[damnedEvans]

hello, I want to ask if anyone know what problem has this mare at her knees.

The mare is around 20 years of age, she's a rescued horse and at this moment she's at a horse shelter for almost 2 years now. Her previous owner had abandoned her after she fell in a canal, they let her there to die.
The doctor told us to euthanize her. She sometimes refuse to walk, and after she laid down she can't get up without some help. The knee joint seems to be painful to touch because she pulls back her leg when I do that.
Besides of those problems she's a very kind and sweet mare.


___

Sorry for my english mistakes.

 

[maura]

I gasped when the photos opened up

Judging from the signifigant swelling, particularly in the right one, I'd say she damaged the joint capsule of the knee and probably has bone chips in the knee as well.

If the vet isn't recommending a treatment, and you can't make her comfortable with pain meds, I'd reluctantly agree with recommendation to put her down.

A horse that can't lay down and get back up doesn't have great quality of life. She has to be in constant pain.

She must be a very sweet mare indeed.

 

[damnedEvans]

Yes, I agree with you, this mare should be put down but I can't decide this by myself.This decision should be taken by the ones that manage the horse shelter and they don't want to do this. They decided to let her die naturally when will come her time. The doctor just told us that she must be put down without recommending a further treatment for her.

In my country the laws for animal protection are not respected. I know that in other place a horse in this condition that is let without a treatment for his illness will be considered animal cruelty. I'm worried for this mare and for a few other horses from this shelter were I'm volunteering and I don't know what to do to help them. That's why I ask information, maybe I find some helpful things.

Thank you a lot for your answer.

 

[maura]

I'm sorry, that puts you in a really awful position.

I guess that comes with working for a shelter, but I'm still surprised the shelter management believes "letting her time come" is the best course of action.

Are they doing anything for her for pain relief?

 

[damnedEvans]

Unfortunately no, the mare doesn't receive anything for pain relief.
They decided to euthanize just the horses in a very critical condition, the ones that can't stand on their feet and the ones that are in very very bad condition. They decided that this mare can live her life in a decent way. Anyway, I have some cases more critical that this one. This why I hate my country, for it's lack of laws for animal protection . If even in a shelter is happening this, you can imagine what it can happen in other places.

 

[smrobs]

Wow, I'm so sorry. She certainly does look like a very sweet girl. :,,(

 

[kevinshorses]

Keeping her alive is paramount to torture. If she can't get up without help I would say she is not far from not being able to get up at all. If she were mine I would have her slaughtered for food. She would no longer be in pain and her body would not be wasted. I'm sure there is a market for horse meat in eastern europe and people would be grateful for the food.

 

[BC Horse Girl]

sweet girl

it's unfortunate. Is she in pain or does she just look like she's in pain? From the looks of her condition and from what was said about her I'm not sure it's just her knees bothering her. If she had a fall like that and was left her muscles and joint all over her body were probably effected. Geriatric horses often respond well to equine chiropractic treatments. It may help keep her confortable thru these hard times. You can look on the internet and find someone in your area. Just a suggestion

 

[damnedEvans]

it's unfortunate. Is she in pain or does she just look like she's in pain? From the looks of her condition and from what was said about her I'm not sure it's just her knees bothering her. If she had a fall like that and was left her muscles and joint all over her body were probably effected. Geriatric horses often respond well to equine chiropractic treatments. It may help keep her confortable thru these hard times. You can look on the internet and find someone in your area. Just a suggestion

Well I think that she is really in pain because sometimes she refuses to move, she just stand like a statue. When I must take her to the pasture or move her out of the way I have a lot of difficulties and I must pull and push her. But she's not always like this. She's a dominant mare in the heard and she's able to fight all the horses and kick them out of her way. Thank you for your advice.

@kevinshorses I agree to you that it's a torture to keep alive a horse that it's in pain. I think that it will be a good thing to end her suffering in a way, but I'm not ok with horse slaughters. The reason that this horse shelter exist is to rescue the horses that are abandoned or sent to slaughter. So for me the alternative is not a option. But thank you for the advice anyway .

