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Turning head to outside when lunging

932 Views 40 Replies 15 Participants Last post by  APHAGal
I lunged Dolly properly for the first time today (I've done it before with a lead rope, but not a proper lunge line). She did pretty well, and for a start she was very good about leaving a little bit of slack in the rope, but after a few minutes she started turning her head to the outside and pulling on the rope. I gave it little tugs to get head head back in, and she did respond, but she kept turning it back to the outside again. I lunged for maybe 20 minutes in total.
Should I just bump her back in each time she turns out, or is there something else I should be doing?
Thanks in advance.

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I lunged Dolly properly for the first time today (I've done it before with a lead rope, but not a proper lunge line). She did pretty well, and for a start she was very good about leaving a little bit of slack in the rope, but after a few minutes she started turning her head to the outside and pulling on the rope. I gave it little tugs to get head head back in, and she did respond, but she kept turning it back to the outside again. I lunged for maybe 20 minutes in total.
Should I just bump her back in each time she turns out, or is there something else I should be doing?
Thanks in advance.
If she's not got her eyes focused on you it defeats the purpose of even lunging, keep bumping her nose in. What type of halter do you use?
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Oh and continue to lunge till you end on a positive note.
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What you did sounds fine. Bump her in and keep her moving forward. Eventually she'll figure out that paying attention and staying soft is easier. You can also indicate with the whip towards her barrel, along with those bumps on the line, to help push her body out into the bend. The lunge whip can act the same way an inside leg does during a ride, to help maintain bend through a turn.
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There are a couple of ways of looking at the behavior. One is the round pen "eyes on me" theory, where if the horse is not looking toward the inside of the circle, it's ignoring you and looking for an escape. The other theory is, you're dealing with natural one-sidedness and possibly lack of balance on the circle that you would also experience riding. This is one of the great things about lungeing - you can get a stiff, unbalanced horse more limber, etc. without the horse dealing with the weight on its back.

I'm in the second camp, except possibly with a horse that's getting its first round pen lessons. I think you are doing exactly right. Of course just tipping the nose in is just a small start because the stiffness is through the whole body. If you are lungeing for training purposes, probably some nice in-hand flexibility exercises would be helpful. And then, just "tincture of time" and consistent practice.
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I lunged Dolly properly for the first time today (I've done it before with a lead rope, but not a proper lunge line). She did pretty well, and for a start she was very good about leaving a little bit of slack in the rope, but after a few minutes she started turning her head to the outside and pulling on the rope. I gave it little tugs to get head head back in, and she did respond, but she kept turning it back to the outside again. I lunged for maybe 20 minutes in total.
Should I just bump her back in each time she turns out, or is there something else I should be doing?
Thanks in advance.
What is your GOAL of having your horse go around in a circle for 20 minutes?
(Completely serious question.)

Were you trotting the whole time? Loping?
Did you ever stop her and do direction changes?

Personally, I don't like "lunging". I see zero benefit in making your horse robotically gallop around in a small circle for what seems like an eternity, except it might be them into more shape, but also might make them sore depending on how small your circle is.

I find much more benefit in doing "ground work". Asking the horse to yield the hindquarters, move the shoulders, back up, walk/trot/lope at my cue, etc etc. Basically really making them "think" and lock onto me, so that they are in tune to every body language cue I am giving them. This is vastly different that yee-hawing a horse around in a circle.

So perhaps you could clarify more about what your goals are with lunging, and what exactly you do during that time.
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What is your GOAL of having your horse go around in a circle for 20 minutes?
(Completely serious question.)

Were you trotting the whole time? Loping?
Did you ever stop her and do direction changes?

Personally, I don't like "lunging". I see zero benefit in making your horse robotically gallop around in a small circle for what seems like an eternity, except it might be them into more shape, but also might make them sore depending on how small your circle is.

I find much more benefit in doing "ground work". Asking the horse to yield the hindquarters, move the shoulders, back up, walk/trot/lope at my cue, etc etc. Basically really making them "think" and lock onto me, so that they are in tune to every body language cue I am giving them. This is vastly different that yee-hawing a horse around in a circle.

