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...He was very soft on a curb bit with shank. He hates the snaffle and I can tell that he is tuning me out and messing with trying to expel the bit...
You might try riding English with a curb, and western with a snaffle. There is no requirement to ride English with the horse 'on the bit'.

When I swap out my Australian saddle for my English one, Mia looks like this:



I've spent the last few rides trying to get her used to a new bit. In theory, it should be gentler, with more even pressure on the tongue and less likely to 'bite' on the bars...but I'm not sure she is convinced. I raised it up a hole yesterday while loosening the curb strap a hole, and she seemed content the rest of the ride - although a curb bit placed with a wrinkle in her mouth seems a bit odd to me.

She learns new things best if I break everything down into the smallest steps I can. Even a simple bit swap can have her thinking and fussing for a few rides. Sam might find it easier to learn if he takes smaller steps.
 

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That's pretty harsh and dangerously addictive for simply a sore body from posting, I'd save that one for getting run over, or crash landing on a 5' jump :lol:.[/tQUOTE]

You must be younger......posting with an older body DOES feel like getting run over or a crash landing!!! At least it does on mine, LOL!
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I felt the same way yesterday after my lesson. After practicing two-point and posting, I was so sore! My legs, my back, and even my upper body ached. I took an ibuprofen. I came home and decided I definitely understood why horseback riding is considered a sport -- it's hard work!
 

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^^ Don't you want to strangle someone when they say, "But the horse is doing all the work. You're just sitting there!" If a jury of my peers meant fellow-riders, I think I'd go free...
 

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Don't be too hard on yourself: post one or two time then sit, then 3 -4 then sit, then ... if you get tired and sore I'm afraid it will be worse. And don't be shy, put your hand on your horse neck or hang the main to help or take a break.

And when you are ready for more, try without the stirrups o:

good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter #26
Don't be too hard on yourself: post one or two time then sit, then 3 -4 then sit, then ... if you get tired and sore I'm afraid it will be worse. And don't be shy, put your hand on your horse neck or hang the main to help or take a break.

And when you are ready for more, try without the stirrups o:

good luck!
Can I double like something?


HAHAHAHAHA ARE YOu kIDDINg ME!!! don't be shy?! As I am flailing about i am grabbing mane, neck, saddle, to keep from pitching over the horse's ears.

hahahaah - oh i have tears. I swear. i was in jumpers pose hanging on for a simple slow trot on a flat straight away.

hehahahaha. Nope. I'm not shy. not at all.

thanks! that was dang funny.

In seriousness though, I do think I should try without stirrups, since my legs are flopping so bad and slipping in the stirrups.

I asked my instructor yesterday if it was possible I had stretched my new leathers already. she ignored me and told me to regroup. and TROT!

hehehehe
 

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Im gonna say it a third time....get somebody to take your horse on the longe line so you can learn and get the feel for it without falling on his back, bumping him with your legs and be a general disturbance to him. Sounds mean? I know....;-)
 

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Discussion Starter #28
thank you for repeating yourself a third time. I can only do what my instructor is going to provide and work with what is available to me. I can stop taking lessons altogether, but finding another instructor is not an option.
 

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Didn't mean to step on your toes, sorry AQHSam. But it really is the easiest way to get the hang of it. Can you ask your instructor if it could be done instead of a lesson? Im surprised he/she never mentioned it( maybe I'm too Old World, we did 5-10 longe lessons before being left "alone"). Or ask a friend to help out. 20-30 minutes is all you need, longer and you'd seriously consider Mr. Daniels again....
 

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No offense taken DesertHorseWoman. I know how frustrating it is to see the solution so obviously and provide advice through experience and have it ignored. Incidentally, I didn't ignore it, just didn't know how to execute it. I still don't but it can't hurt to ask. My next lesson is in a week.

I don't know my instructor's take on lunge line training. Maybe she does it for younger kids. personally, the thought of it makes me a little quesy. I don't really like trotting in circles for long periods of time. I never feel fully on balance.

our last barn was an indoor round pen and one thing my instructor mentioned is sam doesn't stand up into the corners and turns, which is one reason I lose balance and momentum on the turns. She has a full size indoor arena and outdoor dressage ring. we now have plenty of "straight" and less "turn."

I don't even know how Sam will react to a lunge line and rider and from other forum postings, i don't believe he knows how to lunge. mainly I just made him trot in a circle and halt on a lunge line. Not do any fancy things.

One reason I think we are having issues is him and the single joint snaffle bit. He is not working at all like a broke horse. I bought a new bit this morning; I went with an eggbutt french link.

If I can keep him from throwing hissy fits while he is working I am sure I can execute this. I pulled the single joint snaffle off his bridle this morning and it has teeth mark divots. Not just scrapes. actually divots. He wore that bit 2 times.

what a booger.
 

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Does Sam tip his nose out in turns?

Something I like to do with my horses is set up a long isosceles triangle of cones. We'll do figure 8s, but I can vary between the cones close together and the one far away. I can go inside or outside, and vary left or right turn, and no more than 2 turns before we do a 'straight'.

In fact, I switched Trooper from bitless to bit, just so I could tip his nose to the inside of the turn.

If he doesn't tip his nose to the outside, the triangle of cones still gives lots of work mixing up turns and straights, and the horse can't anticipate because I don't decide which side of the cone we will go around until we're almost there.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
Does Sam tip his nose out in turns?

