This makes me sick to my stomach.

 

Well let me just offer a story.

There was a family who boarded at the same barn as us they knew nothing about horses and were lucky enough to have a saint of a gelding who would just plod along at a walk and never go any faster for fear of hurting them. One day they got the brilliant idea to beat him bloody with a whip. I came out to the barn, saw them riding and yanking on his mouth (which was now bloody), beating him with a whip until he bled and kicking him with spurs.

I snapped. I pulled the kid off of him and took that whip and beat them until I'm pretty sure their behind was raw and welted up. In fact they went off wailing and never came back and the horse got a lovely home. If there's one thing I don't tolerate it's abuse.

I remember getting together with some farmers who had a neighbor who was starving his horses, they went in with shotguns and took the horses, the guys fridge and all food in his home and told him if they ever saw him with an animal he'd be shot. That's just the culture I grew up in. Knowing me I would probably go and beat the holy crap out of all of them (probably get whooped too) but I would also take action later, then again I don't trust action later, I've had bad experiences with that.

Personally I would have whooped them (I say that as a 5"8 250lb meaner than a snake woman :lol. I think people worry too much about how it will look sometimes instead of doing what's right. I would have actually liked him if he had done something like that; not hated him as I do now.

*Poor thing! That's no fun! I hope you feel better!

 

I may only be five foot one and a total of 108 pounds but if I saw this I would be right in there with Incitatus whooping some butt...

 

That's how they train horses in some countries.

Part of why Monty Roberts goes to these places is to learn their ways and to help them change (obviously to change to his methods).

 

That is very, very old school horse breaking. If you ever thought we haven't advanced in our horse handling skills that video proves we (well some of us) have. I lost a lot of respect for Monty Roberts. There is an element where you can't go in and shout them down without risk to yourself. You can walk away. Mr. Roberts should have walked away. You don't have get into a fight (and possibly be seriously injured) but you don't condone that behavior by passively watching. Once you leave you either try to forget it or you call the humane society/authorities. It is not like these folks are meeting force with force. They are just taking force to a a horse.

 

Once you leave you either try to forget it or you call the humane society/authorities.

Having lived in many different countries, I can tell you that this would be a joke in many. In many places there is no protection for women and children of violence much less animals.

You can not go in as a foreigner and change their ways of doing things by walking away or threatening to call the cops on them. However, you may change it, to some extent, by showing them a better way if you get better results. But animals are looked at very differently some places than others. I bet you go back not too far in the USA and this was pretty common..

 

What this looks like to me is people enjoying abuse. When the horse starts to walk in a nice circle they yank his head. When he falls they all whoop. This is sick. Then they tie the horse so he cant move and smack him. They hit him with the saddle blanket and the rope at the same time. An attempt at desensatization? I think not. Along with much more awful things. If I were there I would have walked in there tried to keep my calm probably end up yelling buy the horse get out of there and report them.

 

I better never see anything like this in person, cause I'd probably end up in jail for what I'd do to the abusers. Horses have no voice, we have to be the ones to speak and stand up for them. Not doing anything makes you as bad as the abuser.

 

I've witnessed it all the time. It's so rampant in the pleasure horse industry, there's really no point in making enemies with a lot of people. You have to pay $250 deposit to submit a report to the association at a show, and you only get that money back if the investigation finds anything. In the mean time, I've heard of people getting their tires slashed, horses getting their tails cut off, or drugs put in their water at shows for reporting someone.

The one time I said anything was when a lady I worked for tied her weanling up to the barn and beat it with a whip. All I got was fired from my job and she's probably still doing it.

The best I do is lead by example because that's really all you can control.

 

I think fear of retaliation is very real, very scary, and very valid concern.
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I think he, or I, should/would have politely interjected, especially if there were there to adopt him methods in the first place. When they were whipping him forward and yanking him around he could of said "your confusing him. Let me show you something he will understand". If they don't want the advice it's time to walk away. B
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I have a question: Who is Monty Roberts?

 

I see Old School Breaking not New School Gentling going on here. Poor horse appears to be wild as a March Hare and never handled, so very frightened and confused. This looks like Spain or Mexico, there was nothing Monty Roberts could have done, other than to show them his way of doing things. Most countries are not as considerate of animals as we tend to be nowadays. They're property and you don't interfere with another man's property is the way of thinking.

 

It doesn't look like Spain or Mexico at all. They're speaking Portuguese. It's Brazil.
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Monty Roberts is a well known horse training activist. If you watch his videos, it is all about finding gentler ways of training horses.

There is a very well regarded University that teaches animal science. The "trainers" there are terrible, yet people pay $2-3 thousand for horses trained by the students. I can guarantee those horses that leave the program are hell to shoe or trim.

They are not as bad as that video, but they are a bunch of cowboys who use force to train. They teach the students to use force. It is terrible. I took the weanling training class and refused to take any more classes. My assigned "baby" loaded right in the trailer the first time, but was scared to step down. They took a whip to her.

I taught her to stand for trimming, they decided to separate her from all her buddies, in a strange barn and trim her alone. When she didn't stand they beat on her. They would take a rasp to the horses legs if it wouldn't hold it's leg up. She trusted me completely but every time she saw my instructor she tried to bite him.

