I need as much advice on creep feeding as possible. What age, what feed, how much and how ??? Thank you.
benson2008
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Creep Feeding
I fed my own sweet feed...it was near Purina.
Most foals were eating good at one week.
I feed free choice for about a year.
Most foals were eating good at one week.
I feed free choice for about a year.
What is the point of feeding sweet feed to a foal so young? And free choice at that. IMO, a foal only needs access to quality hay, water, and minerals.
The easiest way is to find a small "creep feeder" tub at the feed store. Just hang it near where you feed the mare, down low enough for baby to reach. Put some of the mares feed in the little feeder for the baby to try. They are very inquisitive and will soon be poking their nose in and nibbling away. They have adjustable spacers to make room for baby's nose but not moms. 
I've already seen him poking in his mothers feed, can he eat what she eats or is it better to get his own feed? Also can i feed him when i feed her or does he have to have it down all the time?
My mares and foals were in a big box stall.
I set a post in a back coner about three foot from one wall and four foot from the back wall.
Then I nailed boards so the foal could get under the far end.....two boards on the long end.
Feed tub hung in the coner.
I loved it because most foals learned to lay in there.
It was always clean and had dry saw dust.
Of course, they got out to exercise twice a day.
I set a post in a back coner about three foot from one wall and four foot from the back wall.
Then I nailed boards so the foal could get under the far end.....two boards on the long end.
Feed tub hung in the coner.
I loved it because most foals learned to lay in there.
It was always clean and had dry saw dust.
Of course, they got out to exercise twice a day.
Ripper's comment about QH cross foals made me want to post about my own observations.
I had read that foals are the only horses you can feed free-choice grain. They don't over eat on it like every other horse will.
I have raised a grand total of one foal, but I tell you what, I think nutrition is a BIG part of raising a foal to it's fullest potential.
My mare is a 15.1 Missouri Fox Trotter. She came pregnant by a QH stallion whom I've met and was very average in size and height. Probably in the 15.1 range, certainly not huge or tall.
I was very anal about feeding the mare when pregnant and then creep feeding the foal (Purina Ultium Growth) and now my "foal" is now 15.2 at 21 months of age. The string test puts him at 16.1 at maturity. He's taller than his mom, my Mustang gelding and his sire already.
I don't know where the "tall" came from but I am guessing it is because it is in his genetic make up somewhere and it is coming out due to optimal nutrition. He's stocky and muscular too, even though he was gelded at 5 months.
I know it is not good to push growth on a horse. And I haven't been trying to do that. He only gets about 1 lbs of grain a day, and ample high quality hay. Either alfalfa/grass mix or alfalfa. And a vitamin/mineral supplement. And everyone is impressed with not only his height but substance.
When I had the vet out a couple months back he asked me if I had been riding him yet and I had to remind the vet he wasn't even two yet!
I know another lady who raises registered Paints and her foals are narrow and undermuscled and not as tall as my QH/Fox Trotter cross. She doesn't have the money to feed them optimally and it shows in their lack of sized and muscle. :-(
Here is my baby at 20 months. And keep in mind he is only half QH.
I had read that foals are the only horses you can feed free-choice grain. They don't over eat on it like every other horse will.
I have raised a grand total of one foal, but I tell you what, I think nutrition is a BIG part of raising a foal to it's fullest potential.
My mare is a 15.1 Missouri Fox Trotter. She came pregnant by a QH stallion whom I've met and was very average in size and height. Probably in the 15.1 range, certainly not huge or tall.
I was very anal about feeding the mare when pregnant and then creep feeding the foal (Purina Ultium Growth) and now my "foal" is now 15.2 at 21 months of age. The string test puts him at 16.1 at maturity. He's taller than his mom, my Mustang gelding and his sire already.
I don't know where the "tall" came from but I am guessing it is because it is in his genetic make up somewhere and it is coming out due to optimal nutrition. He's stocky and muscular too, even though he was gelded at 5 months.
I know it is not good to push growth on a horse. And I haven't been trying to do that. He only gets about 1 lbs of grain a day, and ample high quality hay. Either alfalfa/grass mix or alfalfa. And a vitamin/mineral supplement. And everyone is impressed with not only his height but substance.
When I had the vet out a couple months back he asked me if I had been riding him yet and I had to remind the vet he wasn't even two yet!
I know another lady who raises registered Paints and her foals are narrow and undermuscled and not as tall as my QH/Fox Trotter cross. She doesn't have the money to feed them optimally and it shows in their lack of sized and muscle. :-(
Here is my baby at 20 months. And keep in mind he is only half QH.
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In feeding you have to address the market.
Well developed young hores sell and sell for good money.
Oh...you will be keeping the foal???
