[StormyBlues]

A shoulder in and haunches in. I'm 90% sure Geof knows it because he has an AMAZING basis in dressage and was trained(some training done with) a top level dressage rider.

So how do you ask for them? How should my legs, seat, arms, hands, etc. ask? I really want to get alot of dressage work in, because I think that helps ALOT on XC! Lol

Also, I'm having some trouble with the flying changes, it is probably me asking wrong. I get him straight on the diagonal across, then do just as I would ask for the opisate lead, sometimes he does it, sometimes he just starts extending his canter. I always make him do at least a simple change, so he gets that I'm asking for the other lead, but what am I doing wrong?

Thanks Dressage girls!!!!! Ya'll have been a big help to me latly!

 

[Spastic_Dove]

http://www.horseforum.com/dressage/shoulders-41893/

A thread I had with a similar question I got some clarity from the responses

 

[StormyBlues]

^THANKS! I will be adding that book MIE showed to my Xmas list!

 

[gypsygirl]

for the flying lead changes, i would start out by cutting across the arena from B to E & asking for the change at X. i always try to change bend pretty dramatically at first & ask like you would ask for the canter from the trot or walk, lots of outside leg [new outside leg of course]. also if they arent getting it a will give them a tap with the crop behind my new outside leg. once they can do it like that you can start crossing the short diagonal & then the diagonal, but at first that is usually not enough bend change for them IMO

some people like to put a pole down, but that has never worked for me.

 

[StormyBlues]

That doesn't make sense, you have to be straight for the change.

 

[gypsygirl]

the change takes place between one bend to the other

 

[Kayty]

Yep when you start changes I find that it's much easier to teach it by dramatically changing the bend. I usually do in on a figure of 8. SO get a nice steady, SOFT canter happening, and then as you get to the centre of the 8, swap your aids and really sit to the side of the other lead while changing the bend.
I find it hard to explain what I mean over the net obviously! I would just go and get a good dressage instructor.
Also, does your horse know simple changes? If not, I owuldn't even be THINKING about flying changes.

 

[eventerwannabe]

I am am more of a hunter rider, so I know how hunters do it. But how I have learned to do it is act like you are asking for the canter. So if you want the right lead (and you are on the left lead) you would push your right leg back and keep your left leg at the girth. I always push my leg back super far when I am working with a new horse or am refreshing the horse on how to do a lead change. So when I push my right leg back, I pick up my left rein a little (must have contact for this to work).
^^ This should work in half seat or full seat.

You and your horse have to be very in touch with eachother to get a good lead change. Horses that are well trained will do auto changes (more of a hunter thing) when they are on the wrong lead.

I dont know how dressage riders are supposed to ask for a lead change, sorry! Just though I would share how I know how to. =]

Again, this is just how I know how to do a lead change and I am more of a hunter rider.

 

[wild_spot]

That doesn't make sense, you have to be straight for the change.

The horses body has to be straight for the change - But the easiest way to teach or begin flys, is by using the change of bend between two circles. It is much clearer to the horse what you are asking.

At ASH shows, in all working classes, flys are asked for between circles.

You need to make sure you have a very short, bouncy, together canter - It takes a lot of rear energy for a horse to do a flying change properly, from behind.

I will often ride a figure 8 - And start out by doing a simple change through walk on the straight - Gradually decreasing the number of steps of walk - Eventually phasing out the walk.

 

[letsgetserious]

I am am more of a hunter rider, so I know how hunters do it. But how I have learned to do it is act like you are asking for the canter. So if you want the right lead (and you are on the left lead) you would push your right leg back and keep your left leg at the girth. I always push my leg back super far when I am working with a new horse or am refreshing the horse on how to do a lead change. So when I push my right leg back, I pick up my left rein a little (must have contact for this to work).
^^ This should work in half seat or full seat.

You and your horse have to be very in touch with eachother to get a good lead change. Horses that are well trained will do auto changes (more of a hunter thing) when they are on the wrong lead.

I dont know how dressage riders are supposed to ask for a lead change, sorry! Just though I would share how I know how to. =]

Again, this is just how I know how to do a lead change and I am more of a hunter rider.

If I was on the left lead and wanted the right, I would move my left leg back because thats the leg you want him to start pushing off of instead of the right.

 

[StormyBlues]

I have a great trainer, and we've worked on lead changes some, but not alot, and we havn't worked on shoulder-ins.

He can do lead changes and simple changes. I can get a lead change out of him sometimes, just not all the time.

 

[gypsygirl]

i would guess that if you can get them some times & not others that you are not always asking him clearly enough. at first you should exaggerate your aids until he realizes what you what, then you can back off & refine.

sometimes they do get lazy with their changes & you can give them a spank behind your new outside leg. they will probably give a good leap forward if you need to do that, so you might want to grab a bit of mane so you dont punish them for doing what you want !

 

[tealamutt]

^THANKS! I will be adding that book MIE showed to my Xmas list!

I just got that book a couple of days ago-terrific! I also got one called "The Handbook of Riding Essentials" by Francois Lemaire de Ruffieu that I like. I'm sure it is waaay to elementary for most dressage riders but it breaks things down in a very understandable way and has excellent diagrams. It helped me really get shoulder in and haunches in and the tips in there for working on flying changes have done wonders for me and my hunter-trained horse. Definitely get the one MIE recommended though!

 

[StormyBlues]

awsome! I'll try!

 

[tealamutt]

I have a great trainer, and we've worked on lead changes some, but not alot, and we havn't worked on shoulder-ins.

He can do lead changes and simple changes. I can get a lead change out of him sometimes, just not all the time.

I promise if you start working on some lateral exercises and bending, your flying changes are going to be a million times better. You need to get his weight moving to that outside shoulder (what is about to become the inside) so that he can step through with his hind to do the change. There is also a great video on you tube (and I have a final very soon so I'm sorry I can't look it up for the link here) by Jane Savoie on flying changes and using bending to get him to change with the hind.

 

[StormyBlues]

Yeah, I've really been working on half passes and lateral work

 

[StormyBlues]

I tried the bending and got a couple good changes out of him. He started getting tired and slaking near the end though! Silly pony!

 

[Spyder]

Be careful about the bend. It should not be exaggerated. A good change should have the horse virtually straight and overbending will result in lost marks on any test.


Here the camera caught me just on the first stride after a change was made and this is as much bend that should be shown.

 

[StormyBlues]

^That's what I thought. Cause you never see the riders in GP doing their changes of every stride with the nose bend either way...

 

[gypsygirl]

personally, when i talk about exaggeration i am talking about teaching them/getting them to understand what you want. once they understand you can become more refined. not many horses are going to be able to do a lead change that is show worthy on their first few tries, & neither are riders.