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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Is this ok to be feeding to a pssm horse? Sugar is 7.50% starch is 10% . Only feeding 2 lbs total split into to feedings.

Reason for feeding is to get his vit/min supplement in him. He stopped eating it. Also concerned about over dosing vit/mins feeding ultimum with his supplement. Or does it really make much difference in the grand scheme of things.??

Tried other carriers alfalfa cubes, timothy pellets and alfalfa pellets all no goes.
I don't like feeding bagged feed I try to stay totally forage based for his diet. He needs his supplement so I've had to resort to buying what he'll eat.

He was eating supplement good till the big drop in temps happened. Went from mid 20s low 30s, to below zero in about a 24 for hour period.

Been bitter cold temperatures not getting above below zero. Wicked wind chills and he's lost some weight. No reprieve from this crazy cold weather. Maybe next week, mid week temps will get over Sub-Zero for highs.

I could try doing just a 1/2 pound of ultimum twice a day. Should possibly be enough to mix in his vit/min. It's extremely important he gets his costom made vit/min,along with the extra vit E.

I keep his diet low sugar/starch like at 8 to 10 percent total diet.
 

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Here's how I do the math: If he is getting 20 lbs of hay at approx 1,000 calories per pound, that is 20,000 calories. Multiply that by 10% NSC (guessing your hay level) and you get 2,000. Now take the Purina Ultium at 1,900 calories per pound and multiply it by 2. That is 3,800 calories. Multiply that by 17.5% (NSC) and you get 665. So the NSC calories per total diet calories of 23,800 calories would be 2,665. If you divide 2,665 by 23,800, the total NSC of the diet would be 11%.
In simpler words, since only 15% of the diet is at the higher NSC level, it averages out so the total diet is 11% NSC.
Hope that helps! Doesn't sound too high to me.
 

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I'll change it to show the math for only 1 lb of Ultium and 20 lbs of hay.

If he is getting 20 lbs of hay at approx 1,000 calories per pound, that is 20,000 calories. Multiply that by 10% NSC (guessing your hay level) and you get 2,000. Now take the Purina Ultium at 1,900 calories per pound and multiply that by 17.5% (NSC) and you get 333. So the NSC calories per total diet calories of 21,900 calories would be 2,333. If you divide 2,333 by 21,900, the total NSC of the diet would be 10.7%.
In this case, 9% of the diet is at the higher NSC level.

Of course if you feed more than 20 lbs of hay, the percentage of the total NSC in the diet would go down even more.
 

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I've only been on my PSSM journey for a year, but I stay clear of manufactured feeds, (even though I like the Purina line, I feed Maternity and Juvenile to my mare and youngsters). I am not math inclined, so while I really appreciate the maths that @gottatrot did, I am not able to wrap my head around it. All I can recommend is what has worked for me so far, which is a free choice mineral block and his roughage with some oil. I just recently purchased camelina oil which has natural vitamin e and omegas. In these frigid temps the horses are not at the mineral blocks as much, but they do still go to them as they need.

I did look up the Ultium and it seems like it is designed for horses who cannot handle starches and sugars, but I am still leery. Just me though!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks @gottatrot yeah it would probably be a bit lower he's eating more the 20lbs of hay. But 11% nsc is ok still low enough.

There's the overlap of vit/mins with his supplement and ultimum. I know to much of certain vit/mins can be a real issue.

Here's the supplement his costom supp is based on. Obviously some minerals have been upped as have some vitamins. Due to lack in hays vit/min content according to hay analysis.

He's doing good so don't want to mess it up and cause trouble.

@MajorSealstheDeal thanks horse is on a costom supplement. I don't usually feed any bagged feed. Only using ultimum for a carrier for supplement. His diet is forage based for most part. I don't use mineral blocks, not a reliable source for vit/mins. I want to know my horse is getting what he needs.
1109192
 

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I entered this into FeedXL for you. With a basic grass hay diet, a serving of the Horsetech Fuel supplement along with 2 lbs of Purina Ultium , the graph looked about perfect. All the basic vitamins and minerals were being met and exceeded, but nothing was too high that could cause issues. All the ratios were good such as calcium to phosphorus and zinc to copper. Seems like a pretty good supplement combo to me.
 

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That is what I fed to two of my pssm mares with no issues.
 

