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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I don't get some people. If you don't want a foal, why would you buy a breeding and send your mare to the stallion? Why wouldn't you follow instructions? Why would you argue about every little thing?

Over the years I've seen a lot of stuff. But the mare owner who says they want a foal but will not do the simplest things just really blows my mind.

Here's an example:

Woman contacts me about breeding to Skippy but cringes at the stud fee, so I send her to a stallion service auction site where I've donated a breeding to Skippy that she can buy for 1/2 price. She dilly dallies along about it until she finally buys the breeding in MID MAY. She's well aware that Skippy's book closes on June 15 and after that doesn't open up again until next breeding season. To help her know when to get the mare to me, I send her a tease sheet and ask her to track the mare daily. When she's finally bringing the mare to me in the middle of May, I ask if she can send me the tease sheet so I know where the mare is in her cycle. She says, and mind you this lady has 9 kids, "I didn't want to bring her in too early so I didn't do it.". Wait, you have 9 kids and don't get that either you're cycling and ovulating or you're not, but it has nothing to do with teasing the mare? HUMMMMMMMMMMMM

The mare is here for 11 days to be bred, live cover. She's here for at least 4 of those days, maybe 5, so I can tease her and see her responses to the stallion. So 5 X $15 = $75 SHE WOULDN'T HAVE HAD TO PAY IF SHE'D FOLLOWED DIRECTIONS. Total bill, $265, includes the chute fee. She tries to negotiate the bill down....... Mind you, I'm not seeing a penny of the stud fee, it's from a donated breeding. HUMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

The contract says right in it, "If the mare leaves the premises before checked in foal, mare MUST be pregnancy checked at 15 & 30 days. She doesn't want to have her checked, just wants to wait until the mare comes back in season or not. NO, you signed a contract and agreed to certain responsibilities. Has the mare checked at 15 days, vet says she's open. I tell the mare owner, get her checked again at 30 days, I don't believe she didn't catch & settle. So she goes back to the same vet (one I have never though much of and now think even less) and vet says, "She's open. She didn't take.". By now we're past the June 15 book closure date and the temps are over 100 F and HUMID as all get out. She wants to bring the mare back to be rebred. I told her no, #1 Book is closed. #2 I'm telling you that mare is pregnant, take her to OSU and have someone who knows what they're doing recheck her. She refuses. I remind her that I told her several times before she bought the breeding that the mare would only be able to be covered for 1 cycle that late in the year. She says, "I thought you'd make an exception for me.". WTH? Why? I've never met the lady or her horse until she brought her here to be bred. And I reminded her that I thought the mare was in foal. If she was not, she'd be the first mare EVER to not catch and settle when live covered by Skippy.

Fast forward to yesterday when she asks about bred mare vaccine protocols. The mare never came back into heat and her belly is getting big.

"I kept thinking it was just wishful thinking, but she was soooo off in her hips and with her belly getting big it just made me all the more hopeful. I’ve been telling my family I don’t want to know for certain because at least this way I have the hope of a baby and by the time I would know for sure she wasn’t pregnant it would be almost time to breed her."

OK, so the mare is doing without prenatal care because you don't want to know for sure because she MIGHT not be pregnant? If she's pregnant, then her first Rhino was due back in OCTOBER and 2nd one is due now. There went the Live Foal Guarantee. AND even though she could only be covered for one cycle due to bringing her late, then that's exactly what you were going to do AGAIN? And probably would try to get me to keep Skippy breeding in the heat and keep his book open for her, again. "However now that the chiropractor said that (He told her to have the mare checked again, she looks in foal to him) I figured we better find out so I can be a good steward over her pregnancy.". UMMMM that ship has sailed.

The mare is pregnant, as I've been saying all along. "Just goes to show technology has its limits and I praise the Lord for this most wonderful gift! I’m so thankful." Yeah, it's not technology, it's the hand holding the technology that missed a perfectly viable foal TWICE.

AND btw, this is why I no longer live cover. It's just not worth the hassle. I'll still happily take Skippy to the vet and have him collected and if you choose you can send your mare to the same vet and he'll inseminate right then and there or we'll ship to your vet and they can AI your mare, but I'm not going to do it. Oh and this lady wanted me to "practice veterinary medicine without a license". She wanted me to give her mare the hormone shots to bring her in and make her ovulate, as well as do an oxytocin regimen post breeding. UMMMMMMMMM NO? I told her I don't keep those drugs on hand and even if I had them, I would not administer them to HER mare without a supervising vet's OK and instructions. No way was I going down THAT road.

So for the record, I'm thrilled the mare is pregnant. I'll never have to deal with her owner again. Thank you, Lord.
 

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I feel sorry for reputable breeders with great studs. So many people want to cut costs and the horses always suffer in the end. I have a neighbor with a free TB stallion. He is a palomino so she thinks he is something special. But she feeds inferior hay, has no mare care and no real health care for any of her animals. Last year she lost 3 mares and 1 foal. Just last week she lost a mare and almost lost that mares foal. She breeds the natural way - stud runs with the mares year round - they get bred when they get bred and foal when they foal. It makes me cringe - and she always sends me FB messages lamenting her losses.

