[HorseJumpingIsMyLife]

My Horse really needs a martingale according to my riding instructer but she won't tell me WHICH one!??!?! Crazy, i know. -BUT she did say it was either a running martingale or a standing martingale. Apparently she wants me to figure out which one i need. My Horse throws his head alot and resists the bit, he puts his head down, trying to pull the reins out of my hands. I Checked his bridle and bit and the saddle but nothing is pinching him or putting pressure on him!? i also checked his hooves and there wasn't anything there. He has no sores on his face or his withers/back so im thinking its just cause he's a fat lazy boy I read that running martingales are for head throwing and stuff like that but im not sure which one to get. they both have variable things my horse does.... any advice??? Thanks

 

[kevinshorses]

Get a trainer. You need to address the issue that your horse has with you. You probably aren't giving him the release he needs. Find an instructor that will teach you to RIDE and not just sit on your horses back and torment him. Your horse isn't getting a good signal from you and you need to clear that up or it will just get worse. If you go to a martingale (either one) then another problem will pop up and your instructor will want you to change bits or use a caveson or some other stop gap measure. If you want to be on the track to become a horseman now is the time to start.

 

[HorseJumpingIsMyLife]

Uhh, excuse me but I KNOW how to ride thank you very much. My Horse was abused and he is very skiddish some times and we are working out all his kinks. I Did NOT ask for you critique i asked WHICH martingale works for this. I can w/t/c/g and jump up to 3.5 feet with out using my hands. So dont you DARE say i can't ride. You've NEVER seen me ride, My horse loves me very much he isnt being TORMENTED, Got it?

 

[Allison Finch]

I agree, you should find an answer to the symptoms your horse is showing. I have used running martingales (standing are illegal in eventing), BUT I rarely need them. Resistance should be addressed with flat work and more careful jumping, IMO.

Hopefully, your trainer has the ability to teach you through this problem.

If you MUST have a martingale, make sure it is adjusted properly and not so tight it effectively becomes a tie-down. I prefer running as they don't encourage a horse to lean into them (aggravating the original problem).

 

[HorseJumpingIsMyLife]

Thank you!!!
My Horse responds well to martingales, I've been trying some out. I just needed to know someone elses ADVICE not critical opinions I Tried loosening the bit too and that seemed to help but it also kept me from being able to control his head.... so im working with him to try and solve this problem.

 

[maura]

Both types of martingales aim to address resistance by keeping the horse's head and neck in a position where the bit and your aids are more effective.

The standing martingale really just keeps the horse from raising his head above certain height to avoid the bit. However, smart and lazy horses learn to lean or balance themselves on the martingale. I use them rarely and for a short term, rather than long term fix.

Running martingales are more versatile. When adjusted correctly, they put downward pressure on the bars of the horses's mouth when he raises his head above a certain level and release that pressure when the horse drops his head. So used in moderation they can be an effective tool.

One big caveat - I almost *never* see them adjusted correctly. Too loose, they're ineffectual, and too tight, they put constant pressure on the bars of the horses mouth, which is contrary to good training and really abusive. If you use one, make sure someone who knows what they're doing adjusts it, and evaluate the adjustment each time you ride with it.

 

[Alwaysbehind]

You need a new instructor. I am not anti martingale but I have a hard time with an instructor that says 'you need a new piece of equipment but you pick which one'. Is that not what you play your instructor/trainer to help you with?

I will not guess if your horse has a medical reason or simply a bad learned behavior but I would think a good instructor/trainer would be able to figure this out with you and not send you on a wild goose chase asking people on the internet what type of martingale to buy.

 

[Nutty Saddler]

If you like showjumping then use a running martingale -

To muddy the issue a bit - a Market Harborough ( or German martingale ) is a really usefull training aid - when fitted and used properly. - I know many people dislike them but I find them to be one of the best, when fitted properly they enable a horse to learn as they only work when the horse is being evasive.

