[Lonannuniel]

I've been doing more "advanced" movements recently, shoulder in, shoulder out, leg yeilds, ect. in the trot. I've found that when i put my leg behind the girth to control ( for lack of a better word ) the hind end, my horse thinks i am giving him the canter aid & speeds up or attempts to canter. I'm not really sure how to go about fixing this problem, more training of coarse, but does anybody have ideas as to what to do?

 

[Spyder]

I've been doing more "advanced" movements recently, shoulder in, shoulder out, leg yields, etc. in the trot. I've found that when i put my leg behind the girth to control ( for lack of a better word ) the hind end, my horse thinks i am giving him the canter aid & speeds up or attempts to canter.

Probably the reason why I NEVER teach the canter aid by putting the outside leg back.

I have corrected many students that get frustrated when they want to do a simple half pass and end up with the canter.

Re teach the canter aid by the use of the inside leg/hip closing on him. Outside leg is there to PREVENT the haunches from swinging out. If they don't swing out then the outside leg becomes passive.

 

[kat44bg]

I agree with above, I also only teach inside leg. It will be a little confusing in the beginning but in the end it will all make so much sense and "flow" you will wonder how you ever did it any other way Good Luck.

 

[DubyaS6]

Spyder-can you elaborate on this just a little?

I am also another rider who has always known the canter cue to be the outside leg behind the girth.

I have a new horse and she is very green. We havent done any canter work yet, but I would like to teach her this when we do start...

 

[Spyder]

Spyder-can you elaborate on this just a little?

I am also another rider who has always known the canter cue to be the outside leg behind the girth.

I have a new horse and she is very green. We havent done any canter work yet, but I would like to teach her this when we do start...

You simply teach the horse off the pressure you apply through the closing of your inside hip. If the horse is a little green the aid can extend farther down the leg to the riders heel or spur. If the horse swings the outside rear out then yes the outside leg will become active to STRAIGHTEN the horse and monitor any further potential crookedness.

If you get to the point of flying changes ESPECIALLY temi changes ( multiple lead changes) the alternating leg cues can be done very easily without causing the horse to swing their haunch...so early teaching from the inside saves on a retraining period.

 

[DubyaS6]

So (forgive me) you cue the horse to canter on the left lead by closing your inside hip (left side hip) and applying pressure (if the horse is green and doesnt understand the hip closing) with the left heel at the girth?

I may be getting ahead of myself, but I dont think my horse is going to get this the first few times...any suggestions of how to introduce this to her?

She is very light on her sides and will literally sidepass with minimal leg pressure. I can see this causing her confusion thinking I want her to move to the rail instead of canter.

Thanks for all your help on this =)

 

[mumiinek]

Spyder-can you elaborate on this just a little?

I am also another rider who has always known the canter cue to be the outside leg behind the girth.

Spyder was explaining exactly the same to me a few months ago here
http://www.horseforum.com/dressage/leg-yielding-62955/page3/


My horse canters perfectly with just the inside leg now (we also moved to another stable and changed the trainer).

 

[VelvetsAB]

When I cue to canter...I use my inside leg, with maybe just a fraction of inside rein. If he doesn't get it right away, then I will also put my outside leg on.

My coach prefers the inside leg method. It took some time to figure it out, and I do revert back sometimes to using my outside leg. Just takes time to remember inside leg...inside leg.

 

[mumiinek]

When I cue to canter...I use my inside leg, with maybe just a fraction of inside rein. If he doesn't get it right away, then I will also put my outside leg on.

My coach prefers the inside leg method. It took some time to figure it out, and I do revert back sometimes to using my outside leg. Just takes time to remember inside leg...inside leg.

Luckily I didn't have any problems switching to the inside leg cue as that's what always felt natural to me, I think that's how I must have been taught to do it as a kid (I then had many years break from horses). I always had to be reminded of the outside leg behind the girth, my trainer would be running behind me and yelling at me to put the leg behind all the time and I felt like crap for constantly failing to do so. I remember thinking to myself once "drat, I'm teaching my horse to canter on the inside leg" believing I'm making a big mistake. When I had my first lesson with the new trainer I asked him (amongst other things) how to make the horse canter and he said "always the inside leg!", I felt so happy :lol:

 

[VelvetsAB]

Luckily I didn't have any problems switching to the inside leg cue as that's what always felt natural to me, I think that's how I must have been taught to do it as a kid (I then had many years break from horses). I always had to be reminded of the outside leg behind the girth, my trainer would be running behind me and yelling at me to put the leg behind all the time and I felt like crap for constantly failing to do so. I remember thinking to myself once "drat, I'm teaching my horse to canter on the inside leg" believing I'm making a big mistake. When I had my first lesson with the new trainer I asked him (amongst other things) how to make the horse canter and he said "always the inside leg!", I felt so happy :lol:

Isn't it interesting how things are taught so many different ways, even in a close location?