I would gladly pay a reasonable stud fee to take my mare to a clean facility with a health certified stallion and go through the specified protocol the stallion owner outlines if the end result is a healthy well bred foal.

Sorry you had to go through this. I hope that woman does not purchase another breeding
 

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Honestly. A lot of people think it's like breeding dogs or cats. Throw them together in a pasture and leave them to it.


My husband is one of them.
 

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This is so annoying. It also reminds me of why I never want to run a breeding operation. I'm sorry you have to deal with it.
 

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holy cow... breeding a animal takes time and research before doing. i have played with the idea of breeding my mare and thought against it after doing my homework like a RESPONSIBLE person! yikes and more yikes! just like owning a boarding stable idk if i could ever stud a horse out for the same reason. crazies. At least with AI you dont have to worry about most of that. if they are willing to pay for all that then they are serious.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
. I hope that woman does not purchase another breeding
Honestly. A lot of people think it's like breeding dogs or cats. Throw them together in a pasture and leave them to it.


My husband is one of them.
That woman won't buy another breeding. Unless she gets one for free (to another stallion, won't be to mine) I doubt she'll breed her mare again. I've already told the Stallion Service that I won't accept any mare this woman has, so that's not going to be a problem.

When I run up against someone who wants me to just throw the mare & stallion out in the pasture to breed, I refuse the mare. I won't even deal with them. I will not allow a strange mare out with my stallion, whom I've invested untold hours and a huge amount of money in, so that she can try to kick his parts off. Just won't happen. It will not be the mare owner who has to pay the vet bill or the euthanasia bill. And God Forbid, if the mare is nasty enough to manage to rile Skippy up and make him give her some rough justice, I'd end up paying for that too.

Live cover is the riskiest part of the breeding procedure. When I am using the donated breeding, then the only money I make is the daily mare care (or monthly in the case of someone who sends their mare up to be managed) and the $100 chute fee. So for $265 I ran the risk of my stallion getting injured if I misread the mare, my helper (holds the mare) getting injured or killed and myself (handles the stallion) getting injured or killed or worse, disabled. Won't do it again. I did promise one other mare to live cover because she's older and maiden, but once I've got her in foal, we'll do shipped or collected and mare inseminated at OSU. It's not worth the risk or the money and for sure the aggravation.

I'm used to people complaining about the stud fees. Especially when I was breeding Arabians, stud fees started out at $2500 and went up from there. The average stock horse stud fees seem to range from $500 to $2500 (more for reiners) and Skippy is priced at the lower end at $750. I tend to roll my eyes when someone complains about Skippy's fees. I do donate a breeding to the Palomino Horse Breeders Association's Go For The Gold Stallion Service Auction every year, and refer people there even before I sell a breeding. And since I'm not breeding for myself anymore, I really don't get anything out of it.

I don't want to sound like I hate breeding my stallion, I mostly love it, but when I get put through the wringer like this one and end up feeling totally disrespected and disgusted, it's close to enough to make me quit standing him to the public and just keep him on the "Friends & Family" plan.
 

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LOL! Yeah, I stayed away from the Race Horse fees for that very reason. And even at $25000 he's fairly reasonable compared to some of the thoroughbreds.

My bestie was home with a sick daughter yesterday. She had all day to shop stud fees for her Streakin Six mares.... I had a constant barrage of Ooooo loooook at him! yesterday and I loved every bit of it... but yeah. Skip's fees are more than reasonable.


I figure there's just a LOT OF SMOOTH BORE IDIOTS in the horse world.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
My bestie was home with a sick daughter yesterday. She had all day to shop stud fees for her Streakin Six mares.... I had a constant barrage of Ooooo loooook at him! yesterday and I loved every bit of it... but yeah. Skip's fees are more than reasonable.


I figure there's just a LOT OF SMOOTH BORE IDIOTS in the horse world.
That's one of the best descriptions I've ever read! LOL!
 

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That's one of the best descriptions I've ever read! LOL!

I'd never heard that before until my husband used it. I latched onto it immediately, because I knew exactly what smooth bore was referring to and just loved the way it all sounded coming off the tongue. LOL
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
part of the reason why I never have stood my stallion to the public, the money is not worth the fruit bats and if you are not carefully inspecting the mares , the fugly foal produced by a fugly, nasty mare is blamed %100 on your stud and there goes his reputation.
I check pedigrees and pics and reserve the right to refuse any mare. Once someone establishes their "fruit bat" status (love that one too), they can't find a mare I'll approve. And I've always reserved the right to toss a mare who gets nasty, not gonna deal with that. But yes, I agree with you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Here's the latest in the drama saga and it will be the last installment. I had to fill out another stallion breeding report for this mare and her coming foal. I had put everyone else's reports in back in July. I've never filed this late in the year and thought I had til Dec 15th or so to get things wrapped up but found out that the filing deadline for SBRs was Nov. 31st, so not only did I have to pay $15 to file for that single mare, I got hit with a $25 late filing fee. I sent her an invoice for the late fee, I figure the SBR fee is my responsibilty, but because of her shilly shallying around on getting the mare check (Dec 10th), I couldn't file timely on this mare. I'm still waiting for her to pay that fee.

She had talked in the beginning of having her mare up here to foal. Yeah, I'm full....and gonna stay that way for a good long time.
 
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