Why do you not want a foal to develop to its full potential???
Well developed young hores sell and sell for good money.
Oh...you will be keeping the foal???
Why do you not want a foal to develop to its full potential???
Isn't there some sort of disease or condition a foal can get if given too much proteins & starch (epigi...something like that), where their joints swell up? I thought years back, it was shown overfeeding foals grain was the cause so creep feeding ceased? Just seems to me I read this somewhere....I could be wrong.
Ofergawdsake Ripper. There are more ways to do things than just yours ... or Hank's.
It's ok for people to disagree with you.
imo
I do like to creep feed, but acknowledge that it isn't the only way to raise a foal.
It's ok for people to disagree with you.
imo
I do like to creep feed, but acknowledge that it isn't the only way to raise a foal.
A horse's intestines evolved to process grasses, hays, twigs, and even some bark. It has never been designed to process high levels of sugars and starches and many of the grains that are included in a sweet feed.
Just because it was common practice 20 years ago when you were breeding halter horses to coop a foal up in a stall for ~20 hours a day and stuff their gut full of sugars and starches and anything else that worked to make them grow faster and look more "mature" by the time they were a yearling doesn't mean that it was healthy or safe for them.
OP, if you want to creep feed the foal, then just give the mare plenty of hay at a level where the foal can get his/her head in too. If the mare or foal seem to need something more, then I would add something that was actually nutritionally designed for lactating mares and/or foals.
Just because it was common practice 20 years ago when you were breeding halter horses to coop a foal up in a stall for ~20 hours a day and stuff their gut full of sugars and starches and anything else that worked to make them grow faster and look more "mature" by the time they were a yearling doesn't mean that it was healthy or safe for them.
OP, if you want to creep feed the foal, then just give the mare plenty of hay at a level where the foal can get his/her head in too. If the mare or foal seem to need something more, then I would add something that was actually nutritionally designed for lactating mares and/or foals.
I have researched physitis (epiphysitis) a bit because I was raising my first foal and was worried about it. From what I have read, the modern thought is that it is due to the wrong balance of nutrients more than too many nutrients. Yes, you definitely don't want them overweight, but from what I have read a foal is more likely to get physitis from the wrong balance of nutrients rather than just too many calories.
The lady I know who raises Paints has had problems with physitis in her colt who is just slightly older than mine even though he is on the lean side. She cut back to feeding him only grass hay and more exercise and seems to have it under control. I still think it's because he is lacking something in his diet rather than getting too much feed. Like I said, the colt is lean.
This is my gelding from today (better picture than earlier). He was born with a deformed cannon bone on one leg but all this time he has never had physitis problems (knock on wood).
I honestly think it's the good hay, small amounts of Purina Ultium and a vitamin/mineral supplement (because I don't feed him the amount of Ultium they recommend on the bag).
At the very very least, I think a foal should have the best hay available and a vitamin/mineral supplement.
This is his natural shine on his summer coat coming in. No fat supplements and no Show Sheen. :lol:
The lady I know who raises Paints has had problems with physitis in her colt who is just slightly older than mine even though he is on the lean side. She cut back to feeding him only grass hay and more exercise and seems to have it under control. I still think it's because he is lacking something in his diet rather than getting too much feed. Like I said, the colt is lean.
This is my gelding from today (better picture than earlier). He was born with a deformed cannon bone on one leg but all this time he has never had physitis problems (knock on wood).
I honestly think it's the good hay, small amounts of Purina Ultium and a vitamin/mineral supplement (because I don't feed him the amount of Ultium they recommend on the bag).
At the very very least, I think a foal should have the best hay available and a vitamin/mineral supplement.
This is his natural shine on his summer coat coming in. No fat supplements and no Show Sheen. :lol:
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It was the Hancock bloodline that had Percheron:
*Hancock Horses .com**|**ARTICLES**|**Franklin Reynolds Tells... the Joe Hancock Story**|**September 1957 QH Journal
Actually, I think that's a great contribution to the breed. I wish more modern Quarter Horses had good bones and feet like the photos of Joe Hancock.
That's what I love about my BLM Mustang. He looks like he has just a touch of draft in him.
See that's where crossing can be good. Sometimes it brings positive attributes and vigor to the genetics.
And I would assume all the breeders who keep bringing Thoroughbred into the QH feel they are improving the breed. Right? Although I personally would rather own a solid ranch horse that something with a high percentage of Thoroughbred blood. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
*Hancock Horses .com**|**ARTICLES**|**Franklin Reynolds Tells... the Joe Hancock Story**|**September 1957 QH Journal
Actually, I think that's a great contribution to the breed. I wish more modern Quarter Horses had good bones and feet like the photos of Joe Hancock.
