilbara). Thats not looking for them, he saw driving, i saw horse riding. So while i agree theyre generally not that big & maybe depends where they live & how many generations, they cant be that out of the ordinary. Perhaps in your region they not that big - ive never seen anything of the sort down here, only up nth.



Hear hear about mandatory spay/neuter - while registration of dogs & cats is cheaper if theyre fixed, thats no real deterrant let alone answer & IMO it should be illegal to keep an intact beast without a permit/license to breed. I agree too that without that measure of course its not permanent to cull. Im very interested & surprised to hear about feeding programs & that they are effective at reducing wildlife decimation - i would have thought that would just encourage more to breed/thrive. Where abouts is this program running?

There very well could be larger cats, but like I said those are NOT the norm. Larger feral cats tend not to have a better survive-ability rate. If, indeed, that image and the cats you are seeing are real, I am about 99% sure they are somebody's pets and are NOT feral cats (at the very most they are abandoned pets). Feral cats would die before they reached that size as they are not as inconspicuous in larger sizes and thus are more likely to be picked off by predators, hit by cars, killed by people, etc. Also, larger size means they must consume more food and water.

In a lot of cities and counties (and the number is rising all the time) in the United States (and many other countries around the world) there are mandatory spay/neuter laws where you must pay yearly to have a special permit and license in order to keep your dog or cat intact, and you must pay an additional litter permit (per litter) if you breed your female, even if it is an unplanned litter. It is also illegal in many places for dogs and cats to be off of your property unless on leash or confined in a carrier, and it is mandatory for them to be microchipped in case they are found loose off of your property.

When I was an ACO up in ABQ, we did spay/neuter "blitzes" (large reduced rate spay/neuter, vaccination, and microchip mobile clinics) in low income areas and then did yearly statistical analysis and we saw a dramatic drop in cruelty calls, abandoned animals, stray calls, etc. in the areas where we did the blitzes. We also had a successful TNR program going for the feral cats all over the city and had logs of all feral cat colonies in the entire city. We kept a list of all volunteers who monitored the cats, fed them, and trapped them to bring them in for spay/neuter, and officers and volunteers from the TNR community and other cat rescues and groups in the area did educational seminars and workshops for the public about the benefits of TNR. The TNR program cut down on the feral cat population dramatically and helped the people/cats coexist more peacefully. Due to strict laws upholding that pet cats are not allowed off of your property, feral cats (whose ears were tipped after being fixed) kept to their colony areas which were in generally urban areas where little wildlife was found, thus this helped prevent songbird killings. During my time as an ACO, we received little, if any, complaints from the public about the feral cat colonies and their presence in the community. If anything, the city received immense support from the community (including from the birding community) for the TNR programs.

As others have said, the problem stems from people. People have created this problem, and now are scrambling to fix it and again they are only looking at a temporary solution rather than a permanent solution. Education goes a long way to help with a permanent fix, and initiating a mandatory spay/neuter, intact permits/licensing laws, restrictions on off leash/property for cats and dogs, and setting up a TNR program is the beginning to help curb the problem in a more permanent and humane way.

If you would like more information about TNR and feral cat populations, one of the best sources is Alley Cat Allies.

 

[jaydee]

I have a friend who lives in Spain.
Feral/abandoned cats are a problem there too and there are simply not enough people wanting to rehome them as they can be difficult if not impossible to domesticate if they've been born into a feral community
She and several others that are involved in animal charity and rescue were trapping cats, having them neutered and vaccinated then returning them to their feral group where they would take food to them on a daily basis so less inclined to ne a nuisance to the public but most of these groups of cats were eventually poisoned by someone to remove them entirely.

 

[Foxhunter]

There very well could be larger cats, but like I said those are NOT the norm. Larger feral cats tend not to have a better survive-ability rate. If, indeed, that image and the cats you are seeing are real, I am about 99% sure they are somebody's pets and are NOT feral cats (at the very most they are abandoned pets). Feral cats would die before they reached that size as they are not as inconspicuous in larger sizes and thus are more likely to be picked off by predators, hit by cars, killed by people, etc. Also, larger size means they must consume more food and water.

Oh boy, you do not understand the remote area of Australia! You can drive formdays without seeing a sign of habitation.

I do agree that man has caused more problem with introduction of animals in areas they were not designed to be.

Australia, having a very diverse eco system has had to take radical measures to stop these feral animals from spreading.

Cats have an excellent survival instinct and do thrive in the wild. I am not talking about city living, though they do well there too.

When I first saw the picture I thought it was a lynx or some other wild cat but when I looked closer could see it was a 'house' cat.

Interesting short documentary on Australia's feral problem from way back.

Ferrets gotmloose in NZ and are killing off a ground nesting parrot they are doing their best to eradicate ferrets over there.
I believe in the US many 'pet' constrictors have gone awol from owners and are wrecking havoc in the Everglades, these too are being hunted and killed.

 

[Foxhunter]

Oh, not so long ago my mother would have bird feeders and a great diversity of birds would visit. Now, in the four years I have been home I have seen only one wren visit the garden, I have had no need to net my cane fruits because there are no birds around. The reason for this is because nearly everyone owns a cat.

In five houses there are seven cats (all fixed) and many others come up this way from other streets. My garden was a pooping place for them. I have no cat problem now because all of my dogs will chase them off.