So perhaps you could clarify more about what your goals are with lunging, and what exactly you do during that time.
Lunging is not “ robotically galloping a horse around in a circle” it gets them to engage with you, anticipate direction changes, the way I do direction changes it’s a form of yielding the hindquarters. Most ppl don’t lunge in a small circle, the smallest lunge line I’ve ever used is 14 ft.
Lunging is a form of groundwork. It gets then to engage every part of their body and mind and focus on you especially if you’re consistently asking for direction changes. It makes their bodies more supple and if you do it enough you can get your horse to do flip of a dime direction changes, roll backs, etc.

it is not yeehawing a horse in a circle and is a type of groundwork.
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My trainer uses a bosal when lunging which naturally keeps their nose tipped to the inside.
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There are a ton of benefits to just regular ol’ lunging, and it should be in every horse’s default skill set. Even just to be able to evaluate movement. Or see how a horse is going in a new saddle before adding a rider. Or to help a horse like my oldster warm up a little before I get on, on a cold stiff day. Or yes, to let them blow off some steam in a controlled situation before a rider gets on (a use that often gets poo pooed on, and I agree that it’s not a good sign if it’s needed before a LOT of rides, but…). There’s definitely value in it. I agree that some people overdo it or do it with no real purpose, but it’s not something that should be dismissed.
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If you can find a well fitting lunging cavesson with a ring on the nose, that is helpful for a more precise cue to get her nose tipped in on the circle. I would also work on yielding her hind quarters while keeping her nose a bit towards you during groundwork if you aren't already. I have done a lot of this with my gelding and found that it helps translates to a nice bend while lunging on a longer line.

Noticing small try's and having precise timing for cues and releases in groundwork goes a long way in keeping the horse thinking "towards" you instead of away from you. My favorite trainer for this type of work is Warwick Schiller (pictured below).

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Too many use too small of a circle. 20 meter (66 feet) is comfortable. 15 meter (50 feet) is fine. 15 feet is not. That gives you a 30 foot (less than 10 meter) and is far too tight.

You're putting stress and strain on joints and causing excessive wear and tear not to mention irritating existing conditions.

It's useful and comes in handy if you're alone evaluating gait but over the years I've found it less and less useful and seen far too many soured and ruined by those that don't understand what they're doing or why.
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see zero benefit in making your horse robotically gallop around in a small circle for what seems like an eternity, except it might be them into more shape, but also might make them sore depending on how small your circle is.
That’s not lunging, that’s something different! You can accomplish a lot on a lunge line if you know what you are doing.

1] I have never, and never will, have never seen anyone ask for gallop on the lunge, that is hyperbole.
2) If anyone is lunging for an eternity, they are doing it wrong.

To me it’s just another tool in the ground work category, and as the OP is finding, making yourself the most interesting and important focus is important, hence the bumping, “hey look here, look at me”

If you understand, and can use the tools properly you can achieve much on a lunge line!
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The debate of to lunge or not and what benefit does the horse derive from this is what you need to be able to answer and back it up with done deal accomplishments.

Being you wrote this, "I lunged Dolly properly for the first time today (I've done it before with a lead rope, but not a proper lunge line). " makes me wonder....
What did you teach Dolly?
What has she just learned from that exercise and was it beneficial to her...or not?

So the horse circled you with their nose tipped outside and pulling against the lunge line unless you thumped the face by line movement and the animal quickly moved their face away from that pressure felt then resumed their method of travel of nose tipped out and pulling against you....
I didn't see you, only read your words and description which immediately made me think the horse is unbalanced and using the nose tipped out and pulling against you as a balance point.
You "thumping" the lunge line pulling her nose back inside is = to striking her in the face to me. The nerves in the face and the force felt at the end of that line..o_O

Some people can do a lot on a lunge line working a horse.....
Some people think they do and don't...
Some people complicate further how the horse travels and why when not lunging it correctly.
I don't know any of those facts only what I've seen and observed many times...nor pointing a finger in yours or anyone's direction.
There is a right way and a wrong way and many do wrong thinking they are the cat's meow making that horse do all this, that and something else while they are moving in a circle around a pivot point, that be us, their human.

I would rather saddle up, mount up and ride where my horse is not forced to keep their body on a continual arc that is not natural....any size circular movement just arced the body and transferred the weight and stresses of movement to particular areas...
If I want to "arc" and bend the body, the horse can and will do so with me astride in any size circle or even on a straight path...now that seems a novel idea and one many not do often.
Be careful lunging is not overly stressing the animals body, forget shutting down its mind in endless roundy-round boredom....

