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Pepper is a 15 year old Standardbred cross with Quarter Horse .
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My boyfriends horse stumbles alot. Even when his hooves are trimmed. Especially when he is rode or being worked in the round pen. And he walks like he is drunk most of the time . I do know that he is pigeoned toed as well as has slight twisted knee joints in front. I'm trying to find information on what would cause horses to stumble a lot . As well as more information about pigeon toes horses .Is this common for these type of horses to stumble alot like this ? Or Is there something else going on? Should I be concerned ? Or am I just being paranoid? His front legs are really close together. As he is very narrow base in front. He also sometimes swings his legs out like a Peruvian paso but most of the time he crosses his front feet when he walks. Like he's drunk. I had my vet check him for epm he said he doesn't show any signs of having it.. we didnt do the bloodwork on it yet as the vet doesn't think its necessary...could it be possible he had it at one time and this is the result of it. Has anyone ever had a horse like this or dealt with this before ? I know he has been diagnosed with heaves. He is 15 years old rescue standardbred cross with Arabian. He had such a rough start in life. We are slowly getting him where he needs to be but it's a slow process. Pictures are the only ones I have of his front feet close to together. View attachment 1108092
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Have a pigeon toed gelding he hardly ever trips. But his toes are short and we'll balanced. He's ridden on some pretty rough lumpy, rocky ground never a miss step.

If horse is tripping all the time something nerologic is wrong. Or his feet are to long and poorly trimmed.
 

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Does he trip at the trot, too? What you describe is him 'plaiting' (crossing his front feet in front of each other). Usually asking the horse to speed up helps,, and it completely disappears at the trot or canter.
 

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There are many reasons aside from neuro or hoof trimming that cause a horse to trip, including saddle fit, body issues, eye sight...

Can't tell anything from that pic op, except feet look a bit long. If you'd like to post hoof(see link in my signature line) & confo pics, might help.

So the horse 'tightrope walks' and possible 'paddles' by the sound of it - sounds like a confo or body issue. Have you ever had a good bodyworker, such as a chiropractic vet or such out to see him? If not, that's where I'd start.

I wouldn't ride him until you've sorted it. I definitely wouldn't be working him in a round pen, especially if circling is obviously a big prob for him.

Unless they're severe, pigeon toes don't generally cause an issue, tho some get labled pigeon toes when they're imbalanced/flared. If his knee turns in, that is a permanent structural issue, but hopefully it's not THE prob, that's causing such difficulty for the horse & what is, is treatable.
 

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Pepper is a 15 year old Standardbred cross with Quarter Horse .
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Does he trip at the trot, too? What you describe is him 'plaiting' (crossing his front feet in front of each other). Usually asking the horse to speed up helps,, and it completely disappears at the trot or canter.
He trips worse at the trot. And sometimes when he gallops he goes down . :(
 

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I don’t have any information but I’ll follow this three because jake trips in all gaits. Mainly trot the least in walk and sometimes in canter and gallop. He is worse in the round pen too but also does it on straight even ground
1108126
 

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Pepper is a 15 year old Standardbred cross with Quarter Horse .
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
There are many reasons aside from neuro or hoof trimming that cause a horse to trip, including saddle fit, body issues, eye sight...

Can't tell anything from that pic op, except feet look a bit long. If you'd like to post hoof(see link in my signature line) & confo pics, might help.

So the horse 'tightrope walks' and possible 'paddles' by the sound of it - sounds like a confo or body issue. Have you ever had a good bodyworker, such as a chiropractic vet or such out to see him? If not, that's where I'd start.

I wouldn't ride him until you've sorted it. I definitely wouldn't be working him in a round pen, especially if circling is obviously a big prob for him.

Unless they're severe, pigeon toes don't generally cause an issue, tho some get labled pigeon toes when they're imbalanced/flared. If his knee turns in, that is a permanent structural issue, but hopefully it's not THE prob, that's causing such difficulty for the horse & what is, is treatable.
We've had a massage therapist come out to pop his tmj back in place as that goes out on him. The equine dentist fixed his mouth and discovered that he has loose teeth that may end up eventually being pulled out, as well he has a gum disease, alot of mouth ulcers. He does have heaves as he coughs and has issues breathing in the summer and spring time. He was severely neglected case and I've had this horse for over a year and the more we try to help him the more
There are many reasons aside from neuro or hoof trimming that cause a horse to trip, including saddle fit, body issues, eye sight...

