[cassidilla]

so I was trying really hard to just ride my horse in a full cheek snaffle but he just runs right through it as soon as we lope. He decides that were going where he wants to go and nothing can stop him we'll run sideways across the whole pasture, and don't think that we run full speed at anything other than the big tree, branches, and fences. Any ways i've decided that he needs something that's going to stop him because its scary as hell running everywhere sideways i tried a tom thumb and that seemed to work really well but they've got such bad reviews and seem kinda awful i'm going to test it more and see how he reacts but someone suggest a slow twist. I'm just in desperate need of a suggestion on what bit would be a good idea for my little stubborn booger butt lol thank you

 

[JustDressageIt]

Have you had his teeth checked recently? Saddle fit looked at by a professional? Have you enlisted the help of a qualified professional to work through this with you?
Bits do not fix problems. They are temporary band aids, at best.

 

[tinyliny]

you can try a TT. My limited experience with such bits is that , yes, you may get more "brakes", but you often have less stearing ability. I guess that has to do with that this kind of shanked , 'snaffle" (broken moutpiece is a better term) , does't transmit lateral signals as clearly. It is best used for neck reining.
So, it can bring the horse to stop, but is not always so good for steering. And, if the hrose is running sideways, through the bit and all, you would want to be able to use lateral rein work, no?

I would learn how to disengage the horse's hind end, in the bit you have (a true snaffle), to stop him leaking out sideways, and then start him going forward again. Work at the slower gaits and get good obedience there before going into running.

And, as JDI said, make sure that the hrose is not running like this because he is trying to run away from pain from the bit or the saddle.

 

[JustDressageIt]

. I guess that has to do with that this kind of shanked , 'snaffle" (broken moutpiece is a better term) ,

Eeeeeeekkkkkk!!!! Please don't even hint that a TT is a "snaffle!" 'Snaffle' does not describe the mouthpiece, they are non-leverage bits. I hate when curb/leverage bits are described as having a "snaffle mouth"

Rant over

 

[tinyliny]

I know. I used the term only because others do, that's why I added the explanation in parathesis.

Yes, a TT is NOT a snaffle.

 

[Shoebox]

To be honest it sounds like either a training issue or a pain issue. Upping the harshness of the bit, I think, will just act as a temporary fix-it before he starts doing the same thing in the new bit, and you up it again... Etc. It's a vicious cycle that I've seen a few times. A stronger bit will act as a band aid, as said above, and it won't be long before that band aid starts to come off.

 

[bsms]

Work on his stop at a walk & trot. Get those good before cantering. You can also try some sort of gag/elevator bit:

or perhaps a leverage bit like this (no nutcracker action):

I'd rather add pressure on the poll than going to a twisted wire.

You also might want to work on both one rein stops and pulley stops.

 

[cassidilla]

Work on his stop at a walk & trot. Get those good before cantering. You can also try some sort of gag/elevator bit:

or perhaps a leverage bit like this (no nutcracker action):

I'd rather add pressure on the poll than going to a twisted wire.

You also might want to work on both one rein stops and pulley stops.

he does those fine at the walk and trot he's perfect at those but as soon as we lope it is a completely different story he just does not want to listen or stop he jumps over everything and runs full speed at the fence and slams on the breaks. The only time he's ever listened was when we were running down a horse other wise at the lope its what I want for a while and then he just takes off
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[Allison Finch]

People willing to fix training problems with tougher bits get under my skin, so I apologize for my getting some of my angst out.

If you just want a bit to get your horse under control instead of retraining what is wrong in the first place.....try some of these.

There are many even worse.

End of rant.......

 

[apachiedragon]

OP, once you are sure it is not a pain issue, work on a LOT of walk trot transitions. Go a few steps, drop back down to a slower gait. Work on a small circle, not a straight line, change directions a lot, keep it interesting and changed up for him so he has to think about the problem. Once your horse is soft in the mouth and responsive to your seat as well as your hands, THEN pick up a slow relaxed canter for a few strides, and bring him back. Never let his momentum build or his attention stray before you come back down to a slower speed. His brain is what needs the work, if he isn't thinking and is just plowing ahead, no bit in the world will help you.

 

[bsms]

Have you tried a pulley stop?

You also might try tightening the circle at a canter until he has to break his pace. That works with Mia if I have room for the turns. Also, have you tried bits using pressure on the poll? It might help to add a cue without putting more pressure into his mouth. Also, when he doesn't want to stop, does he stretch his head out so it is nearly horizontal?

 

[cassidilla]

Have you had his teeth checked recently? Saddle fit looked at by a professional? Have you enlisted the help of a qualified professional to work through this with you?
Bits do not fix problems. They are temporary band aids, at best.

Yes his tack is all fine and his teeth are good and i keep him at the barn with my trainer she said we're just going to have to try different bits i just am not sure about the tom thumb which she suggested which is why i posted this. it's just odd because hes perfectly fine at the walk and trot

 

[cassidilla]

Have you had his teeth checked recently? Saddle fit looked at by a professional? Have you enlisted the help of a qualified professional to work through this with you?
Bits do not fix problems. They are temporary band aids, at best.