 

[mumiinek]

Isn't it interesting how things are taught so many different ways, even in a close location?

Well the stable I was in before was a few-horse teaching-in-the-backyard kind of thing, the stable I'm in now is a 60+ sport stable, number one in the country, they have the best horses, riders and facilities. They can't really afford making a mistake or tell you something just because to them it seems ok. My former trainer wasn't even a trainer, which I found out only here because as I learned he's a famous BSer (I met a few people here who moved out of his stable too). Actually I've never even seen him riding a horse (and neither did others that I asked). I spent many years without horses believing my years with them are over so when I got an oportunity to start riding again and found his stable I was so overwhelmed to be around horses again that I failed to see all the stuff going on around. I fell in love with one of his mistreated horses and decided to buy him no matter what, he was a little underweight brown-orange friesian with tangled tail and mane and rotten hooves, you can see his before/after pictures in my profile. Anyway, to prevent this from being another novel of mine, I'm very happy we're gone. I wouldn't belive him even if he came to me telling me a simple "hello". He was the kinda guy that would yell at you "PULL HIM TO THE INSIDE!!" and right after you did that he would be chasing you with "WHY THE .... ARE YOU PULLING HIM TO THE INSIDE!!"

I'm sorry for the rant, I'm still trying to put up with me being so stupid and ever considering him a good trainer. I now have to drive for one hour to get to my horse (while the "little funny stable" is 10 minutes away from here) but I know both me and my horse get the best we can possibly get.

 

[mumiinek]

But it's true that on the internet you can find so many websites talking about the "outside leg behind the girth" canter cue over and over again. That's something I truely don't understand...

 

[Spyder]

But it's true that on the internet you can find so many websites talking about the "outside leg behind the girth" canter cue over and over again. That's something I truely don't understand...

The thinking behind this is that the outside hind leg is the starting leg for the canter so you use your outside leg to START the canter.

The flaw in this is that you are taught to start the canter from a grounded leg. This cannot be done as a grounded leg cannot be influenced...

The rider influences the thrust distance and power of any leg that is about to land in the action it will provide AFTER it strikes the ground. They can influence any leg by shortening and lengthening the stride. So in effect any leg used by the rider to initiate the canter is in fact shortening or lengthening it to create the desired gait.

 

[Icyred]

When I taught my gelding the cue for canter, in addition to my outside leg he HAD to wait for me to kiss to go into the canter, outside leg back only meant canter when I kissed as well.

 

[Kayty]

When I taught my gelding the cue for canter, in addition to my outside leg he HAD to wait for me to kiss to go into the canter, outside leg back only meant canter when I kissed as well.

The point? You've taught him to canter with your voice aid not your leg aid. Should you want to ride a dressage test, you'll have big problems - use of voice = penalties/disqualification!

 

[equiniphile]

And this is why I love Molly!

The leg behind the girth, for her, is the cue for a half-pass. Canter is either a kiss or a gentle squeeze with both legs, never both or she canters too fast.

I would go back to basic aid training and reteach to her that a leg AT the girth means canter, and behind the girth means "move the back end".

 

[Icyred]

The point? You've taught him to canter with your voice aid not your leg aid. Should you want to ride a dressage test, you'll have big problems - use of voice = penalties/disqualification!

I was just giving an example of what I do...No need to get snappy. :?

 

[coffeeaddict]

I'm having the same problem. I was thinking of using a firm press with the outside leg for canter and a tap, tap with the outside for the side pass. But I have no idea how well that would work in reality. My girl is sensitive to aids, so the moment I put the outside leg on she's cantering, she won't give me time to tap if I want to do a side pass.

I may have to see about re-training her to use the inside leg as a canter cue instead.

 

[VelvetsAB]

When I taught my gelding the cue for canter, in addition to my outside leg he HAD to wait for me to kiss to go into the canter, outside leg back only meant canter when I kissed as well.

I am not a fan of having a horse associate a noise (click/cluck/kiss/smooch etc) as it makes the person rely on that noise. I ride with a bunch of kids who smooch before even giving the proper cue for walk/trot/canter. They carry crops for decoration. They sound like chickens. Cluck cluck smooch cluck cluck cluck.

Saying woah is fine... That doesnt bother me.

But this is my point of view on it.

 

[Icyred]

Idk, when I give my voice aids they are very quiet, and people don't usually here them as they are only just enough so the horse can pick up them. I don't like clucking chickens either, I give the small sound and that is it, I don't repeat it over and over, my legs, seat and hand help reinforce and maintain the cue.