 

[mls]

Uhh, excuse me but I KNOW how to ride thank you very much. My Horse was abused and he is very skiddish some times and we are working out all his kinks. I Did NOT ask for you critique i asked WHICH martingale works for this. I can w/t/c/g and jump up to 3.5 feet with out using my hands. So dont you DARE say i can't ride. You've NEVER seen me ride, My horse loves me very much he isnt being TORMENTED, Got it?

Ah - yes you did. Since you are apparently paying someone to supposedly teach you - yet they are not doing a complete job - you felt the need to ask your question to complete strangers who are unaware of the whole situation.

I agree that gadgets can be shortcuts. If I put a brace on your back to ensure you sat correctly in your saddle - is that teaching - or torment? Of course you can say - Gee this hurts. Your horse cannot.

As one of the other posters said - you probably need a new instructor.

 

[equineeventer3390]

I would definately go with a running martingale. I personally hate standing martingales and they're actually illegal in eventing. Theyre too restricting and i've seen horses flip over because of them. Running martingales are much more forgiving and can be as lose or tight as you want them depending on your rein length.

 

[sillybunny11486]

I think her instructor wanted her to do a little research. Nothing wrong with that. I would have her help you pick on out. Tell her what you learned and that you are a little confused. Yes you pay the instructor to help you, but letting the instructor do everything for the rider can also be harmful. I'd rather have someone help me get there, not tell me every single step I need to take along the way.

 

[HeartMyOTTB]

I use a Standing with my horse. I use it, as someone said above, to keep his head below a certain level. Also, I like that in the event of a spook or a slip, I know Im not going to get my faced whacked and end up with a bloody nose... I have seen it happen. To professionals even.

I ride a friends horse from time to time, and she uses a Running. I LOVE the head set it puts him in, but I feel that it "puts" him there, not because I asked for it. And sometimes he'll break at the 3rd and not at the poll.

So I would start with the Standing. I think you will see results from that. As your tack shop what their return policy is, clean it up, and get a running if your trainer suggests. My trainer can be vague sometimes, maybe since she assumed you would be using them for the same purpose, she gave the preference to you. I am not always that assertive to ask my trainer what she means, looks like we have that in common.

Ah - yes you did. Since you are apparently paying someone to supposedly teach you - yet they are not doing a complete job - you felt the need to ask your question to complete strangers who are unaware of the whole situation.

I agree that gadgets can be shortcuts. If I put a brace on your back to ensure you sat correctly in your saddle - is that teaching - or torment? Of course you can say - Gee this hurts. Your horse cannot.

As one of the other posters said - you probably need a new instructor.

As for the above comment, I dont think you asked for a critique at all. Isn't that the point of horseforum? To seek advice from fellow riders and horse people? I wouldn't go as far as to say we are total strangers in the aspect that someone out there may have encountered a similar problem. Yeah, the training section and the critique section are the most popular in the way or responses, sometimes I feel it hard to get an answer out of a straight question. But thats why we are here, to learn and read. And I hope that you, JumpinigIsMyLife, got something out of your post.

Good Luck!!

 

[Alwaysbehind]

Running martingales are much more forgiving and can be as lose or tight as you want them depending on your rein length.

Um, standing martingales are adjustable also.

(Not saying the OP needs one, just stating a fact.)

As for the above comment, I dont think you asked for a critique at all. Isn't that the point of horseforum? To seek advice from fellow riders and horse people? I wouldn't go as far as to say we are total strangers in the aspect that someone out there may have encountered a similar problem. Yeah, the training section and the critique section are the most popular in the way or responses, sometimes I feel it hard to get an answer out of a straight question. But thats why we are here, to learn and read. And I hope that you, JumpinigIsMyLife, got something out of your post.

But the question asked can not really be answered with out LOTS more knowledge of the OP.

It is like someone posting what brand of saddle should they get when they test rode in two. No one here saw them ride in them so no one here and tell them which they rode best in, etc.



Sillybunny I think if the trainer wanted the OP to learn something then the trainer should have asked the OP some questions and had a conversation with them about picking the right martingale and why one might be better fit for what they need to do. Not send the OP off on a wild goose chase.

