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Horse meat - Will you eat it ??

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I don't eat any mammals. I don't really believe that humane slaughter exists, except possibly when done on a very small scale. Which is very rare. Commercial slaughterhouses are full of sadists, and the assembly line quotas mean that a lot of horrors take place.
My husband does have the occasional steak when we go out to dinner, but I don't give him grief about it. Since he's no longer used to eating red meat very often, it almost always makes him sick later lol.
 

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"I was personally very saddened when most if not all of America did away with the horse slaughters. They were run just like bovine slaughter houses and provided a last resort before starvation, abuse, and further neglect was a cause of death."

I strongly suggest doing a little research on how being "stunned" with a captive bolt gun in a slaughterhouse effects a horse. The guns are designed for cattle. Horses are built completely differently from cattle. "Humane horse slaughter" has always been a myth. But I'm sure a myth that helps a lot of people sleep at night.


 

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Commercial slaughterhouses are full of sadists
And you know this how?

When was the last time you worked in a slaughter house? Never? Yeah, that's what I thought.

I find it interesting that you 'allow' your husband to eat meat, but condemn everyone else for doing it. Hypocrite much, dear?

Plus, captive bolt guns are used all the time by vets as a euthing tool for horses as well as cattle.

In fact, the next horse I need put down, instead of using chemical euthing, I'm either going to have it done by captive bolt or bullet. Faster, cleaner, and the animal doesn't suffer the way they can during a chemical euthing.

You're the one who needs to do some actual research, instead of spewing PETA, HSUS and animal rights propaganda BS.
 

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I don't lecture people who choose to eat meat, though I would say something if it were horses or cats or dogs. I feel that those are companion animals, not meat. I don't "allow" my husband to eat meat, he does what he wants. If he wants to go to the store, buy steak, bring it home, and cook it, I'm not going to say a word.
I have done plenty of research on slaughter, read books, watched the videos, been to the killer horse auction etc. I don't think that former commercial slaughterhouse workers who report the horrors that they have seen are making up stories just for fun, nor do I think that people on hidden camera documentary video are just acting like sadists for the cameras. Taking life day after day, in a high pressure assembly line environment, is going to desensitize even a normal person eventually. What was once a horror isn't going to seem as awful if you see it day after day after day. That's just basic human nature.
If any vets around here are using captive bolt guns to put horses down they keep it a pretty good secret. I've seen horses euthed by vets, and it's been IV. Besides, a CAPTIVE bolt gun doesn't kill an animal, it just stuns them so that the heart still beats and they will bleed out easier when the throat is slit and the animal is hung upside down.
I have never read any information (on either the pro or con side, yes I've researched both sides) that mentioned slaughterhouses using a penetrating bolt gun to actually kill the horse prior to bleeding it out. I am certainly open to reading reliable testimony about humane horse slaughter. I've looked, and had yet to be able to find any such thing. I'm always open to hearing both sides.
 

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Commercial slaughterhouses are full of sadists, and the assembly line quotas mean that a lot of horrors take place.

And you have gathered this information how...?

No they are not. They are full of honest people trying to earn a living so that they can go home and feed their families. You assume that just because they work in a slaughter house that they are evil, vindictive, and sadist people that are crazy about murdering animals, right?

There used be a slaughter house about twenty five minutes from my house, and I knew a lot of people that worked there. None of them were "sadists." Most of them were mothers and fathers who came upon hard times and had to find a job quick so their babies at home would not starve, and the slaughterhouse was usually hiring, so it was what they had to do. Not only that, I've visited a couple of other slaughter houses when they were still legal in the states just to see what was going on, and I never met one single person that came off as a sadist.

Don't stereotype people just because you think you know what you are talking about or read some book probably written by an insane member of PETA telling you that slaughterhouses are full of murderers. Those videos you watched? They are probably biased as all get out, too. Don't believe everything you read or see in a video. Research is one thing, but actually going out and looking at it face to face is another.
 

