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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all, I recently rode a lesson horse which had a 2 inch gash on it's chin. I suspected that it was from the curb chain. Has anyone ever seen this? A horse actually getting CUT by the chain??? I know the trainer and her students do not have very gentle hands.
 

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Hello!
I have started using a double bridle and so I don’t know how the curb chain could have caused a gash on the horse’s chin? I do know that you can get chain guards which is what I have on my chain to stop this from happening. Maybe try recommending getting a chain guard to your trainer?
I dont know if I am 100% right but I’m sure other people on here can help a lot more😊
 

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Yes it can and does happen...but not on the chin but back of the lower jaw.
A rusted chain, a twisted chain or poorly adjusted chain can inflict nasty injury.
You would normally see a irritation of skin, redness and removal of hair first before actually piercing the skin.
I would be inspecting the equipment carefully to find the culprit and in the time of healing now needed either a different bit with no curb-chain used or a very loose chain.
Thorough healing of very delicate skin needs done so as not to reopen the area.
🐴...
 

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I just picked a scab off of the jaw of a 3 year old that's never had a bit in her mouth. I think she skinned it trying to get her head over a high fence. That lesson horse could have don't something similar.

Personally, I always use leather curb straps.
 

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Mine rubs that spot raw in the spring. This year she caught it on the spot a branch broke off and did a number on it. Doesn't have to be equipment related.

Why is there always an instantaneous jump to the conclusion that every trainer and rider other than self is an abuser, overly harsh or is using equipment that is?
 

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I hope you weren't riding it with a chain while it still had a gash under the jaw.
Sometimes people do not put on the curb chain correctly, and this causes more trouble than one put on right.

It must not be too tight, and if should be twisted so that the links lay unified and as flat as possible (if it is the type that have a flattened link, as most English type curbchains do.) see how the chain looks sort of 'flat'?
1110918
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Hello!
I have started using a double bridle and so I don’t know how the curb chain could have caused a gash on the horse’s chin? I do know that you can get chain guards which is what I have on my chain to stop this from happening. Maybe try recommending getting a chain guard to your trainer?
I dont know if I am 100% right but I’m sure other people on here can help a lot more😊
Thank you! I'll look into this.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Why is there always an instantaneous jump to the conclusion that every trainer and rider other than self is an abuser, overly harsh or is using equipment that is?
[/QUOTE]
This is just what I have observed with my new (and better) trainer at a show and during lessons. The equipment itself isn't that harsh, unless used in the wrong hands. That trainer kicks her horses in the face if they put their heads down and smacks them for sniffing other horses. All her students yank on their horses' faces. I try to learn from others' mistakes and do as much research as possible so that I won't be taught "wrong" ways of treating a horse.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Yes it can and does happen...but not on the chin but back of the lower jaw.
A rusted chain, a twisted chain or poorly adjusted chain can inflict nasty injury.
You would normally see a irritation of skin, redness and removal of hair first before actually piercing the skin.
I would be inspecting the equipment carefully to find the culprit and in the time of healing now needed either a different bit with no curb-chain used or a very loose chain.
Thorough healing of very delicate skin needs done so as not to reopen the area.
🐴...
Than you! Yes, I meant lower jaw (like behind the chin where the curb chain is.) I will inspect the chain every time from now on. The trainer tacked the horse up, so I didn't really think much of it before getting on.
 

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This is just what I have observed with my new (and better) trainer at a show and during lessons. The equipment itself isn't that harsh, unless used in the wrong hands. That trainer kicks her horses in the face if they put their heads down and smacks them for sniffing other horses. All her students yank on their horses' faces. I try to learn from others' mistakes and do as much research as possible so that I won't be taught "wrong" ways of treating a horse.
I hope I misread that...
That is not "training" but abusing and if this is what your trainer is teaching you then you need to find a different trainer who teaches with non-abusive technique cause you learn what you see and what you are seeing is wrong if this is the teachings.

You do learn from others mistakes, but you learn faster and better by being taught and seeing proper ways of interacting with the animals first and foremost.
If what I highlighted is indeed what you witness and are taught...if me, a new barn and trainer would be quickly found!
🐴...
 

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Either of those could be misinterpreted though and depending on the situation both could have been an earned reprimand. Depends on situation and interpretation.

A boot to the chin for one that yanks and drops to graze is quick, efficient and gets the point across instantly. A smack for a sniffer that escalates or causes disruption on the end of lead needs a reminder of what they need focused on. Sounds like lessons in leading and groundmanners all the way around. Trainer could have been correcting habits develoed by overly permissive students too. I certainly don't want my horse sniffing noses with an unknown at a show and catching whatever could be carried in.
 

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I'm agreeing with @QtrBel and not jumping on the abuse bandwagon yet. I often put my boot in the way of the horse and the ground if it keeps wanting to graze or put its head down, and they whack their own heads on it and then act awfully surprised.

