[horseluvr2524]

I need to stay far away from places like craigslist. People have got me so seriously depressed.

It is incredible to me the number of people that take on a responsibility and then don't stick with it and see it through. Speaking specifically on animals here. The place is flooded with ads from "breeders" who "must rehome ASAP!" Well, if you weren't prepared to be stuck the the pups/kittens for the long haul, you shouldn't have let fluffy and ducky procreate!

Then there are all these ads from people who are rehoming a pup typically under 2 years old. "I have young kids" "I don't have the time for them anymore" "I'm not ready for a new cat/dog" etc. etc. If they would think before taking on the responsibility of a new family member... My heart just breaks at the sheer number of these cases I saw in a mere twenty minutes browsing the internet.

I wish that people would stop letting fluffy and ducky have cute little babies, so that the real breeders can do their job of improving and keeping a breed alive rather than worrying about so many homeless animals. And I wish that these people would think before taking on such a responsibility! Got a new job and have far less time? Well great. Look for alternative routes to keeping your dependent happy, rather than tossing them off into the unknown with a "new loving home".

It's bad enough now that the local CITY animal shelters are posting ads practically begging people to come pick these animals up, free spay/neuter and vaccinations, no adoption fee. It's that bad!

Then people like me who keep several animals get flack for it from some. "How can you keep so many and devote the time that they deserve?" Well, I don't spend hours every single day with each individual animal, but they all receive the highest level of care that I can provide (which is far above standard!), and have it a lot better than the animals out on the streets, in the shelters, and in an ad on craigslist. At least I stick with my responsibilities and commitments.

I don't like seeing all these homeless animals. I also don't like seeing ethical breeders practically driven out of business, because we are going to lose a lot of beautiful and individual breeds if that ever happens. I just wish people would take responsibility seriously.

(P.S. I am NOT attacking those who have rehomed a pet for extenuating circumstances. I am just frustrated with those people who go out and get an animal without thinking it through, then get bored of it, or can't afford it, or whatever, and dump it off within a year.)

 

[Kaiit]

I get that. I can't comprehend how someone can give a life such little value. One of the reasons I left my petshop job was because I couldn't stand selling animals to people who sounded as though they were going to get bored of it after a few months. That's really judgemental, I know, and I can only hope that I was seriously wrong about some of the people. But so many pets just end up given up, dumped or forgotten. The animals all came from dodgey breeders anyway and we'd have a freezer full of the ones that mysteriously died. It was heartbreaking. Pet shops directly contribute to backyard breeding and full animal shelters.

I don't understand why people think animals are a play thing for children as well. It seems to be accepted in our society that children should have pets like hamsters, rabbits, fish, even puppies (?!) and it's okay to treat them like a toy and then get rid of them when the child is bored or bitten. Adults are embarrassed to admit when they want a pet hamster or rabbit because it's a "children's pet" and I'd have people bringing along their children so they'd have an excuse to buy a hamster.

I could rant for paragraphs about this topic!

 

[loosie]

Good for you Kaiit in speaking against the petshop trade. People just dont think about where those animals come from & the business theyre actually supporting buying from there.

Of course there are good pet shops, but it seems far from norm. Most of them here stopped selling dogs & cats when 'puppy farms' & the likes were made illegal & gradually discovered & shut down. Aside from birds & fish & guinea pigs. i hate seeing parrots caged & siamese fighting fish in 4' square 'tanks'... & guineas sold to parents of little kids who dont take responsibility for the animals wellbeing when the child 'plays with it'...

Ive been asked many times why i dont become a breeder, or run a kids petting zoo if i love working with animals... The answer is BECAUSE i love & respect animals - & value all life - that id be a broke breeder, refusing to sell animals to most. And id probably end up assaulting - or be assaulted by - parents if i had to work at a petting zoo! The amount of little animals those places go thru... :-(

 

[PoptartShop]

I hear you. One of these girls I went to school with, she has a new pet every month, then gets rid of it...like why? Why keep getting pets if you're just gonna get rid of them? It's really ridiculous.
Some people just don't think of pets as family either, and it's easy for them to part with them. Not everyone feels that way of course, but some do. Like oh, it's just a dog...here take it.