They took in a scared untrained mare, and tried to trim her feet, and beat on her with the rasp when she wouldn't stand still. Of course she won't stand still when she has never been trained (or handled)!

Sadly abuse is very common in this country and there is not a thing you can do about it. The police can't do anything unless you get it on tape and even then I doubt it is easy to get a conviction. I can't even get them to do anything about starvation cases so how would I get them to enforce an abuse case?:-x

If you live in certain areas you may have better luck. The most you can do is get it on video, hand it over to the media, and get them on the news.

 

While I don't agree with standing around, I recall something about Monty Roberts traveling to film/witness cruel and outdated practices in other countries both to raise awareness and to attempt to change the methods used (through demonstration?).

I don't know how he can bear to watch this, but if you look at around 6:30 in the video both Monty Roberts and the man next to him have very fixed, stiff expressions on their faces. They both look like they are clenching their jaws and there is a marked tautness around their eyes. I'm willing to bet that they were absolutely livid. If they do attempt to educate the people, they were probably holding it in in an attempt to build rapport with them and succeed in getting them to change their practices.

That said, I really hope that poor little horse found a better situation.

 

That poor horse. The look in his eyes makes me want to cry.
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There is a trainer I know with methods I would consider abusive at times. The majority of the time I see her ride she is not getting after the horses, though they have a very concerned manner of going when she is on their backs. Then, if the horse misbehaves, all heck breaks loose. Lots of yelling, lots of whipping because they did not respond exactly as she saw fit. I don't have a problem at all with people getting after horses when necessary, and I understand that some folks may have firmer methods than I. I still consider her methods of "discipline" to be abusive.

However, she's a VERY well recognized and respected trainer in her area. Ladies who wouldn't lay a hand on their "precious baby" as it ran them over like a bulldozer will stand in awe as she smacks the crud out of their "precious baby". I spent lots of time there growing up, and I was able to recognize that there wasn't something right about this when I was an early teenager. Some worship the ground on which she walks. No way would I ever have a horse in training with her. There were two arenas (covered and non), as well as a pasture to ride in, so I generally tried to avoid riding in the same arena as her. I tend to try and avoid riding in the arena with someone anyway, but if she was having one of her "blow ups" then she would completely disregard any other riders in the arena in favor of disciplining the horse. Personally, I didn't really feel like having to get out of the way to avoid getting run over because someone's horse was being somewhat finicky that day.

What would happen if I had tried to do something about it? First, I would have had to find a new boarding barn. The options around here are slim to none as far as decent barns go especially for the level of care the horses receive, and I likely wouldn't have been able to continue with my trainer. For a period of time I would have been out of a job. Assuming I had called animal control and they thought the concern was worth investigating they would have showed up to find a barn full of well fed and watered, well cared for horses with all of their needs met. Had she been riding a horse at that given moment chances were that it would be behaving perfectly well and the ride would be uneventful.

What could I do? Either struggle to find another barn that my trainer would travel to so that I could continue my training with my horse. I could call some sort of authority, nothing would come of it, and if she found out who called then I would be in the same position. The best I could do at the time was to keep her off of my horse and avoid riding in the arena with her. So that's what I did.

It's not always cut and dry.

 

After reading the comments I dont even want to watch it. I started to, but lasted 5 seconds and chickened out. I hate seeing people abusing horses (or people for that matter!), whether its from ignorance or deliberately. Just breaks my heart.

 

My point was more that if they are willing to go after this horse, do you really think that if you went in to "correct them" they would not go after you? Particularly as a woman. If a woman went up and tried to "correct them" than she would be in serious trouble. However, it would be easier to walk away. If you want to report the situation do it from a safe area away from that person. I have seen a trainer beat the tar out of a stable hand for smacking an unruly stallion, so yeah people are crazy. If someone is going after a horse, they can transfer that aggression to you if you interrupt.

The video only captures what happened during the "training" not what happened after. It is possible that MR tried to explain how he would have handled it differently. I think there is a benefit of learning by example. I think MR would have a better run of things if he had shown them some of the join up stuff that made him famous. Watching a horse get beat is just discouraging and gives the impression that you condone the behavior.

 

I had to stop watching....the immediate anger I felt for those who proclaim themselves cowboys is sickening at best. To kick, slap, hit, bloody, etc. a living, sensitive, sentient being such as a horse does something to me that I wouldn't of been able to hold my tongue...and if I was there and MR was standing there "watching" how they break horses, I would of been up close and in his face asking why he wasn't stepping in to show a better way.

They broke that horse, literally. Look at it's expression and eyes, nothing....mouth bloody. I told my husband I wanted to go jerk the feet out from under those people laughing, especially those in the ring and kick them in the junk over and over, all the time yelling get up, move, what's wrong, can't take it but you can dish it out?!?! I see things like this and it makes me hate the human race just a little bit more...