Im thinking to actually draw blood with a curb chain, it would have had to have tacks or something, and usually those are leather straps. If someone is being so aggressive with a bit that the curb chain not only takes some hair off, but causes a wound, there would have to be some kind of damage to the mouth as well. Did the horse have sores on the sides of his mouth? When you rode, did he feel like the was overly protective of his mouth?

Another thing about the wound being from the curb chain, is that to be so abrasive that it breaks the skin, I think it would need an aggressive side to side motion rubbing back and forth, not just coming tight. I suppose you could achieve a small amount of that with a broken mouth shanked bit but not a significant amount.
 

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There is a big difference to putting your boot in the way of a muzzle or nudging a face from the ground, or redirecting a muzzle away from another horse...that is handlers error if on a lead.

But when it was phrased,...
"This is just what I have observed with my new (and better) trainer at a show and during lessons. The equipment itself isn't that harsh, unless used in the wrong hands. That trainer kicks her horses in the face if they put their heads down and smacks them for sniffing other horses. All her students yank on their horses' faces. "
It sure sounds abusive to me...:cautious:

When I go to show grounds my horse is not permitted to graze... :oops:
He eats from his haybag brought from home.
He is not permitted to go nose-to nose with another horse, period.
Eliminates any passing of germs or icks transferred...
But do I need to kick him in the face nor smack him...no, just be observant and offer different choices more thinking of keeping safe and healthy since you just don't know what you don't know.
Same is true of trailheads... no grazing, no sharing water troughs...yes, I bring my own bucket and hose always with me.
🐴
 

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Question is though - is this a biased account or someone so aggressively abusing? Too many here on the you have to gentle or live them through behaviors not to discount other ways of seeing things... playing devil's advocate.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I hope I misread that...
That is not "training" but abusing and if this is what your trainer is teaching you then you need to find a different trainer who teaches with non-abusive technique cause you learn what you see and what you are seeing is wrong if this is the teachings.

You do learn from others mistakes, but you learn faster and better by being taught and seeing proper ways of interacting with the animals first and foremost.
If what I highlighted is indeed what you witness and are taught...if me, a new barn and trainer would be quickly found!
🐴...
Thank you! That's why I switched to my new trainer. Plus the other lady was REALLY expensive. For me, when someone tells me to do something like kicking them in the face, I get this feeling that it's not okay because I know there are other alternatives.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
There is a big difference to putting your boot in the way of a muzzle or nudging a face from the ground, or redirecting a muzzle away from another horse...that is handlers error if on a lead.

But when it was phrased,...
"This is just what I have observed with my new (and better) trainer at a show and during lessons. The equipment itself isn't that harsh, unless used in the wrong hands. That trainer kicks her horses in the face if they put their heads down and smacks them for sniffing other horses. All her students yank on their horses' faces. "
It sure sounds abusive to me...:cautious:

When I go to show grounds my horse is not permitted to graze... :oops:
He eats from his haybag brought from home.
He is not permitted to go nose-to nose with another horse, period.
Eliminates any passing of germs or icks transferred...
But do I need to kick him in the face nor smack him...no, just be observant and offer different choices more thinking of keeping safe and healthy since you just don't know what you don't know.
Same is true of trailheads... no grazing, no sharing water troughs...yes, I bring my own bucket and hose always with me.
🐴
Yes, I agree with you. Especially with that new equine virus going around, we should be extra cautious, even though I haven't heard of anything in my area yet. Thank you for your useful advice!
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I'm agreeing with @QtrBel and not jumping on the abuse bandwagon yet. I often put my boot in the way of the horse and the ground if it keeps wanting to graze or put its head down, and they whack their own heads on it and then act awfully surprised.

Im thinking to actually draw blood with a curb chain, it would have had to have tacks or something, and usually those are leather straps. If someone is being so aggressive with a bit that the curb chain not only takes some hair off, but causes a wound, there would have to be some kind of damage to the mouth as well. Did the horse have sores on the sides of his mouth? When you rode, did he feel like the was overly protective of his mouth?

Another thing about the wound being from the curb chain, is that to be so abrasive that it breaks the skin, I think it would need an aggressive side to side motion rubbing back and forth, not just coming tight. I suppose you could achieve a small amount of that with a broken mouth shanked bit but not a significant amount.
The horse did have an ouchy mouth. Any contact on the bit and he would open his mouth wide or throw his head up. Also, that trainer has her students "see- saw" the bit to get their horses to slow down of they are trotting/ cantering too fast.
 

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This gash on the horse's chin, was it from side to side right where the chain sits or did it run up and down? If up and down not likely from rough handling with the reins.
I think if the chain is properly done up it would take a lot to make that kind of injury
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
This gash on the horse's chin, was it from side to side right where the chain sits or did it run up and down? If up and down not likely from rough handling with the reins.
I think if the chain is properly done up it would take a lot to make that kind of injury
The gash was side to side, like where the chain sits.
 
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