 

[Allison Finch]

Heartmy,

If your friends running martingale causes her horse to "break behind the poll" it is adjusted VERY incorrectly. The rings should almost touch the glottis area of the throat when the horses head is in the normal position. It should only engage when the horses head is way up. It is not meant to "hold" a horse in the normal position.

 

[HeartMyOTTB]

Thanks Allison, it seemed short to me in comparison to where my standing leaves my horse. But I figured she had it like that for a reason. Now, could him breaking behind the poll be him behind the bit? Or evading the bit, whatever, and not the martingale?

 

[Allison Finch]

Sure it can. If his head is in the "normal" position, the running martingale (or standing, for that matter) should be very slack.

Going behind the vertical is a whole other matter.

 

[Kayty]

Gadgets gadgets gadgets. They're so popular now. I find it a bit sad that alot of coaches are now running off to find the nearest gadget to strap a head down and make a kid think their horse is 'on the bit'.
Sorry but I am 100% with kevinshorses on this. No you did not specifically ask for a 'critique' but this is in now way shape or form a critique as we have not seen you on the horse.
Generally, if I horse is throwing it's head up and down and hauling on the reins, unless he is sore, there's going to be an issue with the rider. Horses continuously throw new obstacles at their riders to try and escape pressure here there and everywhere, but you need to be a skilled enough rider to work a horse through these issues, without relying permanently on a 'gadget' to get you there. Sure everyone has to learn, but I don't think using gadgets for every issue is going to teach anyone much at all, what happened to putting in hard work and learning how to drive the hind end up to meet the hands to create a beautifull, soft relaxed horse? If your trainer is so set on you getting a martingale to fix the problem, I'd quit turning a blind eye and find someone who actually knows how to correct an issue such as this one, without having to use straps to hold the horses head down.
You can pull a horses head down, and that issue may be resolved, but the next one will surface quickly. If you rely on gadgets for every problem that arises, you may as well put your horse in a straight jacket, strap wheels to his hooves and get someone to tow him along while you enjoy riding a horse with a 'nice headset'.
Your comment that you love how a martingale gives your friend's horse a nice headset just proves that you are not aware of the concept of riding 'back to front', you are under the impression that a pretty, tucked in head is 'on the bit' or 'collected'. So SO not the case.

You don't need to take anyone's advice here. And I know you're probably going to go off like you did with Kevinshorses, but i think what needs to happen is that people on this forum need to stop thinking that they know everything there is to know and that if their horse isn't working exactly how they want it to, then OBVIOUSLY the horse is just being naughty. Get someone more experienced to ride your horse for a while and see what happens? If they know how to ride to a reasonable level of dressage/flatwork, they'll be able to combat the head movement by driving the hind legs under the horse, and you won't see the reefing occur again with that rider. We have to stop blaming the horse, take a step back and see that maybe our own riding is where the problem lies? So before you come back at me with teeth and claws out, just have a think... is your riding so perfect in every way that you couldn't possibly be inducing this behaviour?

 

[Kayty]

Sorry forgot to mention, YES i do also use gadgets on certain horses. I like to lunge in side reins, I've had good results from doing so as long as the horse isn't the type to duck behind the bit and is working confidently forward into a contact under saddle. I have also used draw reins on a couple of horses, only once or twice then never had to use them again. But again, for a VERY short period of time and on horses that do not have the tendancy to drop back off the bit

 

[StormyBlues]

By using a martingale you are avoiding the problem. You are just muting what is going on by tying the horses head to it's chest. So my advice is to find a new qualified trainer who can teach you how to properly fix a problem.

 

[My Beau]

By using a martingale you are avoiding the problem. You are just muting what is going on by tying the horses head to it's chest.

What type of martingale have you been looking at? I've seen what you mentioned happen with draw reins, but martingales are loose until the horses head goes WAY up, then it comes into effect.

Unless a moron put it on and adjusted it, that is.

I also believe the trainer just wanted the OP to learn. Have her do some research as to what the different types of matingales do instead of being told what to buy, buying it and using it right away without knowing the reasoning behind it.