As said, some can derive a lot for the animal when lunging is done correctly and with variation to the exercise and both directions worked so balancing of the animals musculature and coordination is undertaken..
Just be careful to not stress mind & body, nor allow...yes allow what just took place to occur....every interaction is a learning experience....done 3x it is no longer being learned but now a set trait good or bad in this is what they do when we do this activity... :cautious:
How many times did you "thump" that line and pull the nose in and how many times did the horse go right back to what it was doing....something to think about and why.
🐴.... jmo...
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That’s not lunging, that’s something different! You can accomplish a lot on a lunge line if you know what you are doing.

1] I have never, and never will, have never seen anyone ask for gallop on the lunge, that is hyperbole.
2) If anyone is lunging for an eternity, they are doing it wrong.

To me it’s just another tool in the ground work category, and as the OP is finding, making yourself the most interesting and important focus is important, hence the bumping, “hey look here, look at me”

If you understand, and can use the tools properly you can achieve much on a lunge line!
@Golden Horse, this is an argument (lungeing as training tool) we will never win! LOL!
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I don't think it's that lungeing isn't a training tool as much as it is the misuse, abuse, too small circles for too long, insistence that it's being done properly but issue after issue crops up and blame is laid at the feet of the horse not the human. There's an art and a science to it that gets overlooked and ignored by newbies that jump in with both feet and no instruction except some vague impressions gotten from videos or books where there is no sublety or timing learned. Those egos can't be made to see any different.
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I don't think it's that lungeing isn't a training tool as much as it is the misuse, abuse, too small circles for too long, insistence that it's being done properly but issue after issue crops up and blame is laid at the feet of the horse not the human. There's an art and a science to it that gets overlooked and ignored by newbies that jump in with both feet and no instruction except some vague impressions gotten from videos or books where there is no sublety or timing learned. Those egos can't be made to see any different.
I agree entirely. Time and again, we have "the lungeing conversation" here and while I'm convinced of its immense potential to benefit the horse if used correctly, there is always the rebuttal of those who have written it off as abusive, useless, injurious, pointless, boring, the list goes on, and if there is no incentive to actually learn about its correct use (because of foregone conclusions), then it's an open and shut case on both sides.

To be fair, I, like those with a polar opposite view, cannot be convinced that it is anything but a sensible addition to the venerable training tool box.

And of course we can lump bits, whips, spurs, side reins, round pens, horse shoes, saddles with trees, horse blankets, Linda Parelli and all those other things we "abuse" horses with into the same pile as lungeing! LOL!

All tongue in cheek. I am as steadfastly in favor of well informed lungeing as those who've formed an ironclad opinion against it, so...it's an argument we'll never win! LOL! And yet it's stimulating and interesting conversation. Always good to experience both sides of an issue.
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there is always the rebuttal of those who have written it off as abusive, useless, injurious, pointless, boring, the list goes on, and if there is no incentive to actually learn about its correct use (because of foregone conclusions), then it's an open and shut case.
I'm more looking at it as those that are misusing and then vigorously defend their misuse and you can't convince them they needing to look at what they are doing.
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@Golden Horse, this is an argument (lungeing as training tool) we will never win! LOL!
When you are both old and fat, or either of those I guess, it is a valuable tool for so many things. There aren’t a lot of horses at the barn that I can ride, for either or both of the stated reasons, but have been lunging a few all spring, to start getting bodies and minds engaged for riding work after a winter off.
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I'm more looking at it as those that are misusing and then vigorously defend their misuse and you can't convince them they needing to look at what they are doing.
Truth!
Thanks everyone, I'll try to answer all your questions.
I can't do much riding at the moment for personal reasons, but I wanted to do something with her. She's a bit tricky, because I've done a fair it of yielding hindquarters, backing up, etc. but I don't seem to get anything good out of it (Aya is a completely different story - she's always amazing after groundwork and I can always find something that helps her). Any of those sort of things will usually just make Dolly pin her ears and put her in a bad mood. She seems to have very negative associations with yielding hindquarters in particular - I believe her previous owners used it as a punishment, and she hasn't forgotten that.
So my goals in lunging - to do something I hadn't done with her previously; as a thinking exercise on her part; and I guess a bit of physical exercise for her as well.
I was not making her gallop or lope the whole time - mostly walk and trot, with a few canter strides and plenty of directional changes.
I use a rope halter.
She didn't seem unbalanced to me (not saying she wasn't). For a start she was doing very nicely. I've heard that anxious horses will usually look to the outside on a lunge line or in a round pen; I was thinking she might have been concerned about Aya being in another paddock, and possibly wanting to get to the neighbours horses (she's rather attached to them).
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