 

[horseylover1_1]

It's extremely depressing. I know of someone who released their poor guinea pigs out in the "wild" because they were tired of taking care of them. I was livid. Poor babies will end up being eaten by another animal in a matter of hours. (Which I suppose is better than starving or freezing to death)

My biggest pet peeve is the people who breed animals that have no business being bred. They get these Heinz 57 dogs that nobody wants that have so many health issues they really should be put down, yet they just keep breeding them because they love puppies! I have nothing against mutts whatsoever but I do have a big issue with breeding dogs that are going to end up on the streets or euthanized. Purebred or not.

 

[k9kenai]

Having worked in rescue for over a decade I wake up sometimes and ask myself why I still do it sometimes. But then I remember I don't do it for the people, but for the animals. And that gives me hope again.

I've realized that you can't ever change the people who just don't understand what they are doing is wrong. They turn a blind eye to statistics and to health problems and to basic biology and genetics. The backyard breeders (dogs, cats, AND horses) have created unhealthy genetics and because there is no regulation it is left unchecked. The good breeders are struggling to keep their healthy lines going and thriving. The breeding of "designer dogs" like labradoodles and other mixed breed dogs has contributed to a mass influx of poorly bred dogs with bad temperaments and serious health problems just to meet demand.

The other side of the spectrum is so called private rescue groups that take an no-nonsense stance on adopting out animals and make it impossible and outrageously expensive for good people to adopt good animals. I'm sorry, but a dog does not need to go to doggie daycare five days a week to be a happy and well taken care of dog. These ridiculous standards have forced people to stray from legitimate, GOOD rescue groups and shelters altogether and they have taken to places like Craigslist where instead of talking to qualified adoptions specialists who can help guide them to an individual animal that may best suit their needs, they instead pick out an animal more on a "spur of the moment" thing and then quickly realize that this animal is NOT for them and their only option is to dump it at the shelter. This becomes a cycle because it is easy to pick up free or low cost animals on Craigslist from the comfort of your own home without having to go through the arduous process of driving to a shelter or rescue group and being asked questions about your lifestyle to find the perfect fit for you, and potentially being denied an animal for whatever reason.

I am not against certain processes to weed out individuals who should in no way, shape, or form have an animal. I support home visits from private rescue groups who have animals with behavioral problems, health problems, etc. But I think every adoption case should be looked at on a case-by-case basis. The owner doesn't have a fenced yard...but they live on 100+ acres of rural country farm surrounded by national forest and are home 24/7 with their dogs. I would probably adopt to them. The owner has young children but they are experienced dog owners. I would probably adopt to them. The owner has cats but are experienced dog owners...I would probably adopt to them! You get the idea. I see SO MANY rescue groups turn down GOOD HOMES because of ridiculous criteria. I have been there. I am a professional dog trainer who has worked in rescue for years and yet because I have cats (and apparently German Shepherds do not get along with cats EVER) a German Shepherd rescue group turned me down (I literally had references from ANOTHER RESCUE GROUP). I can really understand the frustration of people who resort to Craigslist or backyard breeders when they hit dead end after dead end with rescue groups. And public shelters do not always have the animals they are looking for.

I think if more rescue groups and shelters looked at things on a case-by-case basis and there was more regulation and education regarding what a good breeder is/does versus what a bad breeder is/does then we would see less Craigslist dump cases and the like. Plus more spay/neuter education and support, training resources, and just general community education about humane education for animals in general. When I worked as an animal control officer I was AMAZED at the lack of education. People just simply DON'T KNOW about good care sometimes.

 

[blue eyed pony]

I don't know how people can get a dog and then get rid of it a month or two later (or less in some cases!).