Can't tell anything from that pic op, except feet look a bit long. If you'd like to post hoof(see link in my signature line) & confo pics, might help.

So the horse 'tightrope walks' and possible 'paddles' by the sound of it - sounds like a confo or body issue. Have you ever had a good bodyworker, such as a chiropractic vet or such out to see him? If not, that's where I'd start.

I wouldn't ride him until you've sorted it. I definitely wouldn't be working him in a round pen, especially if circling is obviously a big prob for him.

Unless they're severe, pigeon toes don't generally cause an issue, tho some get labled pigeon toes when they're imbalanced/flared. If his knee turns in, that is a permanent structural issue, but hopefully it's not THE prob, that's causing such difficulty for the horse & what is, is treatable.
There are many reasons aside from neuro or hoof trimming that cause a horse to trip, including saddle fit, body issues, eye sight...

Can't tell anything from that pic op, except feet look a bit long. If you'd like to post hoof(see link in my signature line) & confo pics, might help.

So the horse 'tightrope walks' and possible 'paddles' by the sound of it - sounds like a confo or body issue. Have you ever had a good bodyworker, such as a chiropractic vet or such out to see him? If not, that's where I'd start.

I wouldn't ride him until you've sorted it. I definitely wouldn't be working him in a round pen, especially if circling is obviously a big prob for him.

Unless they're severe, pigeon toes don't generally cause an issue, tho some get labled pigeon toes when they're imbalanced/flared. If his knee turns in, that is a permanent structural issue, but hopefully it's not THE prob, that's causing such difficulty for the horse & what is, is treatable.

I don’t have any information but I’ll follow this three because jake trips in all gaits. Mainly trot the least in walk and sometimes in canter and gallop. He is worse in the round pen too but also does it on straight even ground View attachment 1108126
Yep sounds like pepper:(
Does he trip at the trot, too? What you describe is him 'plaiting' (crossing his front feet in front of each other). Usually asking the horse to speed up helps,, and it completely disappears at the trot or canter.
 

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Know someone who's horse started tripping and going down. Owner spent big $$$$ trying to find the cause. Best lameness vet best chiro/body worker. Had the best farrier very knowledgeable.

She tried everything to find cause of his tripping an falling. She finally just retired him because he was to dangerous to ride. He landed on her breaking her pelvis... Cause of tripping was never found did all kinds of testing nothing found. Horse was 17 years old. Now pasture pet only not safe to ride.
 

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Pepper is a 15 year old Standardbred cross with Quarter Horse .
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Have a pigeon toed gelding he hardly ever trips. But his toes are short and we'll balanced. He's ridden on some pretty rough lumpy, rocky ground never a miss step.

If horse is tripping all the time something nerologic is wrong. Or his feet are to long and poorly trimmed.
the feet gets trimmed regular the photos are from awhile back i dont have any current photos of him . i thought it was just cuz of the feet issues but he trips and stumbles even with the feet being short and trimmed like they should be .
 

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Pepper is a 15 year old Standardbred cross with Quarter Horse .
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Know someone who's horse started tripping and going down. Owner spent big $$$$ trying to find the cause. Best lameness vet best chiro/body worker. Had the best farrier very knowledgeable.

She tried everything to find cause of his tripping an falling. She finally just retired him because he was to dangerous to ride. He landed on her breaking her pelvis... Cause of tripping was never found did all kinds of testing nothing found. Horse was 17 years old. Now pasture pet only not safe to ride.
sounds like what im going through right now with Pepper. i know im not being paranoid about it .Something just seems off .i dont ride him as we dont click but everyone that has feels something is off with him. me and a trainer friend suspects that he had epm at one time and recovered and this is the result of it. he also had a seizure awhile back in the pasture. and a mini one while riding . im really thinking the best for this horse is just to retire him to a pasture pet but he belongs to my boyfriend and he thinks im just being paranoid and that the horse is fine. The only thing i havn't done with him is have his front feet hoof tested to see if there is any heel pain . i may try that .
 

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Since your vet doesn't think EPM is the issue, I would suggest testing for PPID (Cushings). You mentioned multiple things that pointed in that direction- the clumsiness, the dental problems, and the seizures. PPID can cause all of that, and at age 15, it's a good idea to check.
 