 

The only way to change abuse is gather information to use against the abusers. I have thought about monitoring procedures at domestic slaughter houses. I would probably have to have counseling after observing, but as bad as it would be, to gather evidence for a solid case against abuse and to change laws would justify seemingly passive observance. Get the evidence, then make a change. :-x MR has always seemed like a compassionate activist for equine welfare. He may have some skeletons in his closet, but I don't know many people who don't. Human beings can become brutal beasts if not governed by laws.

 

With help from Google Translate, this is an article before the show (I think):

"30th National Exhibition of Mangalarga Marchador

Opens on Wednesday, July 13th , the 30th National Exhibition of Mangalarga Machador . In planning for the traditional event , functional tests , hippotherapy , sports and family events running . Auctions , awards , malls animals , lectures and tours are also included among the attractions of this edition of the National Exhibition of Mangalarga Marchador .

Although the schedule includes several activities , the main attraction of the 30th edition of the event are concerts by Monty Roberts , also known as " The Horse Whisperer " . The Californian Roberts makes the technical success ( Join- up or rational doma ) that developed to deal with Wild Mustangs . The practice of taming avoids the use of any violent act .

Monty Roberts is currently responsible for taming the horses of the Queen of England. Also author, Enchanting Cavlos had his book for 58 weeks in the top sellers, according to the classification of The New York Times , The publication has also been translated into over 15 languages ​​and had about 6 million copies sold .

The figure of Monty Roberts inspired the creation of the blockbuster " The Horse Whisperer " with Robert Redford , and other 50 documentaries and TV specials . More than 2 million people around the world have witnessed the presentation of Monty Roberts . Now came the turn of the beautiful - horizontinos !

On Saturday, July 16 , the Horse Whisperer marks the official opening ceremony of the 30th National Show Horse Marchador . The show is scheduled for 15h . Whoever loses , you can still watch the presentation on Sunday 17th at 14.30 ( sold out ) and on Monday , 18 , at 16h ( £ 200 a ticket) .

Alameda Nuclei

The 30th National Exhibition Mangalarga has space for socialization and socializing creators of several states . Nuclei in Alameda , breeders have the opportunity to meet and know more about the conditions for creation of races in other states . The activities that take place in space are open to the public and interested in knowing more about the subject are welcome ! The programming of Alameda Nuclei tradicinais has theme nights , plus gastronomic cultural events and good music ."

I doubt Monty Roberts had any say in what went on. I'm not a Monty Roberts follower, but he doesn't look happy about what he is seeing. He may have been given a chance to show a different approach later on. Or not.

It isn't exactly old school breaking. Many horses were broken like this in the old days because horses were tools, and someone breaking a horse for a ranch might get 3 rides a horse on 50 horses to 'break them'. But old time horsemen also knew it wasn't a good way, and those with the money to spend on their own mounts would take the time to do it right.

Nor is this all gone in the USA. This is a picture of Trooper a few weeks after we got him. He was raised and ridden on a ranch in Utah owned by a friend, and they loaned him to a ranch in Colorado for a couple of months. He was returned with bloody holes in his sides. You can still see how much he was raked with spurs by an American cowboy. And yes, my friend was furious when he saw what had been done. Brushing Trooper off yesterday, after nearly 6 years, he still has scars on his sides:

I don't think there was anything Roberts could have done. Maybe he spoke to the organizers later, but I doubt it would have done any good. I spent some time in Afghanistan. One time, there was a big protest held outside the gates of the FOB. The NY Times reported the protestors were objecting to GW Bush's policies. What they were really protesting was for the right to kill their women if their women offended them. They were upset because the US was trying to arrange for safe treatment of a teen girl injured in a firefight who had been treated by Muslim doctors - but without a male family member standing by. The Afghans had promised to kill her when she got out of the hospital. In the end, the province governor - a brutal and ruthless man, but honest - agreed to provide the girl protection.

I'm sure the guys working that horse did not believe they were doing anything wrong. Someone running in and trying to force them to do something would have been whipped worse than the horse. The video was painful to watch, but I won't blame Roberts for it. There was nothing he could have done to stop it. With luck, the "concert" he gave later might have changed a few hearts and minds.

 

I watched part of the video. Those morons will get killed sooner or later handling a frightened animal that way. They are accomplishing nothing except ruining a perfectly good horse.

 

I am neutral on whether MR should have stepped in. Should he have? Yes, absolutely from our point of view because we know better. But there has to be a time and a place.If these people dont want to listen then ultimately he isn't going to accomplish much by asserting himself.

These "horse trainers" just make me shake my head. Notice how big and tough and brave they are smacking that horse with a rope but see how quick they are to jump when the horse hops or kicks up.

It takes a small man to go out and provoke a lion with a stick but you're in a whole 'nother ball park when the lion wakes up
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I want to strip both of these men, make them walk in a round pen naked and then take a rope with a tie and whip them. I could not watch the whole thing, it was sickening. Que locos! Or maybe I'd just take a knife and rip their tendons on both arms, so they can't use them again without a major reduction. Watching this video made me just that mad.

 

MR could have been very dead had he tried to interfere. That is a very macho culture and men like that CAN become pretty violent when "interfered with", as they would see it. Better to lead by example.