If I get a dog, I have that dog until it dies or has to be put to sleep for quality of life issues. I had my Border Collie mix (a rescue) for 13 and a half years. I was five years old when I got her. Granted, the actual responsibility for the animal falls to the parents when the "owner" is that young, but I committed a huge part of my heart to that dog, and when the day came that I had to lay her to rest, it was the hardest day of my life.

I've had my rescue mutt for very nearly 9 years now. Got her 08/08/08. She's staying with me for her "forever". I like puppies, but there's nothing like the love of an old dog. And while a dog is only with you for a small part of your life, to that dog you are their WHOLE life. You're some kind of wonderful, immortal god of food, scratches and walks, and they love you more purely and more completely than any human is capable of. Why would anyone just throw that away? People like that must be fundamentally broken in some way.

 

[Getting Rich in Vegas]

After we lost our old Shep/Lab mix at 14, we waited for more than a year before we felt ready for another dog. I got so frustrated with rescues it wasn't funny. They practically want you to fill out a mortgage app (being funny) to apply for a dog, never mind the pages, and pages of other info. I understand that they are being cautious, and we never had a problem with them coming to our house, but I stopped short with all this other info that had to be completed on the internet. I got so discouraged we stopped looking. One day happened to look on Craig's list and found our Miss Sadie another Lab mix who we got at 1 year old and is now 4 and we love her to pieces. Funny the old owners were adamant about coming to see her, which we agreed to, however they have never even called to do that ! Their total loss...with some training she has turned into the best dog ever!

 

[blue eyed pony]

They practically want you to fill out a mortgage app

I know you're joking but you're actually spot on with that. My mother adopted her greyhound through a breed specific rescue and it was such a hugely complicated process! It wasn't so bad for my grandma (same rescue) but she had mum to vouch for her, so they excused almost half the process.

 

[bsms]

I tried to adopt a Border Collie from a rescue. I was told he was "too high energy" for me. I probably ruined my chances when I pointed out the expert rescuer kept him in a cage 23 hours a day, and ANY Border Collie who was only free 60 minutes a day would be high energy. But if I hadn't already ruined my chances, they went in the toilet when I mentioned I had kids. A 10 year old.

"Border Collies are dangerous around kids. NO Border Collie should EVER be mixed with kids!"

Yeah...right. My youngest, many years before she took up riding horses.

Same dog, a blue merle BC from a farm in England, with my son:

Anyways, I wasn't allowed to adopt. A little while later, I saw a name of a guy who had Border Collies and an email address. I emailed him, explaining the situation, that the dog above had died a year before, and asked if he could help. To my surprise, he contacted me and gave me a contact for a breeding. He had a dog from the same breeding and said the dog was as good with kids as with sheep.

A few months later, the puppy arrived. A couple of years after that, I saw the guy's name again. He had won two national titles in the sheepdog trials, in the open category! Made me happy because he was super nice to me.

And 9 years later, my son & his family has moved in with us for a while, and the same Border Collie is teaching the 4 & 7 year olds about...dogs. He adores them. They adore him and his young GSD companion. He has problems with thunder ("The Sky Dogs are growling at me!") - so the kids sit by him and promise to protect him. He's given up sleeping by my bed and sleeps next to the kids. They NEED him. He knows. But...Border Collies and kids cannot be mixed!

I also looked at adopting a horse once. My horses live in a dry lot corral. I was told that wasn't good enough. Oh well.

I do get depressed by how many people treat animals. They often seem to care more about their I-Phone than their dogs, horses, cats, kids. I'm bothered more by what I see in the horse world than with dogs, but maybe that is because I don't live near the bad dog owners. Goodness knows, what people do to dogs in the name of shows is enough to depress anyone! How can someone claim to love dogs, but breed dogs who cannot breath, walk, etc? And then there are the people who breed mean dogs in the name of breeding guard dogs...

So when you get right down to it...what people do to animals IS depressing!