@smrobs That you for word, she is indeed one of our kindest horses.

 

[5cuetrain]

Being a custodian for an animal--any animal-- comes with the responsibility to do whats right for them.

Just letting nature take its course is not being a good custodian. It would have been better if they just let her die naturally when she was caught in the ditch. Whats the difference between that and the current thought of "let her die naturally". Doesn't make any sense any way you look at it.

Call the news and let the people explain their position to the media. That should get them to reconsider what being a good custodian is all about.

 

[smrobs]

Guys, we do have to consider that the poster is from Romania. It is a completely different horse world than we have here in the states. I kinda doubt that a news would be terribly concerned about a few hungry horses and one injured one. Sometimes euthanasia can be expensive if done by a vet. Evans, does the owner have a gun that they would be willing to use to put the poor mare out of her misery? I don't want to sound cruel but that may be the only other option.

 

[trailhorserider]

Keeping her alive is paramount to torture. If she can't get up without help I would say she is not far from not being able to get up at all. If she were mine I would have her slaughtered for food. She would no longer be in pain and her body would not be wasted. I'm sure there is a market for horse meat in eastern europe and people would be grateful for the food.

Then I suppose you also eat your dogs when their time comes to an end. :shock:

 

[damnedEvans]

Guys, we do have to consider that the poster is from Romania. It is a completely different horse world than we have here in the states. I kinda doubt that a news would be terribly concerned about a few hungry horses and one injured one. Sometimes euthanasia can be expensive if done by a vet. Evans, does the owner have a gun that they would be willing to use to put the poor mare out of her misery? I don't want to sound cruel but that may be the only other option.

yes, indeed. If I was from other country things would be very different. As an example, if someone calls the authorities to tell them that a horse is abandoned, or in a bad shape, or neglected they say that it's not their business. Sometimes there are news like "an abandoned horse/dog let to die on the streets", they do nothing to help that poor animal, absolutely nothing. This horse shelter where I'm volunteering provide some help for some horses, I should post somewhere the successful stories too, but they are not sponsored by the country's administration. So they offer treatment just for some cases, like open injuries, emaciated horse, colic cases. Besides of that they offer shelter and food. If a horse has an internal illness, a broken bone, a deformed leg or something like that they don't have medicines or cure for them and they rarely provide lethal injection. I think that this is because the injection is expensive and the cost for getting rid of the cadaver are expensive too. I don't know, they think that they do something good to horses. They do to some but not to all of them.

And no, they do not have a gun, but anyway they see this as a cruel method to kill a horse. Let's hope that this mare (Naomi is her name, I forgot to tell) will be ok, horses are sometimes very strong.

thank you for the support and advices.I'm not very good at horse health subjects so sometimes I'm not aware when a horse suffer because they rarely show this to us. So the opinions were helpful to me.

 

[maura]

Not directly relevant to the OP's original concern; but as someone who has put down horses by both methods, I can assure you that shooting is not cruel to the horse. If done correctly, it is *quicker* than lethal injection. The horse is literally dead before it hits the ground when shot; lethal injection takes several minutes, and in a couple of cases I've had the vet check vitals after a few minutes and then administer another injection to finish the job.

If we're honest with ourselves, it's us *as owners* that are traumitized by shooting, and we prefer lethal injection because it's easier on us, not the horses.

And I know I'm opening a can of worms here, but horses for slaughter is a similiarly fraught, less than rational, completly emotional issue. If the horse was euthanized in the kindest, least painful way, does it truly matter how the body is disposed of? I'm not immune to this particular irrationality; I have several beloved horses in marked graves at various farms. But I'm honest enough to know I did it for *me*, to help me deal with my grief, and that it was immaterial to the animal. Before you post in angry response to this, let me ask how you would dispose of a horse in your current situation - in my area, the vet's fee for the euthansia is $200; and the fee to have someone come with a backhoe, dig the grave and bury the horse is $200. That's if you have enough property of your own to bury the animal on! The other alternatives are 1.) the landfill or 2.) sending the horse to the hound kennel for the local hunt. Emotionally, if it's a horse I've been very attached to, I prefer euthansia and a marked grave. Intellectually, sending the horse to the kennels makes better sense but is hard to endorse for a beloved companion. The landfill's horrible from every perspective, but it's the only option available to certain suburban horse owners.