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Besides, a CAPTIVE bolt gun doesn't kill an animal, it just stuns them so that the heart still beats and they will bleed out easier when the throat is slit and the animal is hung upside down.
Incorrect. Captive bolts do indeed kill the animal. The bolt destroys the brain, which is the control center for all the other organs and higher functions. Without brain activity, death occurs.

The reason for slitting the throat and hanging the body in a slaughter situation is to let the last few heart beats help drain the blood out of the animal. Blood soaked meat is inedible, which means draining is a necessary part of the slaughter process. In a euth situation, the animal has no reason to be drained of blood.

So by your argument a regular bullet shouldn't actually kill an animal, since it effectively does the same thing as a bolt gun. I don't think anyone would argue that getting shot in the head with a bullet kills you.

Racetrack vets use captive bolts, from what I understand. I also know that vets in the U.K. use them as a euthanasia option. Many of them prefer the bolt or a regular gun, as opposed to chemical euthing. As I said, it's faster and cleaner.

You're not doing much actual research if all your arguments are based on propaganda videos. Many of them are not only edited to show something as being a regular occurrence when it fact it rarely happens, but some of them are also staged by the people filming the so-called 'expose'.
 

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I didn't say that they were all sadists! But there is plenty of undercover video out there that shows absolutely horrific things taking place on kill floors in slaughterhouses. Plenty of testimony out there from former slaughterhouse workers about the deliberate atrocities they have seen committed on animals, and even admitted to participating themselves. Some of them say things like "I feel really bad about it now, but the pressure to keep things moving, and seeing so many animals killed, after awhile we'd kind of forget that they were living things with feelings..." I doubt that many of them at the time went home and told their friends and family "Hey, anyone wanna hear about how Bob and I scalded a pig alive today on purpose!?!?"
Do I believe that humane slaughter exists? Absolutely. Unfortunately most of the small scale "boutique" operations that can take the time to do it right are being forced out of business by the factory operations. Do I believe that it exists in most large scale commercial slaughterhouses? No. I'm sure that some animals do get a quick painless death at those places. Others perish horribly. Some with deliberate cruelty, but more often just the result of assembly line mistakes and oversights.
I am not a PETA nut. I don't support PETA, because although I think they do some good things to bring worthy causes to light, they discredit their good work with the looney tune stuff, and I think that Ingrid Newkirk is insane (really insane, not just "Oh she's crazy...).
I have no problem with animals being raised for food, treated humanely, and then humanely slaughtered. Right now those 3 things only seem to happen together in a very small, niche market.
 

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I'm looking around on the internet right now, and just keep finding things that say that the object of the bolt gun in horse slaughterhouses is to stun the horse, not kill it. If you can direct me to some information that explains otherwise, I will happily read it. Like I said, I am happy to get as much information as I can, on both sides. I'm sure that a vet using a bolt gun in a controlled situation, where they can take their time and properly restrain the horse, would probably be a different scenario.
I'm not going to bother with anything that came from any type of pro animal site, because I can see that it will automatically be discounted as "propoganda".
 

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I didn't say that they were all sadists! But there is plenty of undercover video out there that shows absolutely horrific things taking place on kill floors in slaughterhouses. Plenty of testimony out there from former slaughterhouse workers about the deliberate atrocities they have seen committed on animals, and even admitted to participating themselves. Some of them say things like "I feel really bad about it now, but the pressure to keep things moving, and seeing so many animals killed, after awhile we'd kind of forget that they were living things with feelings..." I doubt that many of them at the time went home and told their friends and family "Hey, anyone wanna hear about how Bob and I scalded a pig alive today on purpose!?!?"
Do I believe that humane slaughter exists? Absolutely. Unfortunately most of the small scale "boutique" operations that can take the time to do it right are being forced out of business by the factory operations. Do I believe that it exists in most large scale commercial slaughterhouses? No. I'm sure that some animals do get a quick painless death at those places. Others perish horribly. Some with deliberate cruelty, but more often just the result of assembly line mistakes and oversights.
I am not a PETA nut. I don't support PETA, because although I think they do some good things to bring worthy causes to light, they discredit their good work with the looney tune stuff, and I think that Ingrid Newkirk is insane (really insane, not just "Oh she's crazy...).
I have no problem with animals being raised for food, treated humanely, and then humanely slaughtered. Right now those 3 things only seem to happen together in a very small, niche market.
I'm just wondering, do you not eat cereals, grains, bread, etc etc..... Harvested plant foods.