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Pepper is a 15 year old Standardbred cross with Quarter Horse .
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
We've had a massage therapist come out to pop his tmj back in place as that goes out on him. The equine dentist fixed his mouth and discovered that he has loose teeth that may end up eventually being pulled out, as well he has a gum disease, a lot of mouth ulcers. He does have heaves as he coughs and has issues breathing in the summer and spring time. He was severely neglected case and I've had this horse for over a year and the more we try to help him the more i find things wrong with him.





Yep sounds like pepper:(
Since your vet doesn't think EPM is the issue, I would suggest testing for PPID (Cushings). You mentioned multiple things that pointed in that direction- the clumsiness, the dental problems, and the seizures. PPID can cause all of that, and at age 15, it's a good idea to check.
i didnt even think about the cushions disease . someone else had mentioned about that they noticed one night on how he was standing made them think he had cushions . i was so focused on epm i think to have him checked for that . thanks for the suggestions when i get him back from my friend ill have him hauled back to my vet and have him checked out for that . right now he is being boarded as we are currently in the process of repairing our fence and barn.
 

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He trips worse at the trot. And sometimes when he gallops he goes down . :(

oh, that IS troubling. has he been really carefully checked by a good vet?

sorry, I just read the additional posts. I am very scared of horses tripping and me being rolled onto. I have gone down HARD at the canter, twice, off a tripping horse. I am still worried about that particular danger.
I would not ride him, at all.
 

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Pepper is a 15 year old Standardbred cross with Quarter Horse .
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
i didnt even think about the cushions disease . someone else had mentioned about that they noticed one night on how he was standing made them think he had cushions . i was so focused on epm i think to have him checked for that . thanks for the suggestions when i get him back from my friend ill have him hauled back to my vet and have him checked out for that . right now he is being boarded as we are currently in the process of repairing our fence and barn.
he also drinks a ton of water and at one point had diarrhea, he has a lot of health issues . and i know im not being paranoid. especially when other people have picked up on the same stuff that i have been seeing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
oh, that IS troubling. has he been really carefully checked by a good vet?

sorry, I just read the additional posts. I am very scared of horses tripping and me being rolled onto. I have gone down HARD at the canter, twice, off a tripping horse. I am still worried about that particular danger.
I would not ride him, at all.
the only thing the vet has done with him so far is the profile health blood test that's how we knew his kidneys was very elevated. they tried to do the lameness exam with him but he had a hard time breathing that day and would end up coughing as that was back at the end of summer when he had issues with heaves. he suggested doing the blood test first which we did got that fixed and took him back and his kidneys seem fine now and now that its winter he is breathing easier now and no longer coughing .
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
On the bright side, if he tests positive for PPID, at least there is a medicine to treat it.
this is true . i just talked to my friend that has him at her stables her reply was he doesn't have cushions ...i still feel that if he is stumbling a lot that i need to have him hauled to the vet and get him tested to be sure . better be safe then sorry .
 

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Well this is interesting, for lack of a better word. One older horse here has cushings when I talked to the girl that grew up on him she actually urged the owner (a good friend of hers and like family) to get tested for cushions because over time he forgot how to canter and was completely disconnected in all gaits - sluggish and not with it, were also her words. Normally when I've seen cushings its the other other typical symptoms y'know like their hair, the fatty bits and the urine//thirst. Laminitis etc. Turns out his levels were so high he shouldn't have been standing, according the vet. Owner said the same when I talked about it with her. I had no idea how advanced cases could affect them like this... She said after they started the meds he went back to his normal self and I got taken on an involuntary gallop alongside him a few months ago and he looked good when out to my eye and since. It could be something else ofc - mechanical, neurological etc..

You need to get to the bottom of it somehow just not safe.

It worries me when vets tell me somethings not necessary when I'm willing to throw money at them for peace of mind :< Hope you figure it out and resolve it!
 

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I don’t have any information but I’ll follow this three because jake trips in all gaits.
Yes, poor bloke also has some probs, and I think I've already suggested you don't ride him if he's doing this. As Rambo has said, it's dangerous for the rider too.
 

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this is true . i just talked to my friend that has him at her stables her reply was he doesn't have cushions ...i still feel that if he is stumbling a lot that i need to have him hauled to the vet and get him tested to be sure . better be safe then sorry .
There is no way to confirm Cushing's based on symptoms alone - a horse can be barely symptomatic and have his blood test levels come back through the roof. It's a simple, and usually pretty cheap test compared to many other tests at a vet. You can have an ACTH to confirm Cushing's - if this test is negative, I encourage you to have the TRH test done, it is more sensitive of a test for Cushing's.
 
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