That's what I love about my BLM Mustang. He looks like he has just a touch of draft in him.
See that's where crossing can be good. Sometimes it brings positive attributes and vigor to the genetics.
And I would assume all the breeders who keep bringing Thoroughbred into the QH feel they are improving the breed. Right? Although I personally would rather own a solid ranch horse that something with a high percentage of Thoroughbred blood. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
The registry didn't close the outcroppings until a few years ago I believe... They mainly use the TB bloodlines for the english horses or the speed horses - they are appendix. The true blood western horses are very much bred in line with each other, and then the foundation quarters are another matter completely.
I also don't recommend feeding Sweet feed to youngsters.They are at higher risk for developing epiphisitis/DOD. There is much healthier/safer feeds out there!! FS895 Sweet feed is kinda a catch all phrase as there is different quality/types of sweet feeds. It is the Molasses in many of these mixes that is most harmful.Sweet Feed for Horses
FS895 Sweet feed is kinda a catch all phrase as there is different quality/types of sweet feeds. It is the Molasses in many of these mixes that is most harmful.Sweet Feed for Horses
75% in agreement.I also don't recommend feeding Sweet feed to youngsters.They are at higher risk for developing epiphisitis/DOD. There is much healthier/safer feeds out there!!
I have my own blend......and it is a cut back on the "sweet" in sweet feed.
I guess in today's world it would be sweet feed lite......
There is nothing wrong with getting info from the "old boys". The problem comes when people become barnacles. They cling to what they know, and refuse to even hold the notion that something new could be better.
There is plenty of scientific evidence to prove that sweet feed does very little positive for horses. If you are so wary of science, perhaps the internet is not the place for you...
There is plenty of scientific evidence to prove that sweet feed does very little positive for horses. If you are so wary of science, perhaps the internet is not the place for you...
Holy Smokes, this thread went from "creeping feeding foals" to Quarter Horse breeding icons like Hank Wiescamp.
Having bred my QH mare 3 times I never felt it necessary to provide a creep feeding set-up for any of her 3 foals. They all fed from her grain tub feeding we gave them 3 times daily. We increased my mare's feed ration to a third more at each graining to allow for her babies share of her ration. Plus all the top quality Bermuda Grass Hay they could eat 24/7. Never once fed any of my horses Alfalfa or a Timothy/Alfalfa mix.
There are QH bloodlines that stretch back to the Steel Dust horses, also Hancock, Poco Bueno, etc.. These bloodlines include Skipper W, Leo, Go Man Go and many other foundation bloodlines. The most prevalant TB bloodline in the present day QH is Three Bars, but I have traced my own registered QH mare back to Man O War on her topside.
Having bred my QH mare 3 times I never felt it necessary to provide a creep feeding set-up for any of her 3 foals. They all fed from her grain tub feeding we gave them 3 times daily. We increased my mare's feed ration to a third more at each graining to allow for her babies share of her ration. Plus all the top quality Bermuda Grass Hay they could eat 24/7. Never once fed any of my horses Alfalfa or a Timothy/Alfalfa mix.
There are QH bloodlines that stretch back to the Steel Dust horses, also Hancock, Poco Bueno, etc.. These bloodlines include Skipper W, Leo, Go Man Go and many other foundation bloodlines. The most prevalant TB bloodline in the present day QH is Three Bars, but I have traced my own registered QH mare back to Man O War on her topside.
So it's safe to assume that your knowledge is from that era. No one is saying that it is wrong to know about how it was done back before we knew what we do now. I bet you looked back at horse breeders 40 years before your time and shook your head too.
What gets me is that you claim that this regimen produces "champion" horses. What you fail to mention is that they are champion halter horses, not performance horses, not work horses.....halter horses. Horses who's sole purpose in life is to stand in a stall 20 hours a day and put on as much bulk as they possibly can so that they can look like the Schwarzenegger of horses.
You point out one of your foals that grew up on your regimen that went on to have a long, sound, healthy, and successful life doing something more than being led around an arena or being retired at the age of 4-5 to do nothing but pop out more foals and I might consider changing my tune.
You point out one of your foals that grew up on your regimen that went on to have a long, sound, healthy, and successful life doing something more than being led around an arena or being retired at the age of 4-5 to do nothing but pop out more foals and I might consider changing my tune.
(I don't believe I'm about to defend Ripper. lol.)
Actually, Ripper has consistantly said that raising halter horses 30-something years ago is where her knowledge comes from. She has never (that I have seen) claimed to have bred, raised, or trained riding horses.
Actually, Ripper has consistantly said that raising halter horses 30-something years ago is where her knowledge comes from. She has never (that I have seen) claimed to have bred, raised, or trained riding horses.
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