 

[k9kenai]

I was looking at Old English Bulldog rescues just for the heck of it on Petfinder one day and I found one poor dog that needed some MAJOR surgery done to fix a cleft palate, nasal passages, and cherry eye in both eyes, plus a multitude of other health problems. I don't know how this guy was even able to see, eat, OR smell. I went to the "rescue" page and they wanted $5000 for this dog because he was a purebred (albeit a poorly bred purebred) and would NOT cover his surgery. These surgeries could run anywhere from $4,000 to upwards of $10,000 if there are complications. They said they did not have the money to cover his surgery costs. So instead of dropping the adoption fee they kept this poor guy for months upon months in this state because most adopters are not looking to spend that kind of money on an adoption fee, let alone having to pay surgery costs on top of that fee. I have no idea what became of that dog. I hope another rescue group stepped in and took him from this so called "rescue" group.

In my own area, we have one privately owned and run humane society (we have no public shelters) but it is open access. They euthanize approx. 75 cats and 45 dogs a month, for a county of about 35,000 people. They received an owner surrender of a blind and deaf (courtesy of the double merle gene) Aussie mix. I contacted a national organization that works with rescue groups and transports all across the nation to locate a home for this dog. We found one within a week AND found transport. They contacted the shelter here...to which our shelter said they do not need to work with outside resources because they are managing just fine. What!? That was almost six months ago. Guess where that dog is? Still sitting in our shelter. It astounds me sometimes that those who work in rescue play the "God Complex" and instead of doing what's right for the animal they would rather keep that dog because she is "good publicity" for the shelter in that they are helping special needs dogs (they won't euthanize her for this reason either). The national organization and every single other shelter/group they work with will no longer support nor endorse our shelter now (and neither will I) due to this incident.

I know we have the 501(c)3 listing and a lot of people assume this means that makes a rescue or group legitimate, but it really doesn't take much to get that designation. Our state does pretty good oversight on the horse rescues and all of ours are pretty decent. It's actually easier to adopt a horse from a rescue group here then it is to adopt a cat or a dog most of the time. The major rescue groups here that receive the most "screen time" and acknowledgement from the community don't have all of the requirements and "mortgage applications" because I think they know they will never get a dog or cat out the door if they do that, which means they won't be able to save as many. The groups that require you to sign over your soul and your firstborn child are the ones that usually end up going under or wind up being charged with animal cruelty or as hoarding cases later on because they keep saving animals and never get them out the door because nobody lives up to their standards.

 

[Avna]

This is the kind of thread that makes me want to go ride my horse.

Except for the fact that I just did and now it's too hot to ride, I would go and do just that. Because nothing fixes this stuff. Like the saying goes, the more I see of people the better I like my dog.

 

[GMA100]

It makes me sad to see the posts on CL for all the pups and young dogs. Just because "I have kids and can't care for them" or "it doesn't fit into my work schedule" Uggghhhh It makes me mad! especially when I see a Border collie that is for free because it's to hyper! Well, if you didn't keep it locked up all day, then it wouldn't be hyper!! The amount of Pit Bulls that are in shelters, for free, or roaming around is sickening!

I tried to adopt a Border Collie from a rescue. I was told he was "too high energy" for me. I probably ruined my chances when I pointed out the expert rescuer kept him in a cage 23 hours a day, and ANY Border Collie who was only free 60 minutes a day would be high energy. But if I hadn't already ruined my chances, they went in the toilet when I mentioned I had kids. A 10 year old.

"Border Collies are dangerous around kids. NO Border Collie should EVER be mixed with kids!"

Yeah...right. My youngest, many years before she took up riding horses.

Same dog, a blue merle BC from a farm in England, with my son:

Anyways, I wasn't allowed to adopt. A little while later, I saw a name of a guy who had Border Collies and an email address. I emailed him, explaining the situation, that the dog above had died a year before, and asked if he could help. To my surprise, he contacted me and gave me a contact for a breeding. He had a dog from the same breeding and said the dog was as good with kids as with sheep.