I am sure you do.....do you know how many free range animals die in combine machines to give you grains, etc.....??? Isn't that just as bad? I think a quick death for farmed meat is much more humane than the slow, agonizing death of non food animals such as squirrels, field mice, cute little bunnies being torn limb from limb in a combine and then just left to bleed to death in their agony in the field so that you can have wheat, oats, barley, corn....

If you are gonna go all "humane" on us, you might as well go the distance and not eat anything except what you humanely grow yourself in your own yard...otherwise you are just as guilty of killing of hundreds of lil creatures in a very inhumane way!
 

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Honestly, 'humane slaughter' is kind of an oxymoron.....Killing isn't nice...it's neccesary...You can't chemically put down an animal intended for human cunsumption, a real bullet is more than a little impractical than a bolt gun, and while there 'may' be 'some' sadists in the industry, the industry it's self isn't sadistic and those individuals who do show that they are otherwise 'inhumane' to the livestock being culled should be prosecuted.

Not only that, but the bolt, even if fired incorrectly (which can happen, granted) the time it takes to kill the animal is NOTHING as inhumane as leaving the slaughterhouses closed and leaving the horses to starve to death or be shipped to Mexico where TRUE inhumane slaughter practices are happening.

Or, what about the people who are so desperate to sell a horse and can't, so they just let it out at some park or on the side of the road (It HAS happened!!!) Know what happens then? Road kill...true sadists get a hold of them and do truly evil things...packs of dogs or other wild animals introduce themselves as part of the horse's food chain...and the horse will always be at the bottom of it.
 

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Yes, eating bread that might have resulted in the death of a field mouse is exactly the same thing as eating a toxic horse steak from a horse that suffered the trauma of a kill auction, inhumane transport, a feed lot, and a terrifying death. Yep, same exact thing. @@
I was MORE than willing to rationally discuss the subject, and I'm always interested in seeing some credible information from the other side of my viewpoint. But now it's just getting stupid and pointless.
I guess now I have a little better understanding how so many people who dump horses at kill auctions (which I have been to and seen with my own eyes, not through "propoganda videos") do what they do and go home and sleep like babies that night. Learn something every day.
 

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^

Ok, fine, here's your information.

Field mouse my ***. The thresher alone is responsible for hundreds, if not thousands, of animals being brutally torn to shreds every single year. And if you choose to ignore that, fine, ignore this - do you have an explanation for the hundreds of thousands of animals that die every year from starvation and disease because your monocrops are displacing their habitats faster then they can give birth? Or do you ignore that? You're probably against hunting as well, the necessary evil that presents itself when people like you choose to ignore the fact that our world can no longer support the expanding populations because WE keep driving this animals out of their natural habitats and completely DESTROYING the surrounding ecosystem.

There is NO such thing as a "guilt free" meal. Animals suffer JUST as much for your meal as they do mine - except, I at least EAT the animal that endured suffering for my plate, unlike you who just scream and cry to save all the animals while contently dining on your blood splattered wheat and feeling smug about how no animals died for YOUR meal. Think again sister.

I have zero issue with vegetarians - I have a HUGE issue with self righteous idiots who seem to think there's such thing as eating without death. It's called a circle of life, and like it or not, NOTHING you eat isn't splattered with the blood of one animal or another. And they ALL died violently. Go watch a nature tape sometime.
 

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Oh, and look farther then Wikipedia next time. If I have time to locate it, I will find the article that was printed in Horse & Rider about 2-3 years ago that touched on the slaughter debate between licensed veterinarians pro slaughter and anti-slaughter - both sides acknowledge a properly administered captive bolt gun is one of THE most humane ways to EUTHANIZE an animal.