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I keep losing what I type:(:(

I agree with @MajorSealstheDeal to try the Camelina Oil.

I buy mine from Smart Earth Camelina USA

They are in Canada but have a U.S. facility.

I feed HorseTech‘s vit/min supplement for grass fed horses and to-date the Camelina oil goes well with it. I only feed one ounce daily.

Joker has more muscle loss than fat loss thanks to the Cushing. The oil has not helped with that but it has greatly reduced his level of inflammation and he has more enervy than he’s had for years. He actually did three full buck ups (both legs) when I turned him out the other day.

It is not cheap up front but IMO, it’s worth every penny. It is nothing but all natural, correctly balanced Omegas and Vitamin E. No fillers.

SmRtEarth customer service is great to talk to and they ship fast. Tney have a warehouse in Ilinois. The on,y thing that would delay shipment would be this weather we are experiencing. Hats off to the truck drivers :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thank you @gottatrot hay right now is grass hay. Have 15 round bale that are 60% alfalfa 40% grass not feeding it currently.

@walkinthewalk I looked up the camelina oil I'd only need to feed 2 oz. Probably could do just 1oz. Not sure it would meet his vit E needs he's on 4000 iu. I looked an camelina doesn't have vit E listed an how much per once or I didn't see it.

Maybe later on I'll give it a try our temps are well below zero. Weather people keep extending the wind chill warning now it's till Sunday. Was supposed to end today at noon.

I buy elevate vitamin e powder. He seems to be doing fine on the ultium at just 2 lbs a day. I like keeping diet forage based,but not going to happen.
 

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Thank you @gottatrot hay right now is grass hay. Have 15 round bale that are 60% alfalfa 40% grass not feeding it currently.

@walkinthewalk I looked up the camelina oil I'd only need to feed 2 oz. Probably could do just 1oz. Not sure it would meet his vit E needs he's on 4000 iu. I looked an camelina doesn't have vit E listed an how much per once or I didn't see it.

Maybe later on I'll give it a try our temps are well below zero. Weather people keep extending the wind chill warning now it's till Sunday. Was supposed to end today at noon.

I buy elevate vitamin e powder. He seems to be doing fine on the ultium at just 2 lbs a day. I like keeping diet forage based,but not going to happen.
Found the Vitamin E amount:)

Camelina, meantime, has a unique oil profile, offering a better than 2:1 balance of Omega3|Omega6. It is also high in tocopherols (Vitamin E), a natural anti-oxidant.
Here is what Juliet Getty says about camelina: "Camelina oil offers an excellent alternative to flaxseed oil. It comes from the edible Camelina sativa seed, often referred to as “false flax.” It is high in ALA with a 2.4:1 ratio of omega 3s to omega 6s, and its shelf life is far superior to flaxseed oil. It is resistant to oxidative rancidity, making it highly stable. This is because of its remarkably high vitamin E content: 100 ml (slightly less than ½ cup) of camelina oil contains 150 IU of natural vitamin E, whereas flaxseed oil only contains 26 IU. Vitamin E is an antioxidant, and as such, it neutralizes damaging free radicals formed when the fatty acids are oxidized from air and light."


I still feed 3000 IU of HorseTech’s “Natural E 5000 to Joker, in addition to what’s in one ounce of the Camelina Oil.

I haven’t seen a weight gain but I have seen a huge reduction in inflammation. The vet/chiro also notices when it she works on him.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
@walkinthewalk thanks for the info on the camelina oil. The vit E isn't much amount wise. I'll give it a try but will wait for warmer weather.

I'm doing a cup of canola oil a day now. With the cold if ice doesn't eat up his feed, in a timely manner it gets all nasty with the oil. Then he won't eat it.

Horse tech is sending me a sample 2 pounds of costum supplement ,with a different flavor. Not charging me for it either wow there awesome. Wasn't that long ago I spent $$$$ buying, the years worth of costum supplement.

If ice likes it I can mix it into current supplement. Then I can faze out the ultium.

I really prefer not to feed bagged commercial feed. Just when I think I found a flavor he likes. An order a years worth he up an quits eating it.

Ice is doing really good actually he looks the best he ever has. Great feet shinny coat and frisky as can be. I attribute it to diet and the costum supplement.
 

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I agree, HorseTech can’t be best for product quality and customer service(y)(y)

I am glad Ice is doing so well. Here’s to his continued good health🥂
 
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