A few months later, the puppy arrived. A couple of years after that, I saw the guy's name again. He had won two national titles in the sheepdog trials, in the open category! Made me happy because he was super nice to me.

And 9 years later, my son & his family has moved in with us for a while, and the same Border Collie is teaching the 4 & 7 year olds about...dogs. He adores them. They adore him and his young GSD companion. He has problems with thunder ("The Sky Dogs are growling at me!") - so the kids sit by him and promise to protect him. He's given up sleeping by my bed and sleeps next to the kids. They NEED him. He knows. But...Border Collies and kids cannot be mixed!

I also looked at adopting a horse once. My horses live in a dry lot corral. I was told that wasn't good enough. Oh well.

I do get depressed by how many people treat animals. They often seem to care more about their I-Phone than their dogs, horses, cats, kids. I'm bothered more by what I see in the horse world than with dogs, but maybe that is because I don't live near the bad dog owners. Goodness knows, what people do to dogs in the name of shows is enough to depress anyone! How can someone claim to love dogs, but breed dogs who cannot breath, walk, etc? And then there are the people who breed mean dogs in the name of breeding guard dogs...

So when you get right down to it...what people do to animals IS depressing!

I HATE when people say BCs aren't good with kids! Ours get worried if they hear a kid scream and have to go check it out!

 

[blue eyed pony]

My BC was BRILLIANT with me (and she was BC/Rott so not mixed with anything one would think was particularly great with kids) and I was a really difficult little toerag. She tolerated crazy amounts of my hands in her mouth, in her ears, playing with her paws, pulling her tail... and yes, mum tried to stop me from doing all that, but the dog still needed to be extremely tolerant because what parent is able to watch their child every second of every day?

 

[horseluvr2524]

I'm not against people posting on CL. I've gotten a lot of my animals from CL actually, most of which were rehomes. My mother's cat we got as a rehome at ten years old, she is 16 now and doing better than when we got her. I did get one lovebird from a breeder six years ago, and he is still with me and is the most awesome little birdie ever.

What makes me very sad is just the sheer number of people rehoming their animals because they've got young kids (come on, you had the kids BEFORE you got the animal), they don't have time for the animal in their life anymore, etc.

I am very much a 'bird person' in addition to being a horse person. I love birds, especially raptors and parrots. For years and years I have wanted a macaw. Sometimes I look around just to see what's out there. I looked at our local bird rescue, and found the adoption application to be beyond ridiculous. They wanted to know if you were married, what you did for a living, what your spouse did for a living, who lives with you, do they have bird experience, do you own or rent or live with family, how many animals do you have, are you prepared for a multitude of in home visits, etc. It was so overwhelming I didn't even finish reading through it, and I decided that I would rather once again adopt from a private owner via word of mouth or CL than from them! When I went to their 'adopted birds' page... the rescue has been running ten years and has only adopted out six birds. Meanwhile, they have hundreds that they are having to care for and find volunteers to help. I actually don't know how they keep it going.

I also very much dislike the tendency of 'animal advocates' and 'rescues' attacking people who wish to own a specific purebred dog. For myself, I either want a Black Russian Terrier or a Briard (someday). I have very specific reasons for wanting such a dog. And due to the protective nature (especially BRT) of these dogs, I don't want a rescue, I want a pup that I can raise and know it doesn't have a bunch of baggage to mix with its protective instincts, creating a dangerous and volatile dog.

Seems like people don't like you if you sit in the middle. You either have to be a full fledged 'rescuer' and HATE breeders, or you have to be a breeder and hate rescues (just my experience from the past few years).

 

[horseylover1_1]

@k9kenai That is an excellent point. (Regarding that rescue groups sometimes are too strict with their adoption procedures...)