Captive bolt gun - definition of Captive bolt gun in the Medical dictionary - by the Free Online Medical Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.
captive bolt pistol
a handheld weapon used for euthanasia of large animals. The muzzle is placed against the subject's forehead. When the trigger is pulled, or the firing pin struck a sharp blow, a 3 cm rod, 1 cm diameter exits sharply from the muzzle and pierces the skull and damages the brain. The rod does not leave the weapon and there is no possible risk of injuring a bystander.

http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/118519281/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0

Anybody with a still INTACT brain should be able to deduce that when a bolt of metal SHATTERS your skull and DESTROYS part of the brain, even if you're not technically dead based on a still beating heart (which obviously takes longer to stop), you're not feeling anything.

Every article I have ever read on veterinarians against slaughter has ZERO to do with the captive bolt gun and it's effectiveness - it has to do with IMPROPER use of the captive bolt gun. Any veterinarian will tell you that when properly administered, it is THE most accurate and humane way to kill a large animal.
 

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I just thought of something else. Most people who try to be vegetarian or "guilt free" don't even THINK about what they wear and use. I see so many vegans in their nice clean "natural cotton"....yeah, that was harvested by threshers too, people!!! And don't get me started on what the manufacture of Nylon and polyester does to the environment....why not google that????

Seems to me that farming beef then using it for food, clothing, and other materials is pretty innocent compared to what we do to obtain our so called "green" and "guilt free" products.
 

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The only way to make sure anything we eat or wear is 'green' and 'guilt free' is to grow, breed, raise, harvest, slaughter, and make ourselves.

How many of us have the time, money, and resources to be able to do that? Very few, and even those who could wouldn't want to.

Small farms are not the bucolic, easy going, happy places some people seem to think they are. They're about birth and death, just on a much smaller scale than the factory farms.

They use the same machinery and methods as the bigger places.

I have no problem if someone wants to cut out meat from their lives. Just don't let it turn into a crusade, or set yourself up as somehow more caring and humane than the rest of us who really understand how things work.
 

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We are omnivores with a conscience :)

This leads to many dilemmas in our day by day life.
Whatever path you choose, try to accept and understand others as well.
 

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Horse Slaughter Debate

This is an incredibly controversial topic. I've been around horses all my life and can see the advantages of having horse slaughter legalized while at the same time feeling sad about selling a horse to slaughter.
 

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Artsyjenn, lets ignore all the good points other like SR make. I just want to say, your side would be better served if you would not change your mind on every other post.


artsyjenn said:
I don't really believe that humane slaughter exists
Versus

artsyjenn said:
Do I believe that humane slaughter exists? Absolutely.




artsyjenn said:
Commercial slaughterhouses are full of sadists
Versus

artsyjenn said:
I didn't say that they were all sadists!
Um...full does not mean all in your world?



From the same paragraph even:

artsyjenn said:
I don't think that former commercial slaughterhouse workers who report the horrors that they have seen are making up stories just for fun
Versus

artsyjenn said:
Taking life day after day, in a high pressure assembly line environment, is going to desensitize even a normal person eventually. What was once a horror isn't going to seem as awful if you see it day after day after day. That's just basic human nature.
So, do they think these things are horrors or do they use their basic human nature and they are desensitized to it? I am confused.



Just to clarify something you obviously do not understand.

artsyjenn said:
and they will bleed out easier when the throat is slit and the animal is hung upside down.


That thing is called gravity. Hence the reason the carcass is hung upside down. So gravity can do its thing. If the heart was still beating away in there (vs the muscle slowly stopping like happens even with lethal injection) they could leave the carcass on the floor to bleed out under its own pumping power. Hanging the body allows that wonderful thing called gravity drain the blood.





 

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This is an incredibly controversial topic. I've been around horses all my life and can see the advantages of having horse slaughter legalized while at the same time feeling sad about selling a horse to slaughter.
Anyone who feels sad about selling a horse to slaughter doesn't have to.

There are other options for an unwanted animal if the thought of selling to slaughter is too horrific.
 
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