Something I like to do with my horses is set up a long isosceles triangle of cones. We'll do figure 8s, but I can vary between the cones close together and the one far away. I can go inside or outside, and vary left or right turn, and no more than 2 turns before we do a 'straight'.

In fact, I switched Trooper from bitless to bit, just so I could tip his nose to the inside of the turn.

If he doesn't tip his nose to the outside, the triangle of cones still gives lots of work mixing up turns and straights, and the horse can't anticipate because I don't decide which side of the cone we will go around until we're almost there.

To the inside, to the outside. Pointing up to the sky.

This last lesson, he tipped his nose to the inside during the turns and straightaways. But, again, bit action. He found a way to grab the bit with a tilted head and that in itself was a problem.

he doesn't take the corners like a "L" they are more like a "C" he is more comfortable going at a known turn with an arc.

I'm going to try the french link tomorrow. I have purchased a used solid kimberwick from a forum member; waiting for that to arrive.

Right now, I am almost inclined to say before I can / should work on posting I need to work on his bit issues. until he accepts the bit in his mouth without throwing a tantrum neither of us can learn anything.
 

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No offense taken DesertHorseWoman. I know how frustrating it is to see the solution so obviously and provide advice through experience and have it ignored. Incidentally, I didn't ignore it, just didn't know how to execute it. I still don't but it can't hurt to ask. My next lesson is in a week.

I don't know my instructor's take on lunge line training. Maybe she does it for younger kids. personally, the thought of it makes me a little quesy. I don't really like trotting in circles for long periods of time. I never feel fully on balance.

our last barn was an indoor round pen and one thing my instructor mentioned is sam doesn't stand up into the corners and turns, which is one reason I lose balance and momentum on the turns. She has a full size indoor arena and outdoor dressage ring. we now have plenty of "straight" and less "turn."

I don't even know how Sam will react to a lunge line and rider and from other forum postings, i don't believe he knows how to lunge. mainly I just made him trot in a circle and halt on a lunge line. Not do any fancy things.

One reason I think we are having issues is him and the single joint snaffle bit. He is not working at all like a broke horse. I bought a new bit this morning; I went with an eggbutt french link.

If I can keep him from throwing hissy fits while he is working I am sure I can execute this. I pulled the single joint snaffle off his bridle this morning and it has teeth mark divots. Not just scrapes. actually divots. He wore that bit 2 times.

what a booger.
There's the problem. You're working on three things at once. A new riding style for both of you, Sam's bitting problems and your posting. This is why I think starting in making you more secure in mastering the posting( finding rhythm and balance) first will help you help him with his bit problem. Right now nothing goes right, from what I gather from your description.
Lots of people think longe line is only for beginners. Not so. Whenever there's a seat problem, or to find the feel for something, it will help. Because you can concentrate on the problem without having to worry about what the horse does or where he goes. Longing can be done in a halter only. You can also do it with a new bit for trying out, keeping the longe attached to the halter under/over the bridle. If he halts and trots on the longe, that's fine. It's all you need. Take a rope or stirrupleather and put it around his neck, fairly loose, and use it to balance and as " reins", if you need it. You can also practice stirrup-less on the longe. It's all about learning without disturbing the horse.
And rest assured.....when I switched from English to western I felt like a complete beginner....no contact was the worst feeling ever, and everything was completely vice versa. Horrible.....;-)
 

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Discussion Starter #34
Today's posting recap

French-link eggbutt snaffle: check. and a much bigger hit with Sam than the single joint snaffe. He still gnawed on it, but without as much passion and while still listening to me. what I learned; it has very little whoa. Our whoa this morning was more like a wwwhhhhOOOOAAAAAA Dammit! :lol:

It didn't help that it was cooler out this morning and he hasn't been worked since last Thursday. Plus, the BO is giving him grain. Tomorrow, I will talk to her and ask her to stop with the grain. 1 cup every once in a while as a treat is okay, but twice a day feedings is making him uber hot. He is an easy keeper and doesn't need the grain on top of his long stem, grazing, and the timothy pellets. Plus I give him EPlus.

I think once I get him off the "kit kats" he should respond even better.

I am pretty sure I posted at least 1 and 1/2 rotations around the dressage ring today. At least, it felt smooth. I may not have looked graceful, but I do believe it was posting. I wasn't doing that funky two-smack on the down beat and I had very good balance; not once did I need to touch his neck for balance. He also had a really good pace and didn't fall into the corners.

That was the longest I held it, and I think I lost it because I started to get fatigued.

I'm going to go back through this thread and my other thread and read the advice about body position and weighting again.

We only rode for about 30 minutes. I could tell I was tired and giving him poor cues. Sam barely broke a sweat under his blanket and none at all on his neck r sternum. Which also tells me that he must be getting in better shape. Those first few lessons turned him into a drippy sweaty mess.

Besides Sam, there are 4 other boarders, but they don't seem to hang out at the barn except on their lesson days. Or, they go to the barn during the day when I am at work. Our paths only cross on the days when they are finishing up a lesson and I am arriving after work. It would be nice to work with another rider and her horse.

I am hoping to get moved into a group lesson once Sam and I can work equally with other riders. Right now we need to much one on one.
 
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