I once wanted to adopt a Sheltie. I did a LOT of research on the breed, and determined it was the right fit for me. I lived in a rural area surrounded by fields and trees. Dog heaven. I reached out to a local sheltie rescue. They went as far as to doing a home visit and brought their pet sheltie w/ them. My home was absolutely immaculate when they visited and they told me their dog really liked me which was unusual because the dog was usually leery of strangers. That particular dog wasn't up for adoption but they wanted to see how interacted with him... anyway, the visit went about as well as it could have. But I never heard back from them and when I followed up later the only thing that they could determine was that I must have been denied because I didn't have a fenced in yard!

So I bought a Sheltie off Craigslist (from a good breeder). Granted, Shelties in our area are not common and if one ends up in a shelter it will be adopted in less than 24 hours. They are in pretty high demand. Nonetheless, the principle applies.

 

[loosie]

Hmm, so many 'rescue' people often have a lot to answer for I feel. They often 'rescue' animals for the ego trip IMO - are very quick to tell how many animals they've rescued & saved from what sort of abuse or neglect. Are often broke & unable to provide more than bare essentials for the animals, but believe that because it's better than they got at the last place, that's good enough. Many have no qualms about taking on more animals than they can even provide basic care for, then begging for money from others. And on top of all of that, they won't let animals go to a new home without passing the 'Spanish Inquisition'. Of course, there are GREAT rescuers out there too, and I do think people should have to pass a small 'inquisition' before being deemed suitable owner material, but...

Border collies... one of my previous dogs was BC/Kelpie. Not the best breed for a family dog. Had also shown some fear aggression of kids in the past. So I thought I really had my work cut out for me when my first baby came along. I definitely took nothing for granted & had to 'referee' some minor matters when the dog thought she had the right to 'discipline' the child, when I wasn't quite careful enough, but she & my daughters were definitely a team & she was a brilliant & patient family dog.

My parents in law told me they were going to adopt a dog, and asked me what type I advised, said they were thinking of 'rescuing' a BC. They were an older couple, they didn't have much knowledge of training or desire to go to classes, they weren't into long hikes or bikerides, and they had told me they didn't feel safe ever letting a dog off lead outside the small yard... So I told them a BC was definitely NOT the sort of dog I'd advise. So they brought home a 2yo BC that had had virtually no training in the past & had lived on a chain in someone's yard. They didn't chain her(except walking on a tight choke chain!), but had to build up their fences to keep her there. They allowed her inside, but only for short times(she wasn't housebroken) & when there were no visitors. They took her out once a day for a short walk on lead. When the young grandkids came over & she cowered from them. They frequently asked my advice(I was training dogs as a job at the time) & I repeatedly told them she needed training, exercise, stimulation & offered to help them. There were always excuses though, that they'd love my help but not right now... I tried to advise about getting her comfortable with kids, but they flat out refused to let the kids anywhere near the dog(which I would of course have been VERY careful about how to introduce too). My MIL was beside herself when the dog still hadn't 'grown up & calmed down' by 4yo.

At one stage, this untrained, unsocialised, understimulated, underexercised dog was about to bolt onto the road as someone left the gate open, I grabbed her and she turned and bit me. Softly actually, & I didn't blame her - she did it in fear & surprise at me grabbing her roughly & suddenly & after all, she'd never been taught not to. My MIL had her put down the next day as a dangerous dog! She wouldn't hear of rehoming her. Called it 'euthanasia' & I said don't dare call it that - euthanasia was not killing something to put it out of *someone else's* misery. I couldn't bring myself to talk to the woman at all for a few months after that. She still goes on about how much she loved the dog & 'rescued' her...