People willing to fix training problems with tougher bits get under my skin, so I apologize for my getting some of my angst out.

If you just want a bit to get your horse under control instead of retraining what is wrong in the first place.....try some of these.

There are many even worse.

End of rant.......

So you're telling me that there aren't different bits for different reasons. obviously different bits get different responses from different horses or else we would all be riding in the same bit. If he's running past the snaffle there's nothing I can do about it he is perfect at the walk and trot and turns into the devil at the lope. I asked for help finding another bit that would be good for my horse not torture devices...

 

[Ashleysmardigrasgirl]

TT twisted wire seems pretty similar in harshness to the "torture devices" listed above.

Just because a bit is harsher doesn't mean it's used for a horse that doesn't respond to subtle cues. Horses can feel tiny flies land on their bum, what makes you think they don't feel even 1lb of pressure in their mouth... Broken 3 piece snaffle gives a ratio of 1:1 for every lb you pull the horse feels 1lb... There is no excuse for your horse to be "ignoring" your cues, yet, not need retraining.

 

[equiniphile]

Different bits are used for horses that have more training and can rely on a more subtle cue from a bit with a higher port or longer shank. For example, my reining mare can be ridden bridleless. I can stop her from a gallop with just my seat and voice because of training. However, in competition I use a correction bit with a medium port because it allows for more subtle communication and less movement of my hand to convey the same cue. I do NOT use it as a band-aid, as you seem to be trying to do.

My answer? Use a french link or single jointed snaffle (depending on the shape of her palate and preference). Eggbutt, loose ring or Dee ring....doesn't matter much. Eggbutt is my preference. This horse needs training, not a bigger bit.

 

[bsms]

A calm horse can feel a fly landing on its butt. When my mare is calm, she stops from me settling into the seat. When she thinks she is racing another horse? Let's just say she doesn't stop for flies landing on her butt!

Ever hear the term, "has the bit in her teeth"?

"The earliest known use of the phrase is in John Dryden's satirical poem The Medal, 1682:

But this new Jehu spurs the hot-mounted horse,
Instructs the beast to know his native force,
To take the bit between his teeth and fly
To the next headlong steep of anarchy."
​

In an ideal world, we would all have endless hours to train our horses, and the facilities and area to do so. But that doesn't describe my world. Horses have wills. Some don't like to go fast. Others get intoxicated by it. A french link snaffle is no more the answer for every horse than a bitless bridle is, and for the same reason.

Mia seems very receptive to adding pressure on the poll. It just seems to be a cue that she understands, and has since the first time I tried a gag bit in her. We are also doing a lot of practice stops, because an OK stop at a trot is going to be a pee-poor stop at a gallop - if another horse is also galloping. By herself, she'll stop very quickly at a gallop. But she has a mind of her own, and sometimes uses it...

 

[apachiedragon]

Yes, OP there are different bits for different purposes. But if you horse is blasting through a bit, then getting a harsher bit is never the answer. You are not teaching the horse anything by hiding behind stronger tack or training aids. There is obviously a hole in his training if there is no problem at the walk or trot and then he bulldogs you at the canter. It sounds to me as if your trainer needs to be helping you solve the problem, not giving you a harsher bit to mask it.

Also, in your thread title you said twisted wire bit but in your first post, you said slow twist. There is a world of difference between this...

and this....

 

[JustDressageIt]

So you're telling me that there aren't different bits for different reasons. obviously different bits get different responses from different horses or else we would all be riding in the same bit. If he's running past the snaffle there's nothing I can do about it he is perfect at the walk and trot and turns into the devil at the lope. I asked for help finding another bit that would be good for my horse not torture devices...

Yep different bits will get different responses. Absolutely. Unfortunately many people will "bit up" instead of getting to the root of the problem. I've been there - I'm sad to admit as recently as last summer with my gelding. Why do we do it? Because it's easy. Easier than stripping training down and rebuilding the foundation to find out where the hole is. Unfortunately as well, many trainers prefer to go the "bit em up" route too.

 

[Muppetgirl]

The only time I can 'agree or understand' bitting up is when someone is showing. I ride my guy in a ported correction bit, HOWEVER he has been schooled up into the bit and is very light and responsive. I have a very dusty cathedral bit, that I ride in once every few months, that is to be used for shows, not because he blast through the correction bit, but because it narrows my margin for error when it counts. It offers a little more subtlety and lightness required for the show pen. That's the ONLY reason I can agree or understand without an eye roll.

 

[cassidilla]

It just doesn't make since because even in the full cheek snaffle at the walk and trot I just barely pull and I get a response but as soon as it's anything more it's all hell. But when I was just being dumb and working him on some cattle he listened to every cue. Even my friend can't figure out what's wrong with him he just kind of flips like a light switch out of no where