***Be very slow to criticize if you've been lucky enough not to have to make these decisions***

End of rant. Sorry.

 

[damnedEvans]

Not directly relevant to the OP's original concern; but as someone who has put down horses by both methods, I can assure you that shooting is not cruel to the horse. If done correctly, it is *quicker* than lethal injection. The horse is literally dead before it hits the ground when shot; lethal injection takes several minutes, and in a couple of cases I've had the vet check vitals after a few minutes and then administer another injection to finish the job.

If we're honest with ourselves, it's us *as owners* that are traumitized by shooting, and we prefer lethal injection because it's easier on us, not the horses.

And I know I'm opening a can of worms here, but horses for slaughter is a similiarly fraught, less than rational, completly emotional issue. If the horse was euthanized in the kindest, least painful way, does it truly matter how the body is disposed of? I'm not immune to this particular irrationality; I have several beloved horses in marked graves at various farms. But I'm honest enough to know I did it for *me*, to help me deal with my grief, and that it was immaterial to the animal. Before you post in angry response to this, let me ask how you would dispose of a horse in your current situation - in my area, the vet's fee for the euthansia is $200; and the fee to have someone come with a backhoe, dig the grave and bury the horse is $200. That's if you have enough property of your own to bury the animal on! The other alternatives are 1.) the landfill or 2.) sending the horse to the hound kennel for the local hunt. Emotionally, if it's a horse I've been very attached to, I prefer euthansia and a marked grave. Intellectually, sending the horse to the kennels makes better sense but is hard to endorse for a beloved companion. The landfill's horrible from every perspective, but it's the only option available to certain suburban horse owners.

***Be very slow to criticize if you've been lucky enough not to have to make these decisions***

End of rant. Sorry.

Ohh, I totally agree with you on some points. I think that any animal should be put down if that animal is suffering, the manner to do this is not that important if it is just a short pain for him. For example when you are on trails and one of the horses is hurt in a way that he can't be cured you should end that horse's life without a second thought. If you can do this with a knife it will be just fine. I think that is something stupid to not do it because you can't bare the sight or because you think that you can't do it.
I think that some horse owners would better shoot or put down the horse when they can't take care of him than let him starve on streets. It will be better for the poor animal.

In my country shooting an animal isn't that common, they don't use this method. having a gun is not common either.
If that mare would be mine I would euthanize her without a second thought because I understand that the animal is suffering. But it's not mine, and I can't oblige someone to do this if they don't want to.

The problem of horse slaughter is another thing. If they would kill the animals in a proper way it will be ok, but they don't do this. And not just the way that they kill them bothers me but the way that they transport and treat them. But I would prefer to see someone send the horse to slaughter than let the animal starve. I saw some horses in a very bad shape, I saw horses starved and beaten and it is awful.

Ehh, that's all. The most important thing is that people are different and see those things in a different way. We can't oblige them to think in a way that we find proper. Some people think that they treat their animals just fine, and sometimes they make efforts to do this even if it's not the proper way. We can just tell them an opinion or give them some advice.

 

[Padrona]

Compassion without discipline is cruelty. If the mare is suffering and her quality of life is dimished, then the kindest thing is to lay her to rest. If her pain can be managed through quality drugs and therapies, and her custodians have the funds to do so, then I see nothing wrong with keeping her going. At the end of the day it all boils down to the amount of desire and resources to keep her alive, and the mare's quality of life.

I pour gobs of $$$$$ into an old rescued mare that will never be truly "usable" for anything but it's my choice to do so, and providing she is cared for properly, she's very comfortable and has a great quality of life.