 

[Kaiit]

I was looking at Old English Bulldog rescues just for the heck of it on Petfinder one day and I found one poor dog that needed some MAJOR surgery done to fix a cleft palate, nasal passages, and cherry eye in both eyes, plus a multitude of other health problems. I don't know how this guy was even able to see, eat, OR smell. I went to the "rescue" page and they wanted $5000 for this dog because he was a purebred (albeit a poorly bred purebred) and would NOT cover his surgery. These surgeries could run anywhere from $4,000 to upwards of $10,000 if there are complications. They said they did not have the money to cover his surgery costs. So instead of dropping the adoption fee they kept this poor guy for months upon months in this state because most adopters are not looking to spend that kind of money on an adoption fee, let alone having to pay surgery costs on top of that fee. I have no idea what became of that dog. I hope another rescue group stepped in and took him from this so called "rescue" group.

English bulldogs are some of the worst bred animals today, imo. There are so many of them around here, maybe because it's a national breed? But their popularity means that not only are they badly bred by show breeders, they suffer from a lot of backyard breeding as well. It really saddens me to see them, snuffling and grunting, finding it hard to breathe just walking around. And the owners think it's perfectly acceptable for a dog to be unable to exercise due to it's anatomy. Just think of all the joys of being a dog they have to miss out on.

I have also seen a rise in the olde English bulldogs here, which are much more like their ancient working ancestors. Less of a deformed face and they can actually breathe, they don't have the skeletomuscular problems that the show standard suffer with.

Hmm, so many 'rescue' people often have a lot to answer for I feel. They often 'rescue' animals for the ego trip IMO - are very quick to tell how many animals they've rescued & saved from what sort of abuse or neglect. Are often broke & unable to provide more than bare essentials for the animals, but believe that because it's better than they got at the last place, that's good enough. Many have no qualms about taking on more animals than they can even provide basic care for, then begging for money from others. And on top of all of that, they won't let animals go to a new home without passing the 'Spanish Inquisition'. Of course, there are GREAT rescuers out there too, and I do think people should have to pass a small 'inquisition' before being deemed suitable owner material, but...

I totally agree with the ego trip thing! I've known a lot of people working in rescue and many of them use it as a bragging right. I've known people who have had their animals removed by another rescue because they were so wrapped up with the status it gave them over the actual animal's welfare. And jeez, don't try and question their practise... Many of them definitely have this "holier than thou" air about them because they rescue animals.

 

[Horsef]

I don't even have to go online, just step out of my door. We have so many abandoned dogs on the streets, it's heartbreaking. I cannot help them all. I get very depressed on a daily basis and I can't find a solution other than moving to more civilized country.

At least you guys have rescues. Your breeders don't seem to dump them in sacks into rivers or garbage bins. I'm not kidding, and it's not a once-off - it seems to be top two preferred methods of getting rid of unwanted puppies. Horrible, horrible people.

General population does it too. Spaying and neutering is generally seen as unhealthy and unnecessary so when their bitch is covered by whichever dog passed by, they take new-born puppies and throw them away. if the owner has kids or grandkids, they'll allow the bitch to raise the puppies to about two months old, all the while allowing the children to handle them however roughly they want and then throw them out.

It's a poor country and I do understand that there just isn't enough money to go around even for people, never mind poor abused animals.

Terrible, terrible suffering for the animals. I have no idea how to solve this and it's is having a very big negative influence on my life. I can't even go and volunteer at a rescue - I get overwhelmed at the conditions in rescues and the sheer numbers of dogs in dire condition we had to turn away for lack of space and funds.

 

[loosie]

Oh. I don't know what to say to you Horsef - must be awful to have to experience that without help, bad enough to hear about it & see occasional cruelty here... wish there was an answer... They have very recently (supposedly, to some degree at least...) stopped the trade of dogmeat in Vietnam, so if that's successful, anything's possible I suppose.

I have also seen a rise in the olde English bulldogs here, which are much more like their ancient working ancestors. Less of a deformed face and they can actually breathe, they don't have the skeletomuscular problems that the show standard suffer with.

That's a nice change! Lets hope. How's how different many of these 'modern' dogs look compared to their breed standards of centuries ago?? They started off as mostly *healthy* working dogs & have gradually been 'refined'... if only the 'showies